brown dog

Can’t agree with that😂. The world has changed - modern Islamist threats require armed coppers everywhere a la continent, not just London. Response times outside the metropolis are simply frightening. Luckily not been tested. Yet. That said, lots of coppers don’t want to be armed - unless that’s changed recently. I even remember patrolling with RUC peelers in pre-ceasefire NI who openly stated there were zero circumstances in which they would draw their pistol - they would leave it to us to sort.

Happy with that. Not sure anyone’s questioned anyone’s bravery? (edited to add, just reflecting, one of my pals in a pistolero outfit, of the type people buy books about, in pre-ceasefire NI, put one of his blokes on remedial pistol training when the bloke wounded, but didn’t kill, an RPG wannabe who appeared out of a doorway in front of him. Good training is just good training).

Hmmm. I suspect the low overshoot impression is more about how rarely the police open up and how few shots they tend to fire when they do…. and luck, vis: bus almost 50% of shots ‘lost’ at a short range at a static target, in the centre of London, even accounting for stress, strikes me as ‘a lot’.

Yup, always used to be some darts-player-physique type saying that about military shooting too - best thing is to offer them to suit-up in 30 or 40 pounds of kit, do a quick bleep test or run 200m and then show that skill whilst someone tries to kill them, maybe?

100% agree

😂 Are non-CTSFOs still on 5.56? Pretty depressing if the 300’s ability to neutralise is what was seen on the bridge

Before or after the event in question?

Point taken. Don’t know what bullet that is, but even ss109 fragments like the top row ‘point blank’ and anything torso at that distance has very very low survivability. Hence my surprise at the qunt sitting up. The drop-off your pic shows sub 2500 is marked. A pencil. Now, if they were using TBBC projectiles too…

Sorry, that bit wasn’t at you! It was at the people saying ‘how brave’ and missing the point that he shouldn’t be able to sit up after two point-blank hits, I sense there’s a weapon system issue at play.

Possibly - no idea what the MV drops to, not how it equates at <20ft to a round from a ‘normal’ barrel. Knowing that even ball ammo fragments at the sort of distances seen here, I’d hazard a guess they’re using ammo designed to defeat barricades etc …and it’s pencilled through….. literally the wrong bullets

Umm, the thread wasn’t criticising the police; it was questioning the effectiveness of whatever this qunt was being hit with. 2 rounds of 5.56 point blank (if that’s what hit him first) shouldn’t be something a person sits up from 10 minutes later. I suspect they may, literally, be using the wrong bullets. ( that said, as regards stress-shooting, I’d stand correction, but I believe that these armed cops are CT types, selected and trained to respond to specifically these situations - and, being totally objective, at the distances involved, 9 ‘lost shots’ at a single sedent

No idea. I’m armchair commandoing it from the news pics.

Assumed it was 5.56 at about 10ft for the first two. They’re using the wrong bullet, if he sat up from that.