Case prep

[KABOOM]

Do you gents bother to clean primer pockets? To date I don't bother, the cleaning I do is done while in the tumbler. I have read some on this topic and the general rule is either  yes it matters for best results or don't bother it wastes time and energy.

[maximus otter]

l do, with a simple hand tool; large primer size at one end, small at the other.

Obvious products of combustion remain in the pocket after firing; and it’s quicker than visually inspecting cases after tumbling, then having to clear tumbling media from the flash hole of 80% of the cleaned cases.

l’ve just started to experiment with the memsahib’s ultrasonic cleaner. This may be the ultimate solution.

maximus otter

 

[Miseryguts]

Ultrasonic cleaner does inside of case and primer pocket - low power jewellery type are useless, so get decent power. I still tumble for a short time in fine media to get a nice bright shine - I know it is just cosmetic, but that is the way I am

M in sunny sunny monmouthshire

[Popsbengo]

I de-cap, ultrasonic, rinse and dry, tumble in walnut media (with a tiny amount of jeweller's rouge) and inspect my shiny and clean cases.  The primer pockets are spotless.  Possibly some wasted time here but it's my time to waste and I like the results.  I have reloaded .308 Lapua cases 12 times (to date) and the primer is still snug enough.

As our Welsh weather man, MG, says (😁);  a decent sized ultrasonic is necessary to get the best.  One tip is don't clean longer than needed, it does put a micro texture on the brass eventually (tumbling helps to remove that).

[Brillo]

3 hours ago, KABOOM said:

Do you gents bother to clean primer pockets? To date I don't bother, the cleaning I do is done while in the tumbler. I have read some on this topic and the general rule is either  yes it matters for best results or don't bother it wastes time and energy.

What is primer pocket cleaning? 😁

[No i deer]

The best way has to be with a primer pocket uniformer and it also keeps the primer seated at the proper depth as they get shallower every firing..

They may take out brass up to 10 firings until they've finished stretching and mainly take of the carbon.

 

Being seated to the right depth may also stop any piercing of the primers and any high primers that's proud of the case base

[One on top of two]

When I buy new brass , I uniform the primer pockets.

after each shooting all the brass goes into a big Lyman stainless steel pin tumbler, they come out like brand new and all pockets are spotless. 
before I tumble washed , yes I did make the effort to clean the pockets out .

i have always had the belief ( rightly or wrongly) that whilst the simple act of cleaning out the primer pockets has a very limited effect, it’s when you add it to all the other little things we do that’s makes the big difference . 

[Popsbengo]

1 hour ago, No i deer said:

The best way has to be with a primer pocket uniformer and it also keeps the primer seated at the proper depth as they get shallower every firing..

They may take out brass up to 10 firings until they've finished stretching and mainly take of the carbon.

 

Being seated to the right depth may also stop any piercing of the primers and any high primers that's proud of the case base

I've never seen that effect on .308 (LRP) .223, or .338LM  Lapua brass and 45/70 .44Rem Star/Remington.   What brass and what calibre are you using ?

[One on top of two]

I think some of the things I do are more habits really . I tend to think of case preparation from the start to the finish as a Bit of ritual really , And all the things I do are just parts of that ritual. I find it also brings out our little OCD ways , well it certainly does with me . 
to the OP 
I look at it this way , A lot of the reloading process And case preparation are  a personal thing , if you happy with the way you doing it and your getting good results leave things be . 
but there’s certainly no wrong with just experimenting, as long as the basic core principles are maintained 

[miki]

I can't imagine that the pressure when firing compresses the head and so shrinks the primer pocket ?

Yes it fire-forms the case neck and shoulder but does it change the shape of the body and the extractor grove and head ? I'd never thought about that. I deprime, full length resize and stainless wet tumble with a final check/measure prior to reloading. Occasionally I will anneal ensuring only the neck and shoulders are 'blued'. The body and head are never heated by enough to sften the material.

