what rifle for stalking ?

[silent-varminter]

hey lads.

 

Im looking into a new rifle set up primarily for deer stalking. I really want to go for a .308 because i homeload my .223 at the mo with Viht N135 and get very good results. I was checking through Lapua loading data base and i cant use N135 for .243 but i can for .308, but .308 was what i was looking for anyway.

 

I really like tactical style rifles and an AI in .308 is right up my street or a TRG. Been looking at a good few of Baldie's custom rifles and i must say, really impressed. Although i really love these types of rifles im not so sure if they are a stalking rifle as probably weight is going to be an issue.

 

Are there folks here that use these types of rifles for stalking, if so how do you get on with them for stalking, any bad points.

 

I am also a member of a gun club, so a .308 for target work is also what i am looking for. Having less rifles as possible is what im aiming for as ive got rifles for certain purposes and do not want 2 .308's, one for deer and one for target.

 

Any suggestions welcome.

[DaveT]

hey lads.

 

Im looking into a new rifle set up primarily for deer stalking. I really want to go for a .308 because i homeload my .223 at the mo with Viht N135 and get very good results. I was checking through Lapua loading data base and i cant use N135 for .243 but i can for .308, but .308 was what i was looking for anyway.

 

I really like tactical style rifles and an AI in .308 is right up my street or a TRG. Been looking at a good few of Baldie's custom rifles and i must say, really impressed. Although i really love these types of rifles im not so sure if they are a stalking rifle as probably weight is going to be an issue.

 

Are there folks here that use these types of rifles for stalking, if so how do you get on with them for stalking, any bad points.

 

I am also a member of a gun club, so a .308 for target work is also what i am looking for. Having less rifles as possible is what im aiming for as ive got rifles for certain purposes and do not want 2 .308's, one for deer and one for target.

 

 

 

 

I have a Surgeon .308 from Baldie on a Macmillan A5 which I can just about use for deer BUT it is a little heavy for that use as it was primarily for target.... I am not a big bloke but it works quite well for me.

 

I also have a 260 Rem also from Baldie but that is on a Mac Hunting Tex adjustable stock which is just perfect for stalking but which is also BRILL for target.

 

Take your choice but Baldie would build you a great rifle if you choose that course of action

Good luck!

Any suggestions welcome.

[Alycidon]

A rifle primarily for deer stalking, that is a big can of worms with a whole lot of different but equally right answers.

 

You will not want to be carrying a 12 or 14 lb rifle for very long I can assure you, been there and have the T shirt. So a lightweight rifle with a thin barrell.

 

You will most times only fire one shot per outing, so there is no need for a big heat absorbing barrel, it just needs that shot to be accurate, So a lightweight shortish thin barrell.

 

Expected range of your deer?, if woodland stalking most are shot below 150 yards, no need for a big dialable NSX, PM2 etc for that. Just a small but high quality optic, perhaps from Schmidt, Ziess or Swaro.

 

Caliber will depend on type of deer expected and ranges that shots are likely to be presented at. 308 is a good all round caliber but unless you are going onto the hill or after Sika there are perhaps better alternatives for the smaller deer. Choosing a caliber due to the powder it uses is not an ideal way forward, personally I would have thought that N135 was a bit fast for 308 although as you say Lapua do show it. Filling the case fuller with a slower powder will ( or should) lead to lower velocity spreads and better accuracy. Probably take a good man to tell the difference though !!.

 

Food for thought anyway,

 

A

[MJR]

Hi, I think you are looking at this the wrong way. Look at what you need rather than what you alrady have. If the rifle is for stalking alone and nothing else then I would think you need a light weight rifle.Heavy rifles are great but their appeal soon wears off if you have to carry them far especially on the open hill. I use a Sauer 202 in 6.5x55 and love it for the job,accurate light with a safety I like. You won't be taking long shot strings so a heavy barrel is not really neededeven if you are out on the hinds.good luck.

[baldie]

Some very good advice given here already.

 

What you can get away with is a medium stocked rifle, say a mac M40 htg, but couple that with a 20" rem varmint profile barrel. That way you retain the relative lightness, but still have the capability for long shot strings for targets.

