Gandy Posted June 21, 2010 Report Share Posted June 21, 2010 I saw that riflecraft do a course on long range shooting and wondered if anyone on here has been to one or would recommend an alternative. I can shoot and (think) I know a lot of the theory but much prefer to be shown things that to read them. Any good ideas? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brown dog Posted June 21, 2010 Report Share Posted June 21, 2010 I saw that riflecraft do a course on long range shooting and wondered if anyone on here has been to one or would recommend an alternative. I can shoot and (think) I know a lot of the theory but much prefer to be shown things that to read them. Any good ideas? I wouldn't recommend the course you've mentioned, run by an ex-TA sniper who "qualified" back when even the regular snipers didn't know what they were doing! But... I would recommend a fellow (who'll spill his tea if he sees I've recommended him ) who runs TBF Systems; based oop North. Can't spot TBF on the web. Have a look, if you can't find anything I'll ask if he is happy for me to share his details. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxshooter Posted June 21, 2010 Report Share Posted June 21, 2010 I saw that riflecraft do a course on long range shooting and wondered if anyone on here has been to one or would recommend an alternative. I can shoot and (think) I know a lot of the theory but much prefer to be shown things that to read them. Any good ideas? The Riflecraft module 2 course is a good one. I'd better declare Iam a little biased. I have done the course a couple of times myself and have helped out running the range day on several other occasions plus shot the range day as a guest a few times. The course is a 2 day affair, I'm sure you have seen the course content so I wont waffle on about that too much except to say that it is very educational and will teach you a lot about ranging targets of known size at unknown distances as wel as covering angle shooting (up/ down hill) and wind. The second day is usually spent on a field firing range on Thetford battle area, It used to be Frog Hill but is now more likely to be Robins Lodge. Ranges at Fingringhoe and others have been used if the Mlitary make booking a range difficult due to Afgan and Iraq troop rotations. After a zero session for anyone who needs it and a chrono session you wlll be given a print out for your load from Sierra Infinity if you dont already have this sort of information. You then have a sit down and work out your come ups while the others get their zero and chrono sorted. Now you are presented with a selection of Fig 11 ETR targets. You know the size as its given to you, now calculate the range as you have been shown in the class, dial the corrections for range and wind and with the aid of a partner to spot for you shoot it! (or at it anyway LOL) Targets vary from roughly 400 to 1400m and are not at fixed distances eg 400, 550, 800m etc You will need to learn to read the wind as there can be patches of dead ground not visible from the FP where the wind doesnt behave as you might expect Its a good couple of days and once you've done the course once you can stick your name down to come back again on the range days when the course is run in the future so you can have some more range time for just a range fee. You dont get the instruction on the range days as you wil shoot the opposite end of the firing line to the students but all the other shooters there are ex students and competent shots so we all help each other out as needed. The guests have their own RCO/ Safety supervisor and to an extent are independent of the running class. If there is anything I can help you with just ask or drop me pm Mark Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Foxshooter Posted June 21, 2010 Report Share Posted June 21, 2010 I wouldn't recommend the course you've mentioned, run by an ex-TA sniper who qualified back when even the regular snipers didn't know what they were doing! I didnt realise Andrew was in the TA...... Since Riflecraft have taught long range shooting to some of the SF boys I'm inclined to believe they know what they are talking about. Guys I know who have helped out teaching on his courses have all been ex military including Pathfinder and Hereford based SF snipers (no I'm not bullshitting) I'll openly declare that I consider Andrew a friend and have known him for a lot of years now but he knows his stuff and his client list tends to back that up Mark I'd like to have a go shooting at WMS as that day looks to be very educational. Its a shame its so damn far away Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elwood Posted June 21, 2010 Report Share Posted June 21, 2010 I can't speak for Rifle craft, but I have had a wind reading lesson with the guy that BD mentions from TBF systems and he certainly knows his onions. All I have to do now is convert what I learnt into V bulls ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gandy Posted June 21, 2010 Author Report Share Posted June 21, 2010 I would recommend a fellow (who'll spill his tea if he sees I've recommended him ) who runs TBF Systems; based in Derbyshire. Can't spot TBF on the web. Have a look, if you can't find anything I'll ask if he is happy for me to share his details. I can't speak for Rifle craft, but I have had a wind reading lesson with the guy that BD mentions from TBF systems and he certainly knows his onions.All I have to do know his convert what I learnt into V bulls ! Can’t seem to find TBF anywhere on the web (well only airport conveyers and Vehicle Sales) if you have any contact details I would be very grateful. Cheers, Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brown dog Posted June 21, 2010 Report Share Posted June 21, 2010 I didnt realise Andrew was in the TA...... Mark, "Not a lot of people know that" I believe that after regular service in a non-infantry Teeth-Arm (a Teeth-Arm with no sniping roles) he left the Army & joined a TA infantry unit; and it was as a TA infanteer that he did a TA sniper 'course' of some sort - waay back. Of course, I could be wrong Ask him Andy, I'll drop the TBF fellow a line Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
LONG RANGE CAPT Posted June 21, 2010 Report Share Posted June 21, 2010 Further on from Brown dogs comments. I have had the benefit of doing a number of courses with the above mentioned people: Took the riflecraft course a few years ago and completed a number of training sessions with TBF systems. All the above offer something, if you just want a bit of extra knowledge the riflecraft course will give you that and is more than good enough for the hobby shooter. If you really want to get as close as possible to military long range precision shooting and have the genuine desire to push yourself. Then TBF Systems is the a close as you will get to military long range shooting you can get as a ''civi'' in this country. Kind Regards Rob Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gandy Posted June 21, 2010 Author Report Share Posted June 21, 2010 If you really want to get as close as possible to military long range precision shooting and have the genuine desire to push yourself. Then TBF Systems is the a close as you will get to military long range shooting you can get as a ''civi'' in this country. TBF it is then just need the contact deatils please... Anyone. Cheers for all