wabbit evaporator Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 I am currently in the market for a new scope and had my heart absolutely set on a big Schmidt, specifically a 5-25x56 PMII. However having had a fair old mosey about I have come across a few comments suggesting the glass isn't up to the level it should be at this price tag. Its a huge amount of money and before proceeding I wanted to make damn sure that I wasn't about to make a very expensive mistake. One of the most important factors for me in purchasing this new scope is the quality of the glass- my stalking and sporting rifles all have Swaro glass on them and I have yet to find better. A trip to the shooting show ensued where I was able to lay eyes and in some cases hands, on the various scopes I have been considering. However I wasn't able to compare any of the scopes side by side and I am afraid that I don't consider peering through a £2k+ piece of precision optical engineering at a "target" 50 yards away at most to be a particularly useful test. As such yesterday with the help of a couple of mates I was able to have a proper look at the following scopes: Schmidt 5-25x 56 PMII, Nightforce NXS 8-32 (with zero stop), Zeiss Victory 6-24 x 56 (admittedly a couple of years old), a Swaro 5-30x 50 GII, a Leica Magnus 2.4-16x56 and a Sightron siii 8-32 x56. All of the above scopes had different reticules, different mag ranges and different turrets, all I was interested in was the glass quality. Quite clearly this still wasn't a particularly objective test, we weren't using any instrumentation, just the Mk.1 eyeball. We compared the scopes on 12 power and full-mag looking at an opticians chart at 100 yards and 500 yards. All three of us came to the same conclusion........ There was absolutely nothing between the Swaro, Schmidt, Zeiss and Leica, they are all optically superb. Light was good, bright day and we did this at 3pm. The Nightforce and Sightron whilst not poor by any stretch of the imagination just weren't in the same league. More distortion both chromatic and in clarity towards the image edge, less bright an image (here the Swaro was probably top by a whisker but could be making that up...) and less general resolution. I would be fascinated to hear others thoughts on this. I really could not tell any difference between the Schmidt and the rest and am just about to unleash the credit card......... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gandy Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 Having had a nightforce Schmidt and swaro, if its pure best glass your after, the swaro are the best in my opinion. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
triggersqueezer Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 i have just sold a z6i for a pm2,if i was to be very very picky i might say the glass has the edge in the swaro.that said the scmidt wins hands down in every other way . swaro for pure hunting, schmidt for target shooting in my opinion. mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tiff Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 IOR have come on a long way recently and with new Schott glass are well worth serious consideration. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
onehole Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 ,,,,I,ve had most "top end" scopes over the last 20 years or so but went back to nightforce mainly because I only really shoot afternoons and early evenings for bunnies and occasional fox and just love the DD reticule and use 12 to 15x most of the time.I dial everything so the nightforce turrets are a big plus here.Glass quality is ok but I do wish for better sometimes.Wish nightforce could improve this one and only weakness. If I were to ditch my nightforces then it would be an easy choice,,,,,,,Zeiss Hensoldts,,,,,, cheers Onehole. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ejg223 Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 I prefer the Kahles 624 to the 5-25 any day. What about the new 3.5-26 x56 Hensoldt? could be interesting too. edi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hatzi Posted February 20, 2013 Report Share Posted February 20, 2013 I find it easy to agree with many of the comments here andcertainly that swaro glass is just that little bit special but for the target or tactical shooter the schmidt and nightforce scopes certainly hold the edge with turret designs and mechanics and zeiss seem just a little bit limited on adjustablitiy. I just received a 3-20 PMIi today and am looking forward to see what has changed compared to my recently sold 12-50 pmIi and 5 year old 5-25. Im still waiting on the kahles which could be the holy grail in terms of the swaro glass coupled with target/tac mechanics and adjustablity. The newer nightforce look interesting but they are still playing catch up on glass. march are awesome in good light both mechanically and optically but still lag in poorer light and they are sooooo expensive??? i think when i really weigh up all the options I would buy a Sightron at one end or a Scmidt at the other. The new 3-27x56 looks very interesting although I must agree with the turret clicks being just a little too close together even with the new MTC option. nothing really wins outright, our needs are so individual along with our pockets and preferences and I will tell you this, my left eye prefers subtleties my right eye detests and vice versa so it is hardly surprising that one mans eyes have a different preference to those of another. i personally own 4 scopes, all are S&B's but each has drawbacks when analysed objectively Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Grouse Posted February 21, 2013 Report Share Posted February 21, 2013 A very sound post Hatzi... