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MichalS

6,5mm Creedmore or 6,5x47L for F Open?

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" The 47 will just about get to 1000 yards " ??? We've shot these at 1200yds with surprisingly good results.

At MV of 2900fps, the 136 grain Scenar L bullets at 1000 yds are still comfortably supersonic (1423 fps,  Litz Point Mass).

Re-Pete

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2 hours ago, Re-Pete said:

" The 47 will just about get to 1000 yards " ??? We've shot these at 1200yds with surprisingly good results.

At MV of 2900fps, the 136 grain Scenar L bullets at 1000 yds are still comfortably supersonic (1423 fps,  Litz Point Mass).

Re-Pete

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Pete, I did say this was in my experience. I gave up pushing 130+ grain bullets out of my 47 at 2900 fps or more because to do that I have use barrel burning powders such as RS60. 

I don’t use anything other than H4350 to push 140/142 grain bullets in my Creedmoor and easy going at the 1000 yard distance.

 

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A comment on "barrel burning" powders..............I have a Musgrave 6BR which had an unknown round count before I bought it, and has had 2000 rounds through it since. The first 1000 or so were a stiff load of RS60, (or Elcho 17 as it was then) MV 3020fps with 105 grain Scenar's , and latterly, I've used RS52 also with 105 Scenar "L"'s  at an MV of 2900fps. I've shot this at 1000yds with some surprisingly good results. The barrel is a Lothar 30" 8 twist, and chatter marks from the button rifling machine are still just visible. Some crazy paving is also visible in the throat area.................

Since I've had it, the freebore has increased noticeably but not excessively, around 20-25 thou. and It will still shoot 1/2 MOA at 300yds on a good day.

My 6.5x47, (also a Lothar barrel,) has done 2150 rounds of 136 Scenar L's at 2900fps (RS60), and shows less than 20 thou increase in freebore since it was built.

Having said all that, I consider a barrel to be a consumable, a bit like a car clutch lining.......................but I fully understand other points of view.

Just don't get me started on "breaking in" new barrels................!!!!!!!!!!

Re-Pete

 

 

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Go with 6.5x47l you don't want to be just another sheep following the pack do you?  Anyone serious about shooting is handloading so the factory ammo thing is a non issue.  My 6.5x47l pushes 139 scenars using H4350 at 2750fps at a relatively moderate pressure of 58k psi according to quick load.  I could get it over 2800fps at max pressure 63kpsi with H4350 if I wanted to.  If I wanted to improve on this I wouldn't be looking at the creedmoor maybe a 260AI or something that can give a legit boost.

If you ask this question to the BR crowd over on accurate shooter I would think the response would be in favour of the 47l over the creedmoor. 

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31 minutes ago, ofrn said:

Go with 6.5x47l you don't want to be just another sheep following the pack do you?

From the replies to this thread, the UK 'pack' (I think that should be flock!) is following 47L. There seems to be fairly consistent hate on the CM on all those Bookface groups and whatnot, not sure why, apart from the fact its 'new' and become successful and popular in the US... Its all "x47 is betterer" or "x55 is still the bestest, theres a reason its still so popular after a trillion years" - and so fourth. I wonder how many have the shooting prowess to make the choice between 260Rem, 6.4x47L, 6.5CM, 6.5x55 et cetera of that great significance? :)

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1 hour ago, GT3_richy said:

From the replies to this thread, the UK 'pack' (I think that should be flock!) is following 47L. There seems to be fairly consistent hate on the CM on all those Bookface groups and whatnot, not sure why, apart from the fact its 'new' and become successful and popular in the US... Its all "x47 is betterer" or "x55 is still the bestest, theres a reason its still so popular after a trillion years" - and so fourth. I wonder how many have the shooting prowess to make the choice between 260Rem, 6.4x47L, 6.5CM, 6.5x55 et cetera of that great significance? :)

Yup it makes my day to see soo many 47l supporters here in what is probably a group of fairly serious shooters.

I'm not sure about what you are getting at with the rest of your post but personally I cringe every time I see the word creedmoor spamming forums and facebook groups.  I get why its successful because of the factory ammo and support from many different companies etc. For the serious shooter who handloads I don't consider it "better" than the 47l. The 47l is slightly more efficient less powder for very similar velocities. One maybe could argue the 47l is easier to find accurate loads for.  Either way like I said for a decent improvement in velocity (at the cost of barrel life) one needs to step up to something like 260ai or 6.5-284.

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Gadarene - "involving or engaged in a headlong or potentially disastrous rush to do something". Also referring to swine !

Just learned a new word, thanks Laurie ?

I do like my Creedmoor though and am looking forward to the new Sako 120gr ammunition as / when / if it becomes available.

OFRN - cringe away matey.

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If you want extra velocities above the 47 then the obvious choice is the 6.5x284.extra velocity comes with the extra throat wear.changing to the creedmoor from the 47 seems pointless

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I really don't understand all the angst that some have against the 6.5CM.  It's no "miracle" calibre, but it is still an efficient and very accurate chambering with one or two long range advantages over the 6x47.  "Following the sheep" as someone put it above, has nothing really to do with the choice unless one counts one's own vanity in the choice.  I did the usual agonising over "which 6.5?" when in the market, but for me, the (on paper) advantages and ammo availability persuaded me to the CM...that and more factory rifle options being available hence better choice unless going the custom route.   The 6 x 47 is deserving of its reputation and seems to be the "de-rigour" choice for 300 especially and whilst more than capable of 1000 yard shooting, the CM can deliver higher pressures and hence MVs making good use of the heavier, higher BC bullets.  Whether the steep shoulder angle really does do anything for concentricity of round to bore as an advantage is a very moot point, especially in factory offerings.

Out of interest from those who shoot 6 x 47....what load would you need in a single base powder under a 139 scenar to deliver 2800fps?  (I'm assuming it would be about the same as for CM...so if considering RS62...42.5 to 43gr?).  Would 6 x 47 have the spare case capacity under the bullet to achieve this?

I agree that changing from a 6 x 47 to a CM is pretty pointless, as it would arguably be going from any other 6.5 to a CM.  They all are capable of probably far more than a majority of those behind the trigger, so buying choice for longer distance may come down to choice of factory rifle offering and ammo.  From that perspective, CM seems a bit of a no-brainer amongst the 6.5 crowd if buying into the calibre for the first time and constrained to factory rifles and ammo.  That's genuinely not meant to be contentious...just an observation on availability.  

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Ive chronied 139gr scenars with 39.8grs of H4350 at 2800fps plus from 27 inch tube and even faster on 39grs of RS60.never tried above above 39grs as I was going to.use RS60 .not sure on weather conditions off the top of my head. Recently tried some RS62 with the scenars at 600yds and they shot great and in the same place as the H4350 load did.ive not chronied them yet.

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I think that the 27 inch tube is the thing here.  You might expect something like a 65 to 75fps advantage over a 24 inch tube, so in a 24 inch barrel, that's likely be low 2700's, still good for 1000 yds.  Must admit, I favour RS62 in the CM.

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