Guesty Posted November 20, 2015 Report Share Posted November 20, 2015 I'm quite new to bushing dies and have just discovered a pronounced doughnut inside the case at the very bottom of the neck where it joins the shoulder. I inadvertantly made this doughnut whilst bumping the shoulder back. Can the doughnut be removed easily without buying specialist neck turning tools? That is, could I perhaps run the cases through a regular expander button or mandrel type die to flatten the doughnut? The cartridge in question is a 260Rem with Redding Comp bushing neck set and Lapua twice fired brass. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DaveT Posted November 20, 2015 Report Share Posted November 20, 2015 I don't think that it can be removed without the right tools....others may have solutions that I am unaware of. K&M do an inside neck reamer ...alternatively you would have to use a die with an expander ball to push the donut to the outside of the neck and then turn it away with a neck turner. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1967spud Posted November 20, 2015 Report Share Posted November 20, 2015 giv us a bell Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garyw Posted November 20, 2015 Report Share Posted November 20, 2015 for my .284 i have a drill bit that fits a fired case neck perfectly i just run it through the case mouth with a cordless drill every 2nd firing and any donuts are gone- cheap fix but it works. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogfox1 Posted November 20, 2015 Report Share Posted November 20, 2015 Had the same problem with some of my tight necks and just got some old reamers re-ground at the local machine shop for about £10 a piece ( his stock ). These just took out doenuts in the neck in one go - Job done. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guesty Posted November 20, 2015 Author Report Share Posted November 20, 2015 Thanks all for your input. I do like the idea of fixing this on the cheap if possible, so reamer / drill bits appeal more than the K&M kit. From your replies it appears that the brass doughnut needs to be removed, and not just pushed out of the way by using a different type of die, assuming that is possible. If the doughnut was caused by thicker shoulder brass extruding into the base of the neck when bumping the shoulder back, why don't similar full length expander ball dies also suffer the same problem? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Posted November 20, 2015 Report Share Posted November 20, 2015 I took care of this when reforming 300 Win Mag to 308 Norma. I used a Lee Collet die to lightly size the neck, then ran a .308 neck reamer through using my Forster trimmer. I sized the neck until the reamer just caught metal, then sized all the cases to that degree, then reamed. Worked perfectly. I use the same technique when reforming surplus 308 to 7-08. I thin the necks using this method.~Andrew Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gun Pimp Posted November 20, 2015 Report Share Posted November 20, 2015 for my .284 i have a drill bit that fits a fired case neck perfectly i just run it through the case mouth with a cordless drill every 2nd firing and any donuts are gone- cheap fix but it works. This is the easiest/cheapest way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guesty Posted November 21, 2015 Author Report Share Posted November 21, 2015 Being lazy (as well as cheap!), I have simply run the brass through my Lee collet neck die. If this sorts the doughnut problem out then I'll probably return to that for good. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gun Pimp Posted November 21, 2015 Report Share Posted November 21, 2015 Usually, the doughnut only occurs on the 260 Rem if the cases have been necked-up from 243Win. If you started with new 260 Lapua brass you need to have a look at your die set-up. I don't see how you could do it with 260 brass and 260 dies. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grouse Posted November 21, 2015 Report Share Posted November 21, 2015 Did you by any chance use an Expandiron to uniform necks before neck sizing? If so the top of the expandiron might have pushed the mouth of the case downwards causing a doughnut, if the bottoming out screw wasn't adjusted long enough? Just a thought... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guesty Posted November 21, 2015 Author Report Share Posted November 21, 2015 Ah, perhaps the body die is the problem? My die set is the Redding Competition neck bushing set for 6.5mm-308 Winchester (part no 56578). I did contact Redding when I got the dies and was told that they'd be fine with 260 Rem, but perhaps the shoulder dimensions are slightly different? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gbal Posted November 21, 2015 Report Share Posted November 21, 2015 GGuesty,that difference is just possible-there have been plenty wildcat 6.5-08,though redding would not be selling such dies generally,and they were never SAAMI . "A square" did submit specs to SAAMI for their 6.5-08,but somehow Remington's 260 got the official nod instead-very similar,but identical? Who knows? Whose telling? no one. Be interesting to hear what Redding say-I'm sure they have acted properly,and it'll get sorted-260 is a fine cartridge (as no doubt the AA 6.5-08 would have been- identical or very nearly !) gbal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
