Tactical rifle build

[terryh]

Gents

 

Prompted by the ‘which cartridge’ thread and a brief conversation with (Baldlie) Dave re. Tactical rifle builds I thought I'd throw out my rifle build and the reasoning behind it for critical review, hoping to both give people an insight but to also gain some others peoples views on improving things, I find rifles very much a WIP, so here goes…….

 

My rifle is biased towards US tactical matches but should work pretty much with any move and shoot, multi-positional comps.

 

Cartridge.

 

Currently a 6.5x47. I started with a 308/175SMK set up but about 6 years ago the ‘windcheater’ came on the seen, the first I cam across was a 243 shooting 115 DTAC’s – 30% less elevation @1000 and less than half the wind. The 6.5x47 works out past 1000 yards (most comps are 1000 or less, with majority of shots under 800) and you can get a good quantity onto an airplane – 5kg max per person, 25kg max per plane.

 

Barrel

 

Went over to a 5C/5R profile on the 308, carried this into the 6.5x47. To me odd numbers of lands/groove makes sense – less squeeze on the bullet plus the canted groove seems to help both velocity and time between cleaning, no proof on this, just the feeling ! I kept the barrel length to 25” as a compromise between velocity and the ability to move around – you have to climb in/out/over with your rifle, I also added a Smith industries flash suppresser as a muzzle protector. Comment on muzzle breaks, if you really need one (do you?) make sure it’s not the Vias/pepper pot design, great out on a wet range but in the dry with a facing wind you blow dust/dirt into yours and the guys next to you’s rifle! Any good make of barrel, let your Smith advise you. I’ve had good experience with Broughton and Bartlien. Keep the profile sensible. MTU’s get a bit heavy, a mid or heavy Palma is a nice balance (and the same as used in AI’s).

 

 

Action and trigger

 

This is up to you and your budget. I started with a trued Remington which worked but now run a Surgeon. Your call on this, the rifles going to be your pride and joy!

 

Triggers are another matter, and this is just my personal comment. I started with a Jewell, great trigger against which all other are judged – but it failed under hard use. During a 25 hour comp where the conditions changed drastically it stopped working; along with the 4-5 other Jewell’s present (so it was not just me). Cleaned out it functioned again. I now run a Rifle Basics which is just fine. Remember you will be running around and shooting rapidly against the clock – you will not need a 8oz trigger.

 

Stock & magazine

 

This is up to you, get behind the stock you ‘fancy' and see if it works for you. Examples of stocks I’d look at would be the AI ASIC’s, McMillan ‘A’ series, Manners and Sentinel. It needs to be ambidextrous and have a detachable magazine system, the AI miags are reliable and available. The are some mag systems/action that take both ASIC and AW mags which is nice. I currently use a Sentinel stock by Terry Cross and found it and it’s magazine release to be very ergonomic.

 

Scope

 

I use a FFP mildot scope for the simple reason that I can range with it at any power, leads on moving targets are the same at any power and I can correct or call fall of shot when working as a team. A zero stop on your scope is a nice touch. Good low light performance is also essential as shoot go into the night using poor artificial lighting. S&B come to mind but Hensolt, USO, March all work and are reliable.

 

Accessories

 

Other essentials you must put into your budget would be a good sling, TAB or TIS, a bi-pod, traditionally Harris but now Atlas (try one, you’ll like it!) some form of rifle cover/slip/drag bag personally I found the TAB item to be perfect in actual use. Rear bag, yes an old sock of rice will work but come on, £3500 on a rifle and scope but not £15 on a rear bag!!!!

Drop charts/tables, wind meter, small back pack to carry all your kit + wet weather clothing etc. all equipment that will help you – but buy a small pack, it makes you think about what you really need.

 

In addition to the above I take some spares and maintenance tools when travelling. Cleaning kit, lens lit, spare firing pin assembly and complete trigger along with a torque wrench (the Borka’s neat) and basic tools. Anything small that can break or come loose.

 

Hope that’s a starting point for discussion or comment, I’ve tried not rambled too much but made you think about what you want your tactical rifle to do.

 

Terry

[c18rch]

I'm planning my own tactical build for later this year. I'm going to re-barrel my Rem 700 .243 to 7-08. I ran the ballistics on several 6.5 and 7mm cartridges that would fit in a detachable short action mag without modifying the action or short seating the bullets and 162gr A-Max in 7-08 seems to beat them all at 1000yds. Plus, I've always wanted a 7mm .

 

Stock is a HS Precision as used on the M24 which I am going to fit a detachable mag sys of some description to. Currently it looks like an M24 clone which wasn't intentional when I built it.

 

Barrel - Pac Nor Polygonal 24 - 26" medium palma 1in8

 

Scope - 6.5-20 Leupold Mk4 - Not the best glass but in terms of reliability I don't think you can beat them without spending lots more on a S&B or US optics.

[6.5shooter]

I'm planning my own tactical build for later this year. I'm going to re-barrel my Rem 700 .243 to 7-08. I ran the ballistics on several 6.5 and 7mm cartridges that would fit in a detachable short action mag without modifying the action or short seating the bullets and 162gr A-Max in 7-08 seems to beat them all at 1000yds. Plus, I've always wanted a 7mm .

 

Stock is a HS Precision as used on the M24 which I am going to fit a detachable mag sys of some description to. Currently it looks like an M24 clone which wasn't intentional when I built it.

 

Barrel - Pac Nor Polygonal 24 - 26" medium palma 1in8

 

Scope - 6.5-20 Leupold Mk4 - Not the best glass but in terms of reliability I don't think you can beat them without spending lots more on a S&B or US optics.

 

 

 

The 162 amax are quite long and I would imagine they would take up quite a bit of case space if being fed from a magazine.

