tisme Posted July 9, 2013 Report Share Posted July 9, 2013 I've bought a 4" and 6" hardox 400 targets that I have hung from chains. I have tested them with 17hmr and 22lr and they stop the bullet but I would like to shoot .223 and 308 at them. Will the bullets need to be ballistic or will target ammo be ok. What else is it safe to shoot at them without ricochet . Ta Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jagged 77 Posted July 9, 2013 Report Share Posted July 9, 2013 Without ricochet is hard to say, any standard constructed bullet hitting a hardox 400 plate square on will fragment and leave all but a circular slither of copper in the vicinity (if you use wood frames these slithers inbed quite deeply). However if you hit an edge or glancing blow who's to say where they'll go? I've seen tracer ricochet off grass and soft earth banking at bizarre angles. The only thing you can do is put the targets in a safe area with a good backstop and try and angle them downwards. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSG Posted July 9, 2013 Report Share Posted July 9, 2013 I have some as well but have yet to use them. I am sure that they will be fine but I am inclined to put them in a sort of mini bunker with a sandbag top and sides. I may be being a bit over cautious but like jagged I worry about ricochet from edge shots. Great of field firing ranges with a danger area but, just my luck to have one go astray. I have used frangible ammo a lot and like the safety of that but have also seen somebody shot with it who was lucky it did not go frangible inside him! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiff Posted July 9, 2013 Report Share Posted July 9, 2013 I have some as well but have yet to use them. I am sure that they will be fine but I am inclined to put them in a sort of mini bunker with a sandbag top and sides. I may be being a bit over cautious but like jagged I worry about ricochet from edge shots. Great of field firing ranges with a danger area but, just my luck to have one go astray. I have used frangible ammo a lot and like the safety of that but have also seen somebody shot with it who was lucky it did not go frangible inside him! Sandags look great, but the splash off the steel will shred them in a few shots, unless covered with a sheet of ply/metal roofing sheets etc..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
oaken Posted July 9, 2013 Report Share Posted July 9, 2013 To date, about 3000 shots fired at AR400 gongs at the various Quarry shoots some as close as 50yds and not a single audible ricochet, not that I have been aware of anyway. Hang the plates angled downwards to deflect any shrapnel into the ground. This also avoids a direct impact which reduces surface wear and of course dramatically reduces any chance of a bullet (or part of) making it back to the shooter. Surface damage. I believe Tiff has had issues with fmj and scenars though we have not specifically tested with these. We have had issues with fast A/Vmax eg .243 @ over 3000fps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swamp Donkey Posted July 10, 2013 Report Share Posted July 10, 2013 Don't use black tip 7.62 on them though ! Rup, yours had fmj used on them, I was using ggg fmj for testing and the first mqc, they were doing 2700fps. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Offroad Gary Posted July 10, 2013 Report Share Posted July 10, 2013 I shoot them with155 scenars and 120 amax, no problems. A 85gn ballistic tip @ 3600 from a 25-06 makes a bit of a crater at 100m! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brown dog Posted July 10, 2013 Report Share Posted July 10, 2013 I have some as well but have yet to use them. I am sure that they will be fine but I am inclined to put them in a sort of mini bunker with a sandbag top and sides. I may be being a bit over cautious but like jagged I worry about ricochet from edge shots. Great of field firing ranges with a danger area but, just my luck to have one go astray. I have used frangible ammo a lot and like the safety of that but have also seen somebody shot with it who was lucky it did not go frangible inside him! Don't think you're being over cautious at all -and an interesting point on the frangible; You may remember we had a ricochet debate on here a while back with some video bod filmed himself using a gently rising field and a hedge as a backstop and considering it safe. The frightening "I can't see sky behind the target so it's safe" school of thought. Also covered the muppetry involved in basing ricochet safety (the safety of other people) on the assumption that all bullets break up. I'm just on a 2 week refresher course on associated matters; was reminded yesterday of some figures I'd forgotten: a round striking the ground with an impact angle of less than 30 degrees to the surface will ricochet (remember to include the trajectory's plunge angle when visualising that) - so a gently rising slope doesn't cut it as a backstop. On a hard target the ricochet cone goes from 45 degrees left through vertically up down to 45 degrees right of the line of fire with a statistically tiny chance of the round even going outside that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tisme Posted July 10, 2013 Author Report Share Posted July 10, 2013 As ever some really good advice. Thanks gents I'll be trying them carefully. