AI Mod seized on AI Tactical Break

[sfurby]

Hello All,

 

Don't know how this happened but on Sunday my moderator seems to have become seized onto the muzzle break. I cannot seem to shift this at all. Has anyone got any tips solvent etc. I have tried heat but doesn't seem to make much difference?

 

Thanks

[Villadave59]

I know this sounds bonkers but if it’s the AI brake it is L/H thread , I’m sure you know this but  thought it worth a mention ,cheers Dave

[Richiew]

Could try a strap spanner or one of them tools to take lids off jamjars so it won’t mess up the mod . Could you get a spanner across the flats at the rear of the mod and another spanner on the brake and squeeze them together in a right hand direction? . 

[Shuggy]

Strange, exactly the same thing happened to me on Saturday. However, I had luckily recently upgraded my vice with a nice set of V-shaped nylon jaws designed for motorsport hose end assembly. This allows it to get a really solid, but non-marring grip on the barrel: it’s great for rifle maintenance and has allowed me to ditch the old Tipton gun vice, which took up loads of room. A good 2 handed grip on the moderator, a bit of a grunt and it was free.

Lesson learned - a good daub of VP90 grease was placed on the thread for the next time.

[Catch-22]

Yep, good point. I always make a point of dabbing some moly grease on barrel threads (chamber & muzzle ends) and brakes/mods. I too learnt my lesson the hard way once. 

[Shuggy]

Copper slip high temperature anti-seize grease is probably the best type of all to use; I should probably pick some up. But back to the OP, if it really is stuck, then I have always found PlusGas to be the best stuff for seized threads. It’s just as good as Kroil. 

[Popsbengo]

+1 on PlusGas however one of the best easing agents is diesel oil, can work like a charm and negligible cost (if you own a diesel vehicle).  With any easing oil you need to give plenty of time for the oil to creep down the thread.

[Re-Pete]

Hot air gun and a can of freezer spray...warm all up and squirt the freezer spray into the brake.

https://uk.farnell.com/electrolube/fre200/freezer-spray-aerosol-200ml/dp/2831666

Pete

[baldie]

Nope, nope , nope.

The threads haven't seized.

Carbon from the brake sticks at certain points inside the moderator, acting as a "key" which locks.

If its jammed solid [and they almost never are ] it needs soaking to soften the carbon.

The very common mistake most people make, is forgetting its a l/h thread, or removing the brake/mod and putting it in the vice, but still trying to remove it the wrong way.

I've had 3 the same recently, all apparently "seized solid"

They were'nt.

People do not clean the mods as they should, and its this lack of maintenance that causes the problem.

The mod should have all carbon removed from the rear brake orifice, EVERY time its been used. Remove the O ring and clean that, and its groove, then a finger of grease wiped all around the inside will help stop the issue again.

[sfurby]

Well with a bench vise this morning can't shift at all have given up as don't want to damage, what is my next course of action, if I need to soak it? What would be best? Failing that is there any other course of action I can't take prior to returning? I probably have not cleaned this enough but I have only used the mod 4 or 5 times in last 5 years of ownership, although I always clean the break.

[gazzarM1]

Have you tried Plusgas? That has succeeded for me in the past

[Popsbengo]

2 hours ago, sfurby said:

Well with a bench vise this morning can't shift at all have given up as don't want to damage, what is my next course of action, if I need to soak it? What would be best? Failing that is there any other course of action I can't take prior to returning? I probably have not cleaned this enough but I have only used the mod 4 or 5 times in last 5 years of ownership, although I always clean the break.

please don't take it wrong but you are definitely undoing lefthand thread in the correct direction?

Diesel oil is cheap, readily available and efficient at loosening seized threads, just dunk the whole muzzle and stuck parts in a tub and leave for at least a couple of hours.

