Casting

[terryh]

Just moved and set up my casting kit into the cellar and occurred to me that some folks might not have done any casting so thought I would give a brief example of how you could do it?

 

Base metal of most casting is lead to which you can add tin, antimony, arsenic depending on what you want to use the final bullet for.

 

I'm loading BPCR so use a 20:1 mix of pure lead to tin, the tin makes the molten metal flow into the mold and hardens the lead a little. I buy the lead and tin and batch cast about 50gk of the mix into 1 pound ingots.

 

 

The casting furnace holds about 20 pounds of lead. You put in additional pre heated 1 pound ingots as you go along, this keeps the mix the same and does not alter the temperature too much. As I'm casting 510g bullets I only get 13 bullets / pound. The casting station ends up covered in bits of lead - well mine does!

 

 

The main pot is controlled by a PID rather than the 'bang-bang' thermostat fitted by the manufacturer, this maintains the pot a temperature (370deg C) +/- 2 degC = more consistent bullet weight.

 

 

The bullet mold is pre heated on the same hot plat as the ready use ingots and will throw a useable bullet pretty much first time. when casting you look for a fully filled out mold, sharp edges (especially the base) and a nice shiny bullet - if you have a 'frosty' skin then the temperature is too high. If a bullet comes out wrong just drop it back into the pot. Rather than the original scissor type of mold handles I've gone over to the over centre cam design which remove any difference your grip can have on how much pressure is holding the mold together, there is little point in having a turned mold then squeezing it oval or to varying degrees of ovality?

 

 

Once you have a pile of bullets you can then visually check them and weight/sort into batches. In the last batch of 200 195 spanned 3 grains in weight with 5 being outside this so marked up and used as blow off shots. I group the bullets and shoot the same weight +/- 0.5g.

 

 

Once the bullets are sorted they are then sized and lubed. As I use a turned mold they are not strictly 'sized' , more pushed thru a tube and have a lube forced into the cannulas.

 

 

Which gives you these final products, sharp edges, round bullets of the same weight and base metal consistency (as cast centre and right, all ready to load with correct lube on the left):

 

 

And if you then load them up right accuracy follows thus, 105 yard group, open sights BPCR:

 

 

That's a précis for casting!

 

There are a slew of other variables, mold design, size, lube, metal mix. Best source of information for those interested is here: http://castboolits.gunloads.com/

 

Brgds Terry

[MJR]

Brilliant write up Terry, look after that gun!

[brown dog]

Yup, outstanding read, Terry!

 

(Blimey, I dread reloading 'normal' stuff - I'd never have the patience for the precision & consistency lead demands too!)

[terryh]

Mike,

 

Thank you (ps - wait a while and see what else is in the pipeline!! )

 

BD

 

no worries, you can still have a blast of mine - or drop in the 22rf conversion barrel for your back yard.

 

If of any interest I can do similar on loading the BPCR?

 

T

[trucraft]

Very interesting.

I can imaging hugely more satisfying than loadind ready made bullets, cheaper too.

[baldie]

Is that a Shiloh, Terry ?

[Andrew]

I never can get a pic to upload onto this site, but i share your enthusiasm for bullet casting. I have been at it for 40 years -some black Powder Cartridge as needed (45-70, 32-40, 28-30. 38-55, 577 Snider, 50 -70 etc.) but my main focus has been high velocity cast from bottle necked rifle cases from Hornet to 300 Win Mag. I shot cast bullet bench rest for may years. It's a very rewarding endeavor. ~Andrew

[terryh]

Trucraft

 

- lead and tin costs approx. 26p/round without my time and electricity, consumables (lube and flux)

 

Baldie

 

- The rifle in the photo is my Axtell 77 Sharps, but the next one.................well that's another story

 

Andrew

 

- yes addictive, challenging but rewarding. I'm tempted to try loading some for my K31. Cast bullet bench rest - is this breach seating etc.?

 

brgds

 

Terry

[bradders]

http://ukvarminting.com/forums/topic/13800-axtell-77-sharps/

 

Nicely made bullets and fab rifle Terry

 

One of those things on the wish list, maybe nearer retirement

[terryh]

maybe nearer retirement

Probably why I like them!

[TSG]

Terry,

Thanks for this. I am about to start faffing about with casting .413 bullets to shoot through a Ruger no1. I am just getting the kit together so your in was very helpful. I am looking at paper patching the bullets as my mate has had some success with his .450 double rifle rather than gas checks. What make is the mold? I assume you use a dipper for lead pouring.