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roe Posted February 21, 2013 Report Share Posted February 21, 2013 You have to make a compromize somewhere. I opted for reliability and thus the S&B. Today I would probably choose Kahles. Zeiss and Swarovski are excellent hunter scopes, not so good longrange. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Corkonian Posted February 28, 2013 Report Share Posted February 28, 2013 I've been watching that new Hensoldt for a year Edi - €5000 according to finnaccuracy and out next month. That's serious money in fairness - it would be very difficult to justify spending that much. If you get one you have to call me for a look at it I prefer the Kahles 624 to the 5-25 any day.What about the new 3.5-26 x56 Hensoldt? could be interesting too. edi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ejg223 Posted February 28, 2013 Report Share Posted February 28, 2013 Corkonian, I just mentioned it because a friend of mine was testing it last year and thought it was quite good. I have the Kahles and happy with it, will use it mainly this summer. Looking forward to the IWA end next week to see what's new. edi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kent Posted March 1, 2013 Report Share Posted March 1, 2013 Are any new top end scopes worth the cash at present? I don't think so but its more to do with money markets than glass, there aint a scope in my cabinet I couldn't sell second hand for more than I paid new if I wished. For ruggedness and low light I like S+B I once dropped a gun from a highseat and it landed on the scope, I thought "well that's the end of that" yet it didn't even loose its set zero Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
andy Posted March 1, 2013 Report Share Posted March 1, 2013 Hi, If you've not yet decided on a choice, check this guy out, he goes into good detail and has no favorites. http://opticsthoughts.com/index.php/rifle-scopes/4-rifle-scope-reviews Regards Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terryh Posted March 2, 2013 Report Share Posted March 2, 2013 W.E. At least you've had a chance to do a side by comparison of scopes which is more than most get do do before a significant outlay, You can now choose what works for you. It reads as if you arrived to the basic conclusion that there's not much between scopes once you reach a certain level, down to features, or as other have said compromise and your eyes. A friend organised a similar test a while back and came to the same outcome: http://forum.snipershide.com/showthread.php?t=16628&page=4&highlight=Tburkes Do not think you'll be disappointed with a PM2, used a 4-16 followed by a 5-25 for years. Only swapped to a March as it was more compact and no sticky out bits. The Kahles looks nice and has good features, like the parallax on the top, means true ambidextrous. Your buying it, so its your choice at the end of the day. Brgds Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ChrisF Posted March 8, 2013 Report Share Posted March 8, 2013 The new Zeiss 3.5-26x56mm is interesting , other than the high cost , my small gripes are 1) the MTC clicks & 2 ) the CCW turn direction . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
amssmith Posted March 14, 2013 Report Share Posted March 14, 2013 I got talking with Graeme Clarke of Sporting Services whilst at the shooting show. For anyone In the market for a Schimdt and struggling to get the spec they want, I can highly recommend his service in sourcing the exact scope direct from the manufacturer and having a selection available. Having realised I needed a higher mag he suggested he could order a 5x25 PMII and take my almost new 3x12 PMII in part ex at a very fair price. Was only a matter of weeks and it was ready for collection and fortunately I'm not to far away Even better he had a variety of new 3x20 PMII's in stock and as that was the next on the shopping list I was able to compare side by side and make my selection. Couldn't really afford it, but couldn't afford not to buy if you know what I mean! Hopefully this helps others as I had previously spent several hours searching the Internet without much success, as everywhere I called seemed to be not in stock and special order only, with uncertain delivery date or some complex offer to source indirectly -whatever that meant Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
20series Posted March 15, 2013 Report Share Posted March 15, 2013 What about March?? They make some nice scopes in the same price range as all those mentioned, there's even one for sale on here! (nothing to do with me) Alan Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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