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronin Posted July 10, 2013 Report Share Posted July 10, 2013 Prime example of idiocy People like this, and others before them,,,, shouldn't be allowed near firearms, cameras, keyboards and the internet Watch this: http://www.thestalkingdirectory.co.uk/showthread.php/67124-disgusting-display-of-safty Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tisme Posted July 10, 2013 Author Report Share Posted July 10, 2013 Prime example of idiocy People like this, and others before them,,,, shouldn't be allowed near firearms, cameras, keyboards and the internet Watch this: http://www.thestalkingdirectory.co.uk/showthread.php/67124-disgusting-display-of-safty Not a shot I would have taken or filmed and put on youtube. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gandy Posted July 10, 2013 Report Share Posted July 10, 2013 Wow, I think I know that land as well if its near Woburn Abbey. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TSG Posted July 10, 2013 Report Share Posted July 10, 2013 BD you can see why I do not bother with advertising on Stalking Directory. Too much of the THRUSH factor! Hope you are enjoying the course. TSG Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tackb Posted July 10, 2013 Report Share Posted July 10, 2013 Don't use black tip 7.62 on them though ! Rup, yours had fmj used on them, I was using ggg fmj for testing and the first mqc, they were doing 2700fps. You tried the black tipped stuff then? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Swamp Donkey Posted July 10, 2013 Report Share Posted July 10, 2013 Nope, saving them for roundhouse just don't tell tiff !!! Lol Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John MH Posted July 11, 2013 Report Share Posted July 11, 2013 As Tiff has said "The COF will not exceed 100 rounds and FMJ & lathe turned solid bullets are not permitted - HPBT match are ok to use, though expanding/A-Max style are preferred." and he's using some of my steel targets I'd also prefer that you stuck to non-FMJ bullets especially Military FMJs with steel penetrators. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tisme Posted July 11, 2013 Author Report Share Posted July 11, 2013 I've only got two but I can bring them along. One 4" one 6" round Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Montey Posted July 11, 2013 Report Share Posted July 11, 2013 Thanks been thinking about getting some hanging steels and will take all this advise on board and bunker them as I'm using 308 better safe than very sorry! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted July 12, 2013 Report Share Posted July 12, 2013 Sandags look great, but the splash off the steel will shred them in a few shots, unless covered with a sheet of ply/metal roofing sheets etc..... MOD sandbags can take quite a lot of stick if filled and stacked correctly Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiff Posted July 12, 2013 Report Share Posted July 12, 2013 MOD sandbags can take quite a lot of stick if filled and stacked correctly Direct hits they are not too bad at, but within a few feet proximity to quality steel targets (along the flanks/perpendicular to the steel) unfortunately they will be cut up by the splash. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
shooter79 Posted July 16, 2013 Report Share Posted July 16, 2013 I just brought an AR500 small fig 11 steel target from BH Targets (site sponsor front page) and i must say i'm glad i spent a little extra. The quality was fantastic even down to the heavy duty poles and chains. When tested along side the cheaper steel 8 inch gongs i have to say the difference has to be seen! .308 rounds leave no marks at all at 100 yards! We also tested .243 which leave a very light mark due to the velocities. Tested along side the cheaper steel its easy to see what stands up longer, if i was going to buy more steel in the future it will certainly be the AR500 standard. Big thank you to Tracey at BH Targets, great service and very prompt delivery service. Carl. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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