[Richiew]

Undo the brake to barrel screw and dis assemble brake and mod from the barrel . Put the whole lot in a bucket of diesel and leave for a couple of days . With the brake in a vice and the mod facing upwards the mod needs to be turned clockwise to come off the brake . Kg 12 carbon remover works great to clean the inside of the mod/ brake area . When putting the mod on the brake use coppaslip and don’t over tighten it - right hand bullet spin keeps it nipped up  .

[Popsbengo]

58 minutes ago, Richiew said:

Undo the brake to barrel screw and dis assemble brake and mod from the barrel . Put the whole lot in a bucket of diesel and leave for a couple of days . With the brake in a vice and the mod facing upwards the mod needs to be turned clockwise to come off the brake . Kg 12 carbon remover works great to clean the inside of the mod/ brake area . When putting the mod on the brake use coppaslip and don’t over tighten it - right hand bullet spin keeps it nipped up  .

^^ even better

[sfurby]

Thanks All, will give that a try will get some diesel later, is there a way this mod can be stripped down, so I only have to soak the jammed parts?

[Richiew]

2 hours ago, sfurby said:

Thanks All, will give that a try will get some diesel later, is there a way this mod can be stripped down, so I only have to soak the jammed parts?

I have tried to take mine apart but gave up . I will occasionally push a nylon teapot spout cleaning brush through it to clean off any bits in the baffles and spray it with silencesave after each session  . Even though it’s 308 I think the internals are .338 so a 338 bronze brush might do a good job . Good luck 

[Richiew]

Just one thing 

 

clean out any diesel or whatever fluid you use with meths or brake cleaner before shooting it. It’ll stop any unexpected boom 

[baldie]

Why not give the AI service centre a ring.............

Before you do something as ridiculous as half the answers given here, and f**k up your mod.

My number is 07889 388378.

[Brushy]

Dave, what grease should be used on the O-ring please? 
thanks in advance 

Tim 

[Shuggy]

It’s a thread seized with carbon. That’s very unlikely to require any proprietary knowledge from AI to sort it out.

[Richiew]

O-rings usually prefer silicon grease aqua sil or similar. Copper slip or nickeleeze for metal threads . Halfords have a copper type grease but it’s not recommended for stainless steel , for this use the nickeleeze . 

[Richiew]

Moly cote P37 is good to 1400degrees C . After a range day of 200 rounds you can see inside the brake end of the mod a build up of carbon where the vents are on the brake thus could be the lockup area . Have tried both copaslip and nickeleeze and they both don’t stay greasy after 200 shots . The silicon grease also deteriorate s and the gas can leak and cut the oring . Regular changes of the oring helps . Some hi temp greases only specify 450 c so try something much higher . Due to its structure stainless is very good at picking up on threads ie seizing and alloy items don’t mix with other metals so will corrode to a white powder . 40 years in the chemical industry and we still haven’t found a way to stop threads catching under all circumstances. I’ll see if I can order the moly cote and see how it works. 
Hope you’ve got that mod loose 

 

[Catch-22]

10 hours ago, Richiew said:

Moly cote P37 is good to 1400degrees C . After a range day of 200 rounds you can see inside the brake end of the mod a build up of carbon where the vents are on the brake thus could be the lockup area . Have tried both copaslip and nickeleeze and they both don’t stay greasy after 200 shots . The silicon grease also deteriorate s and the gas can leak and cut the oring . Regular changes of the oring helps . Some hi temp greases only specify 450 c so try something much higher . Due to its structure stainless is very good at picking up on threads ie seizing and alloy items don’t mix with other metals so will corrode to a white powder . 40 years in the chemical industry and we still haven’t found a way to stop threads catching under all circumstances. I’ll see if I can order the moly cote and see how it works. 
Hope you’ve got that mod loose 

 

That’s interesting.

I use Redline CV2 extreme pressure moly grease for barrel shanks and muzzle threads when swapping out my barrels and attaching brakes and direct thread mods. I’ve found the Redline works well, everything comes loose quickly and without effort. The grease is still there even after the barrel/brake gets hot.