Thanks

[terryh]

TSG,

 

Paper patching is next on my list! The two molds I'm looking at are the KAL tool and die ( http://kal.castpics.net/Molds.html ) or the BACO ( http://www.buffaloarms.com/Detail.aspx?PROD=1206033&CAT=4161 ).

 

The mold in the photo is a BACO, but there are plenty of other turned mold makers.

 

If I can get them to work with BP on targets I'll have a HP 'done' by these guys: http://www.hollowpointmold.com/inset-bar-conversions/?picture=710#710 as I'd like to stalk a deer.

 

I use a dipper (this one: http://www.lymanproducts.com/lyman/bullet-casting/casting-dipper.php ) as I've found I get good results, some folks get on with bottom pour pots - it's up to you.

 

T

[TSG]

Thanks, paper patching appears to be a bit of a dark art but as said works well in the 450 and in .375 H&H. I have tried cast bullets with Trailboss with some success but deer stalking with a cast bullet is the goal. The No 1 can be awkward to get it to shoot well. Mine is ok, first two shots are into 1/2 MOA but it then mucks about. Have been looking at CBE moulds who will do a HP.

[terryh]

5744's a good powder for 'loose' loads and cast.

 

Have you tried the 'Hicks' fix on your no.1??

 

T

[Bushdog]

Terry - very interesting to see your set - up. Still haven't started casting for my .470 yet - I have everything but the lube sorted. What do you use by way of lube?

 

I am thinking I will need something that will stick the higher velocities, as I want to load fast enough to get it to regulate reasonably.

 

TSG - not to derail Terry's excellent thread, I would also be interested to hear more of your .375 and .450 work - does the .450 regulate OK with lead loads? (Presume the .375 is a bolt gun - lot easier to deal with!!).

[terryh]

Brain,

 

I'm using SPG but this is a BP specific lube, not sure it would be good for faster smokeless?

 

Re. Your 470, are you looking at gas checked bullets or hard and/or heat treated 'just cast'?

 

Definitely better lubes out there for your needs.

 

What sort of speeds are you looking to achieve, this drives (no pun) your options?

 

Paper patch is a good solution but probably more than you want to 'faff' with?

 

T

[TSG]

5744's a good powder for 'loose' loads and cast.

Have you tried the 'Hicks' fix on your no.1??

T

Made my own out of a bit of copper and electricians tape. Barrel is floated from this wedge towards. I think is more to do with trigger pull consistency and long hammer travel.

[Bushdog]

Terry, the mould is gas-check, and I brought some gas-checks back with me from US last year. I am planning hard (pure lead/linotype 50/50) as I already have a good stock of lino left over from pistol days, and several ingots of 50/50 ready to go.

 

To match factory regulation, velocities will need to get up to around 2200, which is why I thought GC and hard lead. Of course, there may be other nodes where it will regulate at lower (less painful!!) velocities, but this will be a matter of trial and error, I think.

 

I thought velocities would effect the type of lube. I am off stateside again in September - hopefully I can locate a supply of suitable lube on my travels!!

 

I do like the idea of paper patching - something for a bit later on, though.

[Andrew]

 

Andrew

 

- yes addictive, challenging but rewarding. I'm tempted to try loading some for my K31. Cast bullet bench rest - is this breach seating etc.?

 

brgds

 

Terry

Terry,

I have done the Schuetzen style with 32-40 and 28-30 using a breech seater but I got frustrated keeping company with some of the shooters who wistfully hearkened back to the days of sheep tallow and beeswax lubricants and considered anyone who shot a lubricant (or bullet design) made after 1900 to be a heretic. It got tiring. The bench rest comps I shot were with modern rifles at 100 and 200 yard ranges. The Cast Bullet Association had regional and National matches but I only competed on the local level; I was raising a family and too poor to travel much. My main interest was producing fast loads for hunting and target shooting; running cast bullets at "highway speeds" as we called it. I have taken many deer with heat treated cast bullets driven at jacketed speeds. They didn't seem to know the difference between my cast bullets and commercial jacketed.

 

The K-31's are a great rifle to shoot cast from. I have shot ONLY cast from mine (3) and the rest of my 7.5x55 Swiss rifles. (7) If I can recommend a good bullet? The RCBS 30-165-SIL or the 30-180-SP. The 165 will throat up for sure; the 180's often need to have a 3-degree angle swaged on the nose to allow the gas check to stay out of the powder supply. (requiring a custom die) Either will shoot better than I can hold. ~Andrew

[Scrumbag]

Great stuff, I'm thinking of casting some 12b slugs....