posts, Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mash67 Posted June 21, 2010 Report Share Posted June 21, 2010 hi i'd also like some long range tuition, and this sound just the job. if there is any info available for me i would also be gratefull thanks matt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brown dog Posted June 21, 2010 Report Share Posted June 21, 2010 TBF it is then just need the contact deatils please... Anyone. TBF fellow is a bit private. I've sent him an email; I'll let you know what he comes back with. (try to enjoy the suspense & mystery ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baldie Posted June 21, 2010 Report Share Posted June 21, 2010 Is this the "rocket man " BD ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duey Posted June 21, 2010 Report Share Posted June 21, 2010 i have had several courses with TBF ands can highly recomend them but due to his other commitments now its very rare that he runs a course but i do believe that he will do idividual days on a 1 on 1 basis when BD gets a reply it may be worth enquiring if he would be willing to do a couple ov small groups highly recomended if you get the chance Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Millwall Paul Posted June 21, 2010 Report Share Posted June 21, 2010 I completed the Riflecraft stage 1 course a few years ago, their classroom session was very informative and enjoyable. I did have a few hiccups on the second day at the range as i was using one of their loaner rifles. When initially zeroing it after 15 shots missing the target board I then found out from one of the instructers that they had found the reason why, one of their office staff had wound the scope as far left and as far up as they could for some reason. Once zeroed it was great fun. When it came to the shooting test I don't know why but I had a serious zero shift on the rifle I had been shooting all morning, about 6 inches low and too the right, it coinsided right with being given a new batch of ammunition. Instead of rezeroing the rifle i used one of their worked over rifles which was very nice to shoot, everything went well but unfortunately i dropped a shot and was told to use opne of the two spare shots they give you. The range officer had already made me empty my pockets of any ammunition as with the rifle swap it went from a 308 to a 243. The range officer then dropped a round into the chamber for me to fire, I tried to push the bolt forward and it became 'stuck'. I reported this to the range officer who rolled his eyes at me and told me to push the bolt harder. I refused and told him it was jammed at which point he took the rifle off me and 'really pushed' the bolt forward and then gave me the rifle back and said to push the bolt down and commence firing when ready. I felt the bolt and it appeared to be solid so politely refused to proceed. He then said to empty the chamber, when i did the round that was ejected was a 308! I just looked at the range officer and he just said oops sorry about that these things happen, or words to that effect. I then put in a 243 round and passed the test. With hindsight looking back, I should have insisted on loading my own rifle, but as this was my first real taster of centre fire rifles and I was a complete novice taking the course so that I could get my FAC granted I knew very little except what i had been tought the day before. I would still however recommend the course, but only if you were using your own rifle as I thought the standard remmy 700's with the synthetic stock were very poor. (between shooting off the bipod to shooting on sticks you had to aim off to compensate on the sticks) Now as I'm shooting a Sako i know that with a free floated barrel and decent stock you don't have to do that, or at least not with my gun or any gun for that matter that I've shot since. I have'nt been back since, the first course put me off a bit plus I don't really shoot over 200 yards or have the need to so therefore my scope is a basic swarovski without target turrets. I would still like to do their level 2 course, just to improve my shooting at longer ranges and to learn more about the ballistics of my rifle. All the guys that worked for riflecracft all certainly seemed to know their stuff and were all very keen to help you learn and were a bloody good laugh down the pub. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gandy Posted June 21, 2010 Author Report Share Posted June 21, 2010 Sounds like we will be class mates. hii'd also like some long range tuition, and this sound just the job. if there is any info available for me i would also be gratefull Suspense and mystery, sounds exciting, discression assured. I can pm full details and referances if it helps? TBF fellow is a bit private. I've sent him an email; I'll let you know what he comes back with. (try to enjoy the suspense & mystery ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ronin Posted June 21, 2010 Report Share Posted June 21, 2010 I would be interested in some "tuition" for extended range. (with TBF) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brown dog Posted June 21, 2010 Report Share Posted June 21, 2010 I would be interested in some "tuition" for extended range.(with TBF) ..................Tw@t Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mash67 Posted June 21, 2010 Report Share Posted June 21, 2010 Sounds like we will be class mates. Suspense and mystery, sounds exciting, discression assured. I can pm full details and referances if it helps? sounds great,a bit of mystery adds to it all. i have started to make some longer shots but need to get the hit ratio down,my wind judging is my main problem,that and being a bit more constant with the shooting bit matt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gandy Posted June 21, 2010 Author Report Share Posted June 21, 2010 sounds great,a bit of mystery adds to it all.i have started to make some longer shots but need to get the hit ratio down,my wind judging is my main problem,that and being a bit more constant with the shooting bit matt Same here mate constancy is the thing with me but not really taking shots of any note as of yet. Soon to change hopefully! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elwood Posted June 22, 2010 Report Share Posted June 22, 2010 Be warned, he's not cheap, but it's worth it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
duey Posted June 22, 2010 Report Share Posted June 22, 2010 and rifle craft courses are !!!!???? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gandy Posted June 22, 2010 Author Report Share Posted June 22, 2010 Pay cheap pay twice as my old man says! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mash67 Posted June 23, 2010 Report Share Posted June 23, 2010 hi any news or is it a no go matt Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
brown dog Posted June 23, 2010 Report Share Posted June 23, 2010 hiany news or is it a no go matt Still waiting for a reply to my email; I'll chase after the w/e if I've still heard nothing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ballistic Hamster Posted June 24, 2010 Report Share Posted June 24, 2010 Still waiting for a reply to my email; I'll chase after the w/e if I've still heard nothing. Have you upset him Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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