 

I,m just finishing a .260 rem with a 20" tube in this profile, in a sako varmint mcmillan. It is very well balanced, and not heavy. Fitted with a sensible sight , you could carry it all day. Its a deer rifle, and i,ll post some pics in a week or so to show you.

 

Multi purpose rifles ALWAYS give something up, somewhere.

[Jagged 77]

I'm a fan of heavy barrel rifles for stalking but I'd draw the line on lugging an AI stock around. By the time you've added a can and bi-pod things start to get heavy...

 

A good compromise as has already been pointed out would be a medium contour 20" barrel in a classic style stock - like the McM M40 or the Manners T. Add a DBM and you've got something that should go some way in satisfying your criteria.

 

N135 would be ok with the 150 grain bullet selection with a .308 but there are better choices, especially when it comes to getting the best out a 20" barrel.

[eldon]

For me the powder of choice is N140. This will do 150 + 165 etc grains good and seems to perform well in lots of rifles.

Don't unnecessarily limit yourself by going with one powder especially one that is bordering on too fast.

 

For what its worth I enjoy my remy heavy barrel and don't mind stalking with a 14lb rifle but initially it is heavy till you get used to it. Certainly don't want it any heavier.

[Gandy]

I agree with all previous comments, I chose to just buy a factory sako in 30.06, if it prints sub an inch at 100 yards ish that's accurate enough for stalking.

 

Maybe a bit controversial but I have a nice varminting rifle with all the bells and whistles and for me its about fitness for purpose. That looks like light weight, practcal and accurate enough, I felt I didn't need a full custom.

[ejg223]

Went into the hill a few times recently with a 12.5lb tactical style rifle. With a good rucksack style sling it's ok to lug around. I had no problems off hand shooting either. A medium weight custom barrel in an ultra light hunter/varmint style stock would be a better choice for the hills. Plenty accurate and not too heavy. 308 is a good choice.

edi

[Chris-NZ]

... a 12.5lb tactical style rifle... it's ok to lug around. ..

edi

 

You're a tougher man than me Edi (or more solid between the ears..)

 

I'd feel a pure deer rifle should weigh no more than 8lbs all-up though most UK shooters aren't dealing with the mountains we have here.

Maybe I've got the luxury of having a dedicated deer rifle that doesn't have to fill any other roles.

 

Chris-NZ

[Scotch_egg]

Jack of all trades master of non.

 

 

Get yourself a factory .308 for stalking and a nice spendy custom for the range. Because when you trip, slip and fall on your pride and joy that is not Goverment owned you will want to cry.

 

Plus get a grip man. Choosing a calibre on poweder choice are you for real?

 

A little discipline during the reloading process is all that is required. If you can't follow basic steps you shouldn't be reloading.

[achosenman]

IMHO there is a price/trade off with everything.

 

I demand accuracy from a deer rifle. If it won’t shoot .5 or smaller for at least 5 rounds and withstand getting dragged up a Scottish mountain or knocked about, it won’t be used by me in the field. My rifle weigh’s around 12.8lbs. Then add a 28ltr day sack and Zeiss RF bins, tripod etc then it helps to be fit...ish. I’m prepared to pay the price in weight etc for what I want.

 

One rifle will cope easily with stalking and range use. Depending on the discipline, it could be competitive. A 308 with its long barrel life etc would be my choice.

 

The plus side is you can spend your finite cash pot on one rifle and get an all singing and dancing Zeiss/S&B or whatever your preference is, instead of two or three mediocre rifles/scopes etc that in reality are more safe queens, than anything else.

 

It’s your money and your choice. If you want to find a one powder solution for your rifles, I believe that’s as valid a reason for the choices you make as the choices and compromises others have made for themselves.

 

ATB

[tackb]

308 is a great all round calibre and mine works well with a heavy 20" tube , i aggree with achosenman and i keep myself fit so i can carry the rifle i want up the hill , but to be honest you are going to have to compromise somewhere ?

 

you could explore having two stocks ? a hunter style and a mcmillan A5/Ai/whatever blows your skirt up for targets?

 

oh and i use varget in my 223 with 75g amax and varget in my 308 with a 168g amax so you may want to look at that powder?

[silent-varminter]

Jack of all trades master of non.