johnnyb0_1 Posted December 16, 2015 Report Share Posted December 16, 2015 Check out Richards Uttings input on case neck trimming on You tube. Very informative and in my, (limited), experience (308) it works well. Branching out into other calibre's,( .233), is equally successful. Best results I've had with many different tweaks. 21st Century kit seems the way forward. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guesty Posted December 31, 2015 Author Report Share Posted December 31, 2015 Being lazy (as well as cheap!), I have simply run the brass through my Lee collet neck die. If this sorts the doughnut problem out then I'll probably return to that for good. UPDATE: The doughnut problem was indeed cured by using the Lee Collet neck die and without have to resort to reaming or neck turning. Happy days! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dannywayoflife Posted December 31, 2015 Report Share Posted December 31, 2015 Can't beat them collet dies Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Laurie Posted December 31, 2015 Report Share Posted December 31, 2015 If a die solves the problem, then the doughnut was somehow shooter-induced through an incorrect die set-up. As The Gun Pimp says, you simply shouldn't get a doughnut with a Lapua 260 Rem case sized in a proper die. Reformed brass - now that is a different story, and you can't 'iron it out' by sizing, or not at least in my experience. That's because shoulders and necks are usually two different thickness, shoulder being thicker. Expand the neck up to the calibre above, eg 243 Win to 260 Rem; 6.5-284 Norma to .284 Win) and you transfer a little bit of shoulder into the bottom of the neck. Hey presto, you've got a doughnut which has to be reamed out .... unless you can ignore it by seating the bullet shank above the ring if the chamber throat allows. Since I already owned an L E Wilson lathe type trimmer, the easiest way around this issue for me was to buy the same company's 6.5 and 7mm calibre inside neck reamers designed for the trimmer tool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guesty Posted December 31, 2015 Author Report Share Posted December 31, 2015 It certainly could have been my fault. Perhaps I set the body die up incorrectly, but I haven't had problems with previous cartridges. I will get around to chasing Redding in the new year to check the 6.5/308Win body die does indeed match 260Rem dimensions perfectly. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scotch_egg Posted January 1, 2016 Report Share Posted January 1, 2016 I am pretty sure the 6.5-.308 redding die that was advertised on the stalking directory a while ago was different dimensions to the SAAMI spec .260 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gbal Posted January 1, 2016 Report Share Posted January 1, 2016 I am pretty sure the 6.5-.308 redding die that was advertised on the stalking directory a while ago was different dimensions to the SAAMI spec .260 cf post 13 on this possibility, Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swarovski1 Posted January 1, 2016 Report Share Posted January 1, 2016 How do you know if your cases have donuts, are they visable with the naked eye or is it the loaded rounds wont chamber Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1967spud Posted January 1, 2016 Report Share Posted January 1, 2016 How do you know if your cases have donuts, are they visable with the naked or is it the loaded rounds wont chamber ASK A POLICEMAN THEY CAN SNIFF OUT DONUTS Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guesty Posted January 1, 2016 Author Report Share Posted January 1, 2016 I discovered mine by seating a bullet into a fired case. The bullet slid in until it reached the doughnut where it promptly stopped. I have never experienced neck doughnuts before (223, 6.5x55, 243 and 308) where I usually use a Lee collet neck die and Redding body die. I'm wondering if the bushing neck die might be the cause as I have little experience with it. But it could be the body die itself which is not labelled as '260Rem' but '6.5/308Win Body 7G', but I suspect it could be me doing something wrong. The doughnut became apparent after pushing the shoulder back 0.002", checking with and RCBS Precision Mic and feeling for bolt lowering pressure with the firing pin removed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swarovski1 Posted January 1, 2016 Report Share Posted January 1, 2016 ASK A POLICEMAN THEY CAN SNIFF OUT DONUTS when this thread was posted I made a silly remark just like this one but mine was asking if the doughnut was custard or jam and it was removed.spud you've been naughty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swarovski1 Posted January 1, 2016 Report Share Posted January 1, 2016 I discovered mine by seating a bullet into a fired case. The bullet slid in until it reached the doughnut where it promptly stopped. I have never experienced neck doughnuts before (223, 6.5x55, 243 and 308) where I usually use a Lee collet neck die and Redding body die. I'm wondering if the bushing neck die might be the cause as I have little experience with it. But it could be the body die itself which is not labelled as '260Rem' but '6.5/308Win Body 7G', but I suspect it could be me doing something wrong. The doughnut became apparent after pushing the shoulder back 0.002", checking with and RCBS Precision Mic and feeling for bolt lowering pressure with the firing pin removed. that's sounds like alot of messing around matt.just change calibre or die Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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