6.5cm load question

[Northern Farmer]

My first post so please bear with me.

I wouldn’t say I am a handloading expert but I’m not a virgin either.

I have a 6.5cm load question, the rifle is Fairley new to me not had 100 rounds through it yet it appears to shoot well enough for my expectations it’s a Bergara B14hmr its to be  my go to fox rifle.

Its been on factory Sako range 147g FMJ(paper only) just to get the feel of it and provide me with some usable brass

The problem is I am down to my last 5 rounds and would like to keep shooting it.

I looked in the reloading cupboard and I have 100. 130g sierra game changers in 6.5cm.

No accesses to new powder due to the restrictions so I would like to use what I have if that’s possible  and that is

Hodgdon H4350  just under a  quarter of a tub seems a bit pointless working a load up to not be able to buy the same powder later on.

Hodgdon H414.  IMR 4350. Reloder 19,i do have access to Vit 160 also.

I can find date online for most of the powders and bullet weight I have but not necessarily the same make of bullet though.

There are lots of creedmore users out there that understand this cartridge far better than I do if you were in the same position what would you go for with my meager offerings?

Only looking for foxing and stalking ranges with this combination.

Any help much appreciated.    

 

[markymark]

I worked up a load using RS62 and the Sierra 130 TGK. Have you got an iPhone? 
Download the Sierra app and will give you all the load data needed, with a lot of the powders you mentioned. 
 

 

[markymark]

The app suggest highest velocities will be achieved using RE 19, which looking at a burn rate chart is similar to Viht N160.  

[Gandy]

The vhit website has data but in my experience it’s very conservative. 

[markymark]

Viht data also uses small primers. You running LRP or SRP brass for your creedmoor? 

[Gandy]

7 minutes ago, markymark said:

Viht data also uses small primers. You running LRP or SRP brass for your creedmoor? 

Good point MM

[Northern Farmer]

Hi

Thanks for the replies.

Sadly don’t have a iPhone only  Samsung running android   

I am on LRP

[markymark]

Well I had success using suggest coal: 2.810” so you might want to start with that. I have attached screen shots of suggested max limits for IMR 4350 & RE 19. 
 

 

[Northern Farmer]

Thank you MM just what I was looking for.got the app to 🖕

[VarmLR]

H4350 is, or was (when still available for import), one of the best suited powders for Creedmoor and usable for just about all the popular bullet weight ranges.  RS62 comes very close on heat of explosion (energy) and seems to be the most popular replacement for H4350 from what most people post and certainly from my own use with it.  Load quantities are remarkably similar to H4350 too where just as many people recognise in .308 that Vhit N140 or TR140 (RS50) that 43.5 to 44 grains under a 150gr bullet is a reliable go-to load for many, so in CM, using LRP brass 42 to 42.5gr H4350 or RS62 gives similar results under many 139/140gr bullets (around 2800fps/24" barrel).  This might also imply that burn rates as well as HOE are very similar between the two.  I'd continue with your 4350 and when done use RS62 with the caveat that some modification of load would be needed to optimise results and to keep safe.  N160 has lower bulk density so you can't get as much in the case (920g V's 960g for RS62) and is a lower energy powder better suited to taller powder columns or longer barrels shooting heavies.   RL19 has been used but from what I've read so far (I haven't tried this one) results seem to be a little erratic and it seems to do better with hotter loads.   Personally of all the current crop of powders I'd be sticking with RS62.  

[Northern Farmer]

That’s a very interesting way of looking at it thank you, I will use up the H4350 hopefully hit on a combination that works before the tub is empty.

 

[Woodlander]

If it’s going to be your foxing rig, wouldn’t it be better to work up a load using a Varmint bullet?
Aren’t Gamechangers for larger animals and will you get the desired expansion?

Bullets are still readily available from online stockists. 

[miki]

The CRDMR was designed for long range target shootimg (Wiki tells me) as has a long chamber/lead to allow for the long and thin, high BC bullets suited for target shooting. It seems that the .2644 bullet best suited in your chanbering is the around the 120 to 130gn weight, in the long and thin, boat tailed variety, which is also suited to a fast twist (1:8) rather than the short, fat and explosive variety (which prefer a faster delivery through a slower twisting barrel). If you accellerated a 55gn varmint bullet through a 1:8 twist up to the 4100fps mark i imagine the centifugal forces would break the bullet apart shortly after it left the muzzel.

A variation and a used .22-250 for foxing or a .243W with 55gn spitzers for foxy and a 90gn SP for small deer. I'm a great believer that rifles shouldn't be repurposed and aren't a one-size-fits-all. What you are trying to do (IMO) is redesign the planishing hammer as a screwdriver, the CRDMR is a refined, long range, target shooting winner, not a (relatively) close quarter varmint killer.

[markymark]

Couldn’t agree more with VarLR.

