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Recommended gun and ammo for .223 and rabbits


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Hello

This is little bit related to my previous post here. I finally settled on a .223 and have had my variation approved. I applied to purchase 200 rounds and have been approved for 150.

My previous question provided a wealth of information - thank you - and I'm looking to drill into this deeper. I'm now looking to purchase a rifle and suitable ammunition, and I am looking for recommendations. I've seen recommendations for Tikka rifles, but I don't know which models. I've alsos een recommendations for GGG and Hornady ammo but there's a huge price difference between them. There's also a huge difference in 200 yards drop between GGG and Hornady due to the different gr. And then there's barrel twist....

Can anyone report on their experiences? Ideally, I want to zero around 100 or 150 and then have predictable and low drop out to 200 or so.

Apologies if these are lame questions, I come from an FAC airgun backgroun with a tin of 500 JSBs :)

Many thanks

 

Jim

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https://www.thecountryman.com/tikka-t3x-varmint-stainless-223-1-8-fast-twist-rifle-81125d-8
 

finding your rifle in actual stock can be hard work. You might have to buy and then RFD transfer it to a local dealer. Thoroughly recommend wildcat moderators and they do ask what rifle it’s to fit so they can drill the bush at the back to match the diameter of the barrel. Top marks . 
Glad you got 150 rounds, I only have 100 but homeloading helps . 
cheers and good luck 

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Hi again 

just checking with StrelokPro and it comes up with ,

52 grain Amax/Eldm hornady at 200 yards with a 100 yard zero, 3144 feet per second speed gives a 3” drop .

73grain Berger at same distance and zero doing 2674fps speed gives 5” of drop . 

Wind drift for a 10 mph wind at 90 degrees is 6” drift for the light hornady and 5” drift for the heavy Berger.


This is actual data from my loads . 
So looking at how the reticle is I’ll aim dead on for 100 and put crosshairs on top of the line of fox’s back for the longer shots . I know you’re doing rabbits so might be best dialling up . 
Zero 0.5” high at 100 yards gives a point blank range for a 0.5” kill zone of between 56 to 138 yards . 

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30 minutes ago, Richiew said:

Hi again 

just checking with StrelokPro and it comes up with ,

52 grain Amax/Eldm hornady at 200 yards with a 100 yard zero, 3144 feet per second speed gives a 3” drop .

73grain Berger at same distance and zero doing 2674fps speed gives 5” of drop . 

Wind drift for a 10 mph wind at 90 degrees is 6” drift for the light hornady and 5” drift for the heavy Berger.


This is actual data from my loads . 
So looking at how the reticle is I’ll aim dead on for 100 and put crosshairs on top of the line of fox’s back for the longer shots . I know you’re doing rabbits so might be best dialling up . 
Zero 0.5” high at 100 yards gives a point blank range for a 0.5” kill zone of between 56 to 138 yards . 

Sounds good, with my FAC airgun I've tried to get a 0.5" zone too, although obviously the ranges are much smaller; I zero at 45 with that. I need to do some resarch on ammo too; since I'm a novice with real ammo (not pellets) I won't be home-loading initially.

 

Thanks for the link to countryman website, yes, delivery to local RFD will be necessary. I'm rural-ish Scotland, and whilst I have an RFD 3 miles away they are mostly shotguns and very little ammo. So I'll probably get the gun delivered to them, and will probably have to go into Edinburgh or Glasgow for ammo. So I want to make sure I choose suitable ammo to begin with as I'll want to avoid too many trips (I requested more than 150 on the form but didn't get it). Edinburgh Rifles have a reasonable website but I've never dealt with them.

Many thanks for sticking wioth me :)

 

Jim

 

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Hi Jim 

glad to help mate as I had lots of fun finding the right rifle and then going with a local dealer to order it from GMK . Lots available at sportsman gun but mostly to order and some were a years wait . A tikka super varmint was nearly a year wait so got the standard varmint and added a tikka picatinny mount myself , so it’s nearly a super varmint but without the adjustable cheek piece. Standard tikkas have 3 shot mags whereas the varmint ones have a six shot one . Plenty of ammo choice at Glasgow fishing megastore including some cheap stuff to get the ball rolling. 
They have a green super varmint 223 1:8” in stock with 2 stage trigger( bonus ). 
Best advice is make sure it’s got 1:8” stamped on the barrel . 
Good luck 

 

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34 minutes ago, Richiew said:

Hi Jim 

glad to help mate as I had lots of fun finding the right rifle and then going with a local dealer to order it from GMK . Lots available at sportsman gun but mostly to order and some were a years wait . A tikka super varmint was nearly a year wait so got the standard varmint and added a tikka picatinny mount myself , so it’s nearly a super varmint but without the adjustable cheek piece. Standard tikkas have 3 shot mags whereas the varmint ones have a six shot one . Plenty of ammo choice at Glasgow fishing megastore including some cheap stuff to get the ball rolling. 
They have a green super varmint 223 1:8” in stock with 2 stage trigger( bonus ). 
Best advice is make sure it’s got 1:8” stamped on the barrel . 
Good luck 

 

Fantastic advice, thank you! This is my first real rifle so it's a steep curve. I really do appreciate your time.

 

Jim

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Jim.

First you will see its a big step from air rifle to .223 in costs - obviously. 