 

 

Get yourself a factory .308 for stalking and a nice spendy custom for the range. Because when you trip, slip and fall on your pride and joy that is not Goverment owned you will want to cry.

 

Plus get a grip man. Choosing a calibre on poweder choice are you for real?

 

A little discipline during the reloading process is all that is required. If you can't follow basic steps you shouldn't be reloading.

 

I havent chose the caliber primarily on powder, it says in my description that i wanted to go for a .308 anyway and because i can use that powder for both the .223 and in the .308 it worked out better. I use an auto dispenser for reloading, so not having to drain all the powder out of this to put in other powder and have to do the same process again to load .223 would be a lot better in my book.

 

As for the comment about tripping and falling on the rifle, i cant agree more on that.

[silent-varminter]

There is a lot of good advice here from everyone on certain rifles.

 

I guess ill have to look into it further and look at a few different rifles before i can decide for sure. Like i said i didnt want to have a rifle for long range target and 1 for stalking, would have prefered to get 1 rifle for both jobs.

[6.5shooter]

Have a look at the "Rattel" built by Mike Norris.

It is an excellent setup, 18" barrel and an excellent dual purpose stock! Take a look on the 308 barrel length thread at the mo, there are some pictures of one there.

[DaveT]

Some very good advice given here already.

 

What you can get away with is a medium stocked rifle, say a mac M40 htg, but couple that with a 20" rem varmint profile barrel. That way you retain the relative lightness, but still have the capability for long shot strings for targets.

 

I,m just finishing a .260 rem with a 20" tube in this profile, in a sako varmint mcmillan. It is very well balanced, and not heavy. Fitted with a sensible sight , you could carry it all day. Its a deer rifle, and i,ll post some pics in a week or so to show you.

 

Multi purpose rifles ALWAYS give something up, somewhere.

[DaveT]

Bit of a screw-up with my last post.... didn't add my commentary!

 

Meant to ask Dave (Baldie) if it wouldn't be better to go for a slightly longer barrel than 20" in order to UP the velocity for long-range without getting too heavy for field use?

 

I am thinking of the Hunting stocked 260 Rem that he made for me (see his website) with a Krieger 26" heavy varmint profile barrel which I consider great for stalking (very manageable) but also use effectively for range work.

 

Compromise on 22" - 24" barrel in hunting config?

 

Satisfies 1 rifle for two purposes even if not EXACT match to disciplines.... depends how serious you are really?

 

Dave T

[Ronin]

Looking to answer the original posters question.

 

I do alot of stalking, mainly woodland with open areas grassland and some cumbrian hills...

 

 

I have three primary stalking rifles - 308, 6.5x284 and 6.5x47.

 

 

The 308 is a Blaser Tac 2 (and is for sale at present - through no fault of its own)

 

The 6.5 x 284 a semi custom Rem 700

 

The 6.5x 47 a Bat full custom ("tactical") which I intend to make into a switch barrel (308 / 6.5x47)

 

 

None are under 11 lbs

 

I'll happily carry any all day, although I do use a quad and 4wd for extraction - I need to with Reds.

 

 

 

 

Any deer legal cartridge will work - its shot placement that matters.

 

 

My 308 and 6.5x47 both double as competition guns, one could argue that these rifles are not ideal for stalking, - but they havent prevented me taking any shot in dense woodland (sub 20 yards) to open hill (more than 20 yards) in the time ive owned them.

 

 

If you want a do all rifle, its possible, but you have to compromise somewhere - weight is the usual compromise....

[ejg223]

You're a tougher man than me Edi (or more solid between the ears..)

 

I'd feel a pure deer rifle should weigh no more than 8lbs all-up though most UK shooters aren't dealing with the mountains we have here.

Maybe I've got the luxury of having a dedicated deer rifle that doesn't have to fill any other roles.

 

Chris-NZ

 

You got me wrong, of course a 10lb huntin rifle under the arm...and the tac on the back.

like my son here... wonder why he sunk in a bog hole shortly after.

edi

[Jingzy]

How much are you planning spending? What distance is the range work you are planning as this can help with the selection in barrel length. Also with the shorter barrel you will probably want a faster burning powder; n135 would probably be fine.