Miki - I assume woodlander was suggesting using a Varmint bullet designed for the 6.5CM such as 100gr Sierra HP or 95gr Hornady V-max etc. I disagree, I believe the 6.5CM is the perfect can do all caliber here in the U.K.  
 

Northern Farmer - Are you wanting a can do all load, one bullet / one rifle? Deer, fox and target, plinking etc? Because the 130TGK will no doubt do that all. However if it’s solely going to be a foxing rig then perhaps there is some merit in choosing a faster, flatter varmint bullet? 
 

Mind you, dead is dead. I don’t see Mr fox arguing the toss over the 130gr TGK. 

[miki]

1 hour ago, markymark said:

<snip> Miki - I assume woodlander was suggesting using a Varmint bullet designed for the 6.5CM such as 100gr Sierra SP or 95gr Hornady V-max etc. I disagree, I believe the 6.5CM is the perfect can do all caliber here in the U.K.  
Mind you, dead is dead. I don’t see Mr fox arguing the toss over the 130gr TGK. 

That's my point I guess, the rifle and ammunition was designed to fulfill a niche demand, long range target with long, super slippery, medium speed bullets that retained energy and accuracy out past 900yds. The Creedmoor has 25-percent less wind drift at all ranges and close to 20-percent less drop at 1,000 yards (plagerised from www.ballisticmag.com).  Yes it will kill fox and deer and yes, since its inception (2007 ?) it has been adopted (and adapted) for game hunting and specific bullets have been designed for that purpose it's still a chambering that was designed for a specific pupose, like a race car, great for going round the track but not so good for dropping the kids at footie or nipping down to ASDA.

Mine you dead is dead (as you say) and if it lifts confidence that (having correctly identified the quarry and backstop) you can shoot foxy or bambi out at 300yds plus then go for it. 200 is pretty much my limit for Basil, closer with Roe.

[Kevgun]

I Have a TAC A1and use it as a Foxing rifle sometimes if i know its going to be windy, i use a 95gr Vmax running 3285fps shoots .4 Moa no bother, so it's capable of it.

[Northern Farmer]

4 hours ago, Woodlander said:

If it’s going to be your foxing rig, wouldn’t it be better to work up a load using a Varmint bullet?
Aren’t Gamechangers for larger animals and will you get the desired expansion?

Bullets are still readily available from online stockists. 

I will work up a suitable fox round when materials are more accessible just trying to utilise what I have to hand,

I have tried the sierra 130g in factory from sako and they work well enough with the limited use I have given them.

[markymark]

Miki - An interesting one, and something that will no doubt has been & will continued to be discussed for sometime more! 
 

I do suppose it comes down to which side you fall down on. I’m not doubting the .22-250, .243 and also including the .223 with the vast degree bullet options available are brilliant. I guess if you have the money, and shooting is your job or livelihood I would totally agree to get a rifle set up (rifle, scope, caliber & bullet selection) totally up for the task in hand and to use it as a surgical tool for that one job intended. 
 

A counter argument would be the whole beware of the man with one gun, he knows how to use it analogy. Although that isn’t me, I still have plenty! When there is such an extremely flexible calibers such as the 6.5CM in most cases they really can do it all. Target, ringing steel, deer & varmints. If your more of an occasional shooter (not professional game keeper etc) there is merits in knowing your one load inside out and having the confidence to engage to whatever distance you feel confident with, including any limitations the weather dictates at the time. 
 

On a personal note I still have my .223 and very much plan on keeping it and using it for the job intended. But I’m going through the process of shooting all my .308 off and retiring that caliber and trying to master my 6.5CM and keeping it simple. 

[Northern Farmer]

3 hours ago, markymark said:

Couldn’t agree more with VarLR.

Miki - I assume woodlander was suggesting using a Varmint bullet designed for the 6.5CM such as 100gr Sierra HP or 95gr Hornady V-max etc. I disagree, I believe the 6.5CM is the perfect can do all caliber here in the U.K.  
 

Northern Farmer - Are you wanting a can do all load, one bullet / one rifle? Deer, fox and target, plinking etc? Because the 130TGK will no doubt do that all. However if it’s solely going to be a foxing rig then perhaps there is some merit in choosing a faster, flatter varmint bullet? 
 

Mind you, dead is dead. I don’t see Mr fox arguing the toss over the 130gr TGK. 

I hadn’t consider it to be my all round rifle however the more I shoot it the more I like it. the 130g works very well on the farmed reds and while probably not perfect for foxes I would think would work well with a correctly places shot.

 

[miki]

6 hours ago, Northern Farmer said:

I hadn’t consider it to be my all round rifle however the more I shoot it the more I like it. the 130g works very well on the farmed reds and while probably not perfect for foxes I would think would work well with a correctly places shot.

The tipped gamekings from sierra will be fine on deer and when placed right, kill foxes no problem ....  with its slightly thicker jacket (than the std gameking bullet) it will hold together well with the fast twist you have too.

Let us know how you get on   👍

[Northern Farmer]

🖕will do