However Ive only recently bought a MAE mod for my AI AWM and that’s got the O ring bushing to seal over the AI brake. I intend to put some Redline on the O ring and I’ll see how that performs. But your suggestion to use a higher temp grease, like MolyKote P37, might come in handy. Thanks!

[Shuggy]

I just bought some Molyslip Copaslip to replace my VP90 grease. It’s good up to 1100 degrees C and rated for Stainless and Aluminium. To be honest, I think that many of the copper based high temperature anti seize greases are very similar.

[baldie]

The said Mod and brake landed this morning, and five minutes later was disassembled.

I cannot state this overly enough.

Stand and look at the job, when you have it mounted how you want to remove it.

As you can see, this mod is in my vice. 

Be VERY careful when doing this. I know my vice, I know its strength, and its used every day. The jaws are flat, smooth brass, and protected by paper slips for grip. 

The mod has been fixed in there, so the solid section at the back is within the vice jaws. Use just enough purchase to hold it without moving. I accept no responsibility for He-man, swinging on the handle, and crushing your mod. Use some common sense.

The mod is pointing away from you. Imagine you were screwing a normal mod onto a r/h thread. You would be spinning it on, counter clockwise.

With the spanner on the brake flats, it wants to be going counter clockwise too.

You are moving the brake, not the mod. This is a left hand thread remember.

This came off easily.

Once off, I put the brake in a coffee jar full of carbon remover [boretec ] and stand it in the ultrasonic for 20 minutes. It won't hurt the brake finish.

DONT do this with the mod. Never tried an AI mod, but i've seen ultrasonics remove anodising before.

The mod.

I plug the thread hole with a silicon bung, and half fill the back with carbon remover, and let it soak for an hour, agitating it now and again with a cotton bud.

When you think its had long enough, tip it out and remove the bung.

I then get in there with a small, blunt, and all edges smoothed, screwdriver, and gently scrape the softened carbon away from the bell shaped hole.

You should have already removed the O ring. Make sure the groove is clean of carbon too.

There is a flat area, where the thread starts. Make sure this is scraped clean.

When all spotless, i put grease on my finger, and put a faint smear on the entire bell shaped hole. If its greased, the carbon wont stick to it hard, and will be much easier to clean next time.

Grease the O ring groove, and replace, adding a further smear to the ring itself.

Get the brake out of the gunk, and gently scrape all the soft carbon off, that's left.

Pay particular attention to the undercut groove, behind the the thread, as it always builds up there. Also the small shoulder directly behind it.

When clean, I always fill the thread undercut with grease, and also a smear on the brake body, which fits inside the O ring. Carbon builds up just in front of that.

Its a simple job to grease the parts before use for the day, and saves a lot of grief. After shooting, dont let the mod go completely cold before removing it from the gun, it makes removal of an Aluminium mod, from a steel brake so much easier.

These parts require routine maintenance, and should be part of your cleaning regime, after every time the gun has been used. The O rings last longer when treated thus, and cleaning is far easier, with the grease in the points mentioned.

I usually put a smear on the brake thread, but to be honest, have never seen an AI brake, seize into the mod at this point.

Regarding grease, I have used moly, and that's fine, and I now use the white stuff in a tube, off amazon. I think its called TWG25 or something.

Anything is better than nothing, and as mentioned previously, there are some very specialist ones, that would be far better than what i've used.

On the subject of soaking.

Dont do it to the mod's internals. Its a sealed unit, and you wont get it out.

Most certainly DO NOT USE DIESEL. Or any other petroleum distillate. Diesel ignites under pressure, and doesn't evaporate off, very well.

Stick to bore solvents, and do your best to not let any get inside. A few drops wont hurt, but avoid if possible.

If you want to clean the baffles, AI make a special brush for just that, or a large cal pistol brush, pushed through dry, will get the whiskers off the baffles.

I see this issue regularly, and its simply a maintenance thing. The mod and brake is the thick end of £800, look after it chaps.

Hope this helps.