 

I would go for a no4 or 5 profile barrel onto a donor 700 action.

 

I just had a 22br built by RG rifles and it looks sweet with a no5 barrel and 20" length. This will be used for roe, vermin and targets and not too heavy.

[CZ Varminter]

I would like to jump in on this one, i guess my general physical condition age and well braun play a part but I lug my CZ550 Varmint around all over the place a decent sling its amazing when your used to it how it isnt as noticable. I have a great urge to swap from my 30-06 stalking rifle which is no good at range, old PH Deluxe does the job i bought it for. i would love a 30-06 or a 308 as my next choice but it would have to do both jobs stalking and long range work. So it would deffo be a tactical stock and heavy barrel with decent glass ontop. I certainly enjoy carrying my stalking rife around more than my varmint but maybe were getting soft? lol...

 

I am enjoying responses on this one so far more pics i love looking at everyones set ups.

 

CZ

[CCH]

The perfect stalking rifle...

 

Everyone will have a different idea as everyone will have their own ways of stalking and what works for me might not work for you.

 

FWIW however my thoughts on the perfect stalking rifle are:

 

Weight: - Somewhere between 8-10lbs is good for me. Too light and holding the thing still in field conditions becomes much harder, too heavy and you can't carry it between your hands for any great length of time without getting lactic acid shakes.

 

Barrel length: - I don't like moderated rifles and prefer my rifles to balance right before I put a mod on. I don't see the point of barrels less than 22-24" for a hunting rifle unless it's a primarily vehicle-based culling rifle. Stainless steel to help prevent corrosion if you have to neglect it for a short while and as heavy a contour as weight and balance allows. Blacked in some way and with a well-protected crown, recessed or some other design that will take the inevitable dings and not bugger up the muzzle threads or the crown itself.

 

Action: - Stainless steel, detachable magazine, top loading option, three position safety that locks the bolt and the firing pin as well as allowing the action to be cycled on safe. Not so tight and precise that it locks up at the first sign of mud and grit. A good trigger is always nice, as is a nice roomy trigger guard. From what I can see the Sako 75 action is the best hunting rifle action out there at the moment for this role, I'd take one over a custom action any day for this particular job for the reasons I've given.

 

Stock: - I like wood but there are many stock options out there depending on what action you go for. One way to "add" weight to the barrel is to save weight on the other parts and get a heavier contour, be aware though that an unbalanced rifle can be vile, ill-handling pig of a thing and that you may well end up exacerbating the problem by hanging a moderator on the end of the barrel.

 

Glass:- The most important bit of the rifle, you'll shoot many more deer with a £1000 scope on a £200 rifle than the other way round. This choice depends on the calibre, the style of hunting you do, your budget and your preferences. I have a Zeiss 7x50IR on a 30.06 which does me for everything in the UK and 99% of things abroad. One of these days I will replace it with a 1.7-10x42 Swaro or a 1.5-6x42 Zeiss.

 

Calibre: - The least important bit really, anything from a .243 to a 30.06 will do you for the UK. The 308 is a great round and perfect for the job. It's lower velocity than a lot of the smaller bores and so paradoxically better on small deer than them as it doesn't blow up a lot of meat whilst still dropping them handily.

 

Keep us posted whatever you decide.

[ejg223]

I have an ultra light 243 with 20" barrel but don't feel confident taking deer much over 200m with it.

For deer at longer ranges and just at 10lb all included I trust my old sako with 22" medium weight (No.5) LW match barrel

in 308. Ultra light carbon fibre stock and reliable feeding from the aics mag. Rifle has also performed quite well at

300yd targets.

edi

 

[Alycidon]

I have an ultra light 243 with 20" barrel but don't feel confident taking deer much over 200m with it.

For deer at longer ranges and just at 10lb all included I trust my old sako with 22" medium weight (No.5) LW match barrel

in 308. Ultra light carbon fibre stock and reliable feeding from the aics mag. Rifle has also performed quite well at

300yd targets.

edi

 

 

 

I did neck a Roe with a borrowed 270 a while ago at about 70 yards, I was very surprised by the lack of damage. Sweet cartridge with long reach and big knock down power if needed.

 

A