wabbit evaporator Posted January 15, 2014 Report Share Posted January 15, 2014 Right, apologies to all those I've pestered with this in the past but all thoughts and opinions gratefully received. Long story short: I had a load that worked really well and basically it stopped working ( suspect temp change or me shooting it without the mod that it was developed with). I now want to develop a new load as much as for experience as anything else. Rifle is a 6x47 Lap, 28" Border cut barrel, 1 in 8. I have Varget, RE17 and IMR 4350 and happy to pick up some other powders. I am using CCI 450 SMR primers. I only have 105 hybrids at the moment. Due to me being a novice reloader the last load took me an age to develop. Rifle now has 450 rounds down the tube and would like to try and keep component expenditure, throat erosion to a minimum. Rifle will shoot pretty much any of the powders with the hybrids into .5" at 100 yards but looking for better than this. Would like to be agging sub .3 (it did it before so it should do it again!) I tried some RE17 again the other day, started at 38 and worked up to 39.9, 3 shot groups. Results were terrible. .7 average but everything well and truly scattered, nothing touching. This was with 15 thou of jump which is where it shot the IMR load nicely. To the experienced guys out there. If you see this kind of thing during load development do you try another powder or do you change seating depth. If it were you, where would you go? Would it be worth me trying another bullet? If so, any suggestions? What are the lighter Bergers like? According to the Berger literature, the hybrids are extremely tolerant of seating depth, would anyone have anything to say on that? Thanks in advance. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
furrybean Posted January 15, 2014 Report Share Posted January 15, 2014 My first loads with the 6x47 were with 105 VLD and 105 Amax the VLD were less than .2 and the Amax were worse at .3 I founds max OAL and came quite far back, 30 thou and tried 5 loads starting 2gr below max to max at 0.5 Im now going to try seating depth to see if they get tighter Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diditg Posted January 15, 2014 Report Share Posted January 15, 2014 Just a thought, but you haven't changed primers have you ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
diditg Posted January 15, 2014 Report Share Posted January 15, 2014 Sorry ignore previous, just seen you post "flyers" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
John MH Posted January 15, 2014 Report Share Posted January 15, 2014 3 shot groups aren't really considered representative, apart from that I'd adjust seating depth first to see what that does. If you have a arbor press load and seat bullets long and incrementally adjust the seating depth at the range from say 0.005" in up to 0.030" off. Watch out for pressure signs on the bullets touching the lands, if you current load is close to the pressure limits for your cases reduce the charge before starting. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Brillo Posted January 15, 2014 Report Share Posted January 15, 2014 IMHO if you are going to develop loads from scratch I'd say don't use VLDs. From personal experience, in my 6BR, I found them very sensitive to seating depth and it took ages to find the sweet-spot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gbal Posted January 15, 2014 Report Share Posted January 15, 2014 IMHO if you are going to develop loads from scratch I'd say don't use VLDs. From personal experience, in my 6BR, I found them very sensitive to seating depth and it took ages to find the sweet-spot. +1 on the VLD sensitivity Good news is that your hybrids are quite tolerant of seating depth,so stick with that profile bullet (one clear occasion where a very small reduction in BC pays dividends overall). Gbal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gun Pimp Posted January 15, 2014 Report Share Posted January 15, 2014 wabbit and furrybean - you've got to get real here. You are expecting benchrest perfomance but without any of the rests, windflags, custom bullets and the like that are essential to shoot small groups. Most 'competition' 6PPC benchrest rifles will, in ideal conditions (we never get 'em in the UK) shoot in the 'ones'. If your rifle won't shoot in the 'ones' in perfect conditions then it's useless - as a competitive benchgun. But, if I just rock up to the range with a bi-pod, no windflags and a box of ammo - I'd be lucky to agg much under 0.4in. To shoot consistently under 0.3in. 5-shot groups is special. You really should come to a benchrest shoot - you'll either demoralise the lot of us - or learn something. Furrybean - you're close by - what about it? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
furrybean Posted January 15, 2014 Report Share Posted January 15, 2014 wabbit and furrybean - you've got to get real here. You are expecting benchrest perfomance but without any of the rests, windflags, custom bullets and the like that are essential to shoot small groups. Most 'competition' 6PPC benchrest rifles will, in ideal conditions (we never get 'em in the UK) shoot in the 'ones'. If your rifle won't shoot in the 'ones' in perfect conditions then it's useless - as a competitive benchgun. But, if I just rock up to the range with a bi-pod, no windflags and a box of ammo - I'd be lucky to agg much under 0.4in. To shoot consistently under 0.3in. 5-shot groups is special. You really should come to a benchrest shoot - you'll either demoralise the lot of us - or learn something. Furrybean - you're close by - what about it? No mate. I shoot like that which promotes growth and vigour. Lol Where do you shoot, I'm just playing with this new rifle but seem to be getting good results. If it's closeby ill be up for a plink. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
wabbit evaporator Posted January 15, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 15, 2014 Hi Vince, thanks for that. I am currently shooting off a Seb Neo front rest with an Edgewood rear-bag recently acquired and since my last posts on this topic. Post your advice last time I have put wind flags out every 25 yards to 200. (Garden poles with light weight sailing pennants attached). I do not shoot for load development in wind- period. I don't think I am being unrealistic at all in hoping to get the rifle shooting like it was only a couple of months ago. It is a well built custom action with a good barrel, i weigh every charge and I am using the best reloading kit I could find. I shot 50m small bore and TR at a pretty serious level for years so hope I know how to shoot. At the moment I am grouping fairly inconsistently compared to what I was achieving in the summer and all I am looking to do is to get back to that level of performance. When I get the rifle shooting how I want it again I will definitely take you up on your offer and come along to a bench-rest shoot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garyw Posted January 15, 2014 Report Share Posted January 15, 2014 Wabbit-your using the same load as me for the hybrids although my powder was Elcho 17 which is R17 with 39.4gns. what do your loads chrono at? i found the sweet spot with the hybrids a closer to the lands. dont give up the hybrids do like a bit of steam.if you can put 5 shots into 3/4 moa or better then test them at 500yds and see if it still holds 3/4-1moa. as VINCE [gun pimp] has mentioned unless your conditions are ideal and your off a concrete bench then it is hard to get the result you are after.if your rifle is for vermin then i would be happy with 5 shots to hold 1.0moa out to 300yds . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gun Pimp Posted January 16, 2014 Report Share Posted January 16, 2014 Wabbit & Furrybean - check out the dates of our UKBRA benchrest shoots at Diggle on the Diggle website www.diggleranges.com YOu are most welcome and I'm sure you will enjoy the experience. First one is Saturday 5th April. We already have quite a few UKV ers shoot with us. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Borisserge Posted January 25, 2014 Report Share Posted January 25, 2014 As a thought, you have a tried and tested load that had worked, presuming it was a safe load etc. Why not continue the powder, primer combo and work the coal 9, 12 & 15 tho from the lands firing 4 rounds of each. You should see a ball park of what your coal/ powder/primer prefers. If you feel the need to refine further, you can run a further set of groups of where the best was. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dannywayoflife Posted January 25, 2014 Report Share Posted January 25, 2014 When I start load dev again ill use the ladder test to decide the load weight then play with seating depth. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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