Most cases have quite a thick head too (about 7mm if i measure correctly). I did wonder if I shouldn't deprime prior to tumbling, so I didn't wear the primer pocket, but I can't feel/see/measure any diference after 3 or 4 processes...

[meles meles]

Hmmmm...

*Ponders*

Most of our cases seem to last a goodly time: the majority of our rifles are old battle rifles and we tend to shoot them primarily with reduced power loads and cast bullets in deference to their age and prior service. Exceptions to that are our more modern target and stalking rifles. The stalking rifles don't fire enough shots to provide a significant sample size so we'll leave them out of consideration too. Of our target rifles, the 6.5x55 Norsqueagian and 7.62x51 and x54 see their cases lasting for at least a dozen reloads. We don't run super hot loads in them and usually use GGG or PPU brass, both of which we find very good value in terms of price:performance.

The one calibre where we have found the cases wearing is 7mm Remington Magnum. That does run a fairly hot load in a Remington 700 based target rifle we use out to 1,000 mards and occasionally further. It's very accurate and a delight to shoot. We've used both Lapua and PPU brass  and get similar case life from each - about 7 shots per case and then the primer pocket becomes loose. In a couple of instances we also so a few small neck cracks appearing at about the same time, so generally we use each case 7 times and then discard the whole batch. With PPU that's more affordable than Lapua. 

Now, what's causing the primer pockets to become loose? Surely it is more likely to be plastic deformation of the surrounding brass rather than an effect of the cleaning and preparation regime. Our cleaning regime is simple.

1. Decap - Lee universal decapper
2. Ultrasonic clean with a small quantity of detergent in tap water (quite a powerful ultrasonic bath)
3. Dry, vertically, neck down, in the sun
4. Lubricate with Lee's goo and resize with a Lee full length resizing die
5. Ultrasonic clean  - again with a small quantity of detergent in tap water
6. Dry, vertically, neck down, in the sun
7. Reload...

 

 

 

[Popsbengo]

I've never bothered to wash the sizing lube off, just use a clean cloth.  I use dry lube in the neck.  Am I missing something?

[meles meles]

Not the milk jug anyway

Our main concern, perhaps unfounded, was to remove any goo that might build up in the die and then get transferred inside the case, where it could then 'catch' some powder during reloading and so stop it forming a nice heap in the case. It wouldn't do to have dirty case walls, even if nobody can see them.

 

[Bob57]

3 hours ago, No i deer said:

The best way has to be with a primer pocket uniformer and it also keeps the primer seated at the proper depth as they get shallower every firing..

They may take out brass up to 10 firings until they've finished stretching and mainly take of the carbon.

 

Being seated to the right depth may also stop any piercing of the primers and any high primers that's proud of the case base

That's how I do it, k&m primer pocket uniformer, tumble clean then k&m in the battery drill for a quick primer pocket clean out, always get a bit of brass in with the carbon taken out .

Stops that odd round with a slightly proud primer not letting the bolt close.

Miki mentioned about pressure compressing the head and the primer pockets shrinking, i think that's exactly whats happened with my 204, the last time I tried to clean the pockets most of the cases I tried I could not hold the case the k&m was so tight I gave up,  never had that before, and the only thing different that I can think of is the powder I'm burning is now different!!!

[miki]

38 minutes ago, meles meles said:

<snip>

Now, what's causing the primer pockets to become loose? Surely it is more likely to be plastic deformation of the surrounding brass rather than an effect of the cleaning and preparation regime. Our cleaning regime is simple.

1. Decap - Lee universal decapper
2. Ultrasonic clean with a small quantity of detergent in tap water (quite a powerful ultrasonic bath)
3. Dry, vertically, neck down, in the sun
4. Lubricate with Lee's goo and resize with a Lee full length resizing die
5. Ultrasonic clean  - again with a small quantity of detergent in tap water
6. Dry, vertically, neck down, in the sun
7. Reload...