Rifle options are limited by lack of stock. Many rfd's list and sell what they don't have. Not to bothered when it turns up if they have been paid (i speak from experience). Most of the time; if its on guntrader it is in stock. Tikka are favourite factory option for good reason. Can be in for a long wait if not in stock regardless of what rfd/gmk say. Sometimes a good used one can turn up and worth consideration. On a limited budget a used one can be best value. I bought a used T3 .223 varmint stainless in new year for a £500 and it is in mint condition - after a long wait for an order of a new one that never showed up.  I have looked at every option and keep coming back to tikka.    

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Last bit of info , if you don’t already try shooting off either a tripod or primos sticks this keeps you firing in a downward angle into the ground. Be very sure of backstops etc . Warren s on hillsides are great when you can get to the other side of a small valley and shoot into the hillside. Bunnies roll to the bottom to be picked up later.

Happy shooting 

cheers Richard 

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  • 5 weeks later...

 Whatever you decide on,  don’t throw your brass . If you decide to reload further down the road you'll already have fire formed brass , if you choose to stay using factory then selling it will go toward buying more ammo .

Good call on a .223 , great choice . Before you go buy , you need to at least handle a rifle and see what suits you . A heavy barrels only real advantage in 223 will be how long it takes to heat up , it's a light recoiling round . If you're carrying it around along with other gear it might be too much , a scope and mod' will soon ramp the weight up . Don't rush your decision , easier to walk away than change your mind once it's on your f.a.c .

 There's a stunning T3 semi- custom for sale on SD but it would require screw cutting for a mod". I've no connection with the seller. 

 

 

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Hi everyone

Firstly, many thanks for all the valuable input to my query, it's much appreciated.

I ended up taking a trip to Glasgow as they had a Tikka T3x Varmint in stock. But when I got there, they showed me a Tikka T3x (non Varmint) package deal, with Steiner 6-24x50 scope, Burris mounts, moderator, bipod, shooting sticks and bag; the package deal saved around £500 versus the individual items, and given that I was starting from scratch I went for it. I bought a box of every ammo type they had :) and have had some fun hours in the field getting to know it. It's only a 1:12 twist so I know I'm limited to lighter ammo. The gun seems to prefer Federal 53gr (vmax bullets) and Gamehead 50gr; I can get the Gamehead in my local shop (4 miles away) so that's what I'm settling on.

Coming from an FAC airgun, it's quite an eye-opener. I zeroed at 100yds and then measured at 150yds and was amazed to need just one click. 200yds was 5 clicks (StrelokPro reckons 4). I'm unlikely to be shooting beyond 200, but I will measure at 300 just for reference, whenever I can get my telescope down there!

I now realise why it's VERY important to go for headshots on bunnies; I always did this with the airgun. I've only tried one bunny so far, a headshot, and there was basically nothing left of the head! So bunnies for meat, it's head only, else you just have fur left.

I have a box full of used brass shells now, and have no idea what to do with them :)

Fun times ahead. 

Thanks everyone

 

Jim

 

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 Happy days . 

 Make sure you measure accurately when entering into StrelokPro,  if your using 100 yard zero it has to be 100 yards . If you can get out to 300 and validate the velocity it'll be better. 

Most importantly,  have fun 👍 

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Good advice, thanks. Yes I'll have a go at 300 as soon as the weather improves; need to get to my "sheltered and flat field" before it becomes a pea crop :)

This may sound odd, but should te 100 yards be from the muzzle or the action? with a barrel measuring 20" it might be important :)

 

 

Jim

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1 hour ago, jimbob123 said:

This may sound odd, but should te 100 yards be from the muzzle or the action? with a barrel measuring 20" it might be important :)

It's not important.

🤢 Yes a .223 makes bunnies burst, try a .22-250 for that red mist experience ....
Bunnies to 110m are good sport for a 17HMR

"I have a box full of used brass shells now, and have no idea what to do with them "

Depending on what brass/cases you have, they are worth around 20p each, which if you have any 'Norma' i'd be happy to pay cash for (i'm near Lanark).

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I'm looking at replacing my FAC airgun for something else, and I've looked at 17HMR and 22LR. I have my 223 for out in the open fields but I currently use the airgun nearer to home, and I think the HMR would be too noisy (I don't know how noisy it is compared with the 223 though) so I'm tending towards the 22LR.

The brass is all from Gamehead and Remington. 135 so far.

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Glad you’re sorted and enjoying your new purchase, sounds like a good setup there and it’ll definitely suit 53 grainers. 
The hmr makes quite a crack so maybe not a good idea if close to houses but the 22 lr with subsonic ammo should be ideal . Something with a 16” barrel and moderator can be very effective out to 100 yards . 
 

Think I’ve mentioned ricochet s before and had one last night even shooting downwards into soft ground off the primos sticks ( 223 75 g eldms) got a bang thump then a whine . God knows where it went . 
 
Enjoy 

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16 hours ago, jimbob123 said:

Good advice, thanks. Yes I'll have a go at 300 as soon as the weather improves; need to get to my "sheltered and flat field" before it becomes a pea crop :)

This may sound odd, but should te 100 yards be from the muzzle or the action? with a barrel measuring 20" it might be important :)

 

 

Jim

Sorry,  technically the muzzle but a few feet either way will make negligible difference , yards will however . Once you've got to grips with StrelokPro and your new rifle combo , you'll be knocking rabbits and crows over at some surprising distances .

 If you're shooting over arable land , go and have some fun before the crops are too tall .😉

 👍👍

 

No doubt , you'll be looking at reloading soon . Buy a good manual and get book smart first .

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