I think the 6.5 cartridges are the way to go if mag feeding because they are a good comprimise.

You will find youre 7-08 being a disappointment velocity wise if mag feeding if its purely for target but quite a nice round for hunting.

Just my 2p

 

Garry

[c18rch]

You can just about get a 162 A-max to feed from a .284 case in a short action AI mag:

 

http://www.6mmbr.com/gunweek095.html

 

My thoughts on this build being that by using a slightly shorter case some of the problems will not be present, brass will be easier to obtain and I can use the new .260 Lap brass necked up. Because you have to shor seat the bullets in .284 the velocity loss by using a 7-08 should not be significant (2700fps as apposed to 2800fps).

 

http://www.6mmbr.com/7mm284.html

 

This should give a drop of 29.5 MOA at 1000yds from 200yd zero.

 

A 6.5x47 running a 140gr A-Max at 2750 fps should give a drop of 30.5 MOA at 1000yds from 200yd zero.

 

Only a 1 MOA difference but still. There is also just under a 1 MOA difference in windage too.

 

I should add that these calcs are based on published BC and reloading data so they may not be the best but they are all I have to go on until I build the rifle.

 

The brass is also cheaper for 7-08 with a wider choice of manufacturers.

[6.5shooter]

Let us know how it turns out for you!

Would be intersting to see.

However using 139 scenars and re17 you should be able to get between 28-2900 fps in 6.5 and that would whoop its ass

However horses for courses and Im not knocking youre idea. Would like to hear how it goes.

 

Garry

[c18rch]

Will do, but it may take a while before I get round to it or can afford it.

 

Like I said I've only used freely available data (we all know how wrong that can be) and the difference are not enought to sway me one way or the other. I just want to try something different more than anything.

 

It will be interesting to see the end product Terry. When (if you haven't already) do you intend to start building it?

 

Rich

[terryh]

Rich,

 

Had it built about 2 years now (not very good snap, sorry):

 

 

Still going strong, the stock works real well, now wears a Atlas.

 

Brgds

 

Terry

[Elwood]

Shameless post on Terry's behalf just to remind me I don't own a KMW Sentinel stock (Insert drool smiley)

[terryh]

Elwood,

 

I did restrain till asked

 

Won't say what's waiting at Gatwick for me then

 

Brgds THSLD

 

PS nice going at F-class BTW

[Scotch_egg]

I think I know what is waiting for you, perhaps a package from mr cross?

 

Terry I am not familiar with flash hiders, do they offer similar recoil management as a brake?

[terryh]

SE,

 

The flash suppressor like the Smith Enterprise unit ( see: http://www.smithenterprise.com/ ) gives no recoil reduction, it simply protects the crown should you stub the barrel into something which is easily done on a 'O' course found say at Rifles Only

 

see parts of this vedeo, especially last 1/4 for what I'm on about :

 

)

 

You do not need to tighten it up as the 'flutes' have a slight spiral on them and the gasses keep it tight. It has the same thread as my suppressor (5/8 UNEF) so is a thread and crown protector.

 

brgds Terry

[ds1]

Hi Terry,

 

I think your rifle shows that you have an excellent understanding of what works best for the type of comps you do.

 

I think what makes a rifle build work, or not is understanding the type of rifle comps you are doing, for example a rifle made for comps with multi position, movement and movers is going to end up a bit different than one say built for Mc Queens - where you could say have a very heavy build and heavy barrel profile in 6mm something, plus a S&B 12-50x56 scope (widest FOV with high mag).

 

One rifle which I think can cross-over several comps well is the DTA rifle - short and compact for off-hand and any number quick change of barrel and caliier options.

 

A bit of a different philosophy would be the Tubb 2K - ergonomics first and let the form follow. I may be drinking too much cool aid but I like Tubbs whole concept behind the T2k.

 

About 20 years ago when Bob Clark introduced the straight pull AR15 Speedmaster I thought that it was cool, now I think he was a genius - lego build AR15`s that do most very things well, within the limits of a 223 without wweighing a ton.

 

A pic below of my lastest project leaving the USA today - RND 800, 308 win, 3.17kg with carbon barrel, semi auto. Built for comps with movement and position stuff - the downside with AR10 system is the sloooow lock time.

 

[John MH]

 

A bit of a different philosophy would be the Tubb 2K - ergonomics first and let the form follow. I may be drinking too much cool aid but I like Tubbs whole concept behind the T2k.

 

 

I like the t2k as well. I have barrels for mine in .308 (x2) 6mmXC (x7) and .260(x1)

 

 

This was my take on a "Tactical" configuration (excusing the colour) as its rigged in .308 with a 21" barrel and Tubb Muzzle Brake.

[brown dog]

I like the t2k as well. I have barrels for mine in .308 (x2) 6mmXC (x7) and .260(x1)

 

 

This was my take on a "Tactical" configuration (excusing the colour) as its rigged in .308 with a 21" barrel and Tubb Muzzle Brake.

 

John,

 

What sort of price is one of those once it's in UK?

[John MH]

The only one's I've seen were all personal imports, mine is serial numbered in the 400s and when I got it from Creedmoor Sports it was $2750 with one barrel and 2 x 10 round mags. They now retail at $4995 from Creedmoor so I don't expect you'd get one for less than £5k new in the UK.

 

Beauty of them is I can change a barrel in less than 5 minutes, I have 3 butts already configured for standing, sitting and prone and the are adjustable in more ways than you can think so you can make the gun fit you and not fit yourself to the gun, finally the trigger is out of this world, its an Anschutz target rifle trigger that gives a really crisp 2 stage pull.

 

I doubt I will ever get rid of mine and I certainly wont run out of barrels as I've only just started on my second 6XC, first lasted over 3000 rounds and is now only used for short range practice.