If we were to use that regime in Scotland we'd only get the cases dry on a few days of the year (athough it's be unusually sunny of late so i shouldn't complain) 

What is causing the primer pockets to loosen .... there must be a contriburay element when wet tumbling but it's tiny, tiny. If the head was being compressed you'd think the brass would flow into the cavities and the flash hole and primer pocket would shrink. I always assumed it was the inserting of the new primer that scraped a bit off the sidewalls... ?

[Popsbengo]

1 hour ago, meles meles said:

Not the milk jug anyway

Our main concern, perhaps unfounded, was to remove any goo that might build up in the die and then get transferred inside the case, where it could then 'catch' some powder during reloading and so stop it forming a nice heap in the case. It wouldn't do to have dirty case walls, even if nobody can see them.

 

Nice of you to remember 😊

[KABOOM]

8 hours ago, meles meles said:

Hmmmm...

*Ponders*

Most of our cases seem to last a goodly time: the majority of our rifles are old battle rifles and we tend to shoot them primarily with reduced power loads and cast bullets in deference to their age and prior service. Exceptions to that are our more modern target and stalking rifles. The stalking rifles don't fire enough shots to provide a significant sample size so we'll leave them out of consideration too. Of our target rifles, the 6.5x55 Norsqueagian and 7.62x51 and x54 see their cases lasting for at least a dozen reloads. We don't run super hot loads in them and usually use GGG or PPU brass, both of which we find very good value in terms of price:performance.

The one calibre where we have found the cases wearing is 7mm Remington Magnum. That does run a fairly hot load in a Remington 700 based target rifle we use out to 1,000 mards and occasionally further. It's very accurate and a delight to shoot. We've used both Lapua and PPU brass  and get similar case life from each - about 7 shots per case and then the primer pocket becomes loose. In a couple of instances we also so a few small neck cracks appearing at about the same time, so generally we use each case 7 times and then discard the whole batch. With PPU that's more affordable than Lapua. 

Now, what's causing the primer pockets to become loose? Surely it is more likely to be plastic deformation of the surrounding brass rather than an effect of the cleaning and preparation regime. Our cleaning regime is simple.

1. Decap - Lee universal decapper
2. Ultrasonic clean with a small quantity of detergent in tap water (quite a powerful ultrasonic bath)
3. Dry, vertically, neck down, in the sun
4. Lubricate with Lee's goo and resize with a Lee full length resizing die
5. Ultrasonic clean  - again with a small quantity of detergent in tap water
6. Dry, vertically, neck down, in the sun
7. Reload...

 

 

 

loose primer pockets! The result of usage and pressure when I find them I discard the lot of brass.

 

 

[KABOOM]

8 hours ago, Popsbengo said:

I've never bothered to wash the sizing lube off, just use a clean cloth.  I use dry lube in the neck.  Am I missing something?

I take case lube off with dry media in another tumbler I also dry lube in the necks.

[terryh]

Suppose I’m a bit anal on the case prep thing then?

I do uniform primer pocket depths using a Century 21 adjustable uniformer but I tend to do this after first firing, I sort of feel firing will ‘settle out’ all the brass if anything is left from manufacturing.

My regime is to :

Anneal in AMP induction machine, apply home made lube, body size (pushing back the shoulder .001-2”), neck size, (sometimes deriving in separate process, inside and outside chamfer (‘VLD’ inside chamfer angle), wash off lube and dry in a food drier, vibratory cleaner/nut media, clean primer pockets and check flash holes for tumbler media, prime using adjustable Century 21 tool ‘just below flush, apply dry neck lube just before loading process.

Do a lot of this in batches and have the ‘man cave’ set up to allow this to be sorted in snatched time.

Do have a pin tumbler that I use now and then, but still vibratory clean as well - feel tumbling makes brass too clean (but might be mitigated by dry neck lube??)

BPCR is a whole different ball game - that is real shooting, smokeless is a passing phase 😂