long range rifle

[cmsds]

whats the best barrel for long range and does it actually make a difference, would a 24" be ok or do you have to have 26".

What would be the best scope I was looking at the zeiss Divari 6x24x72

 

thanks

[1967spud]

some questions

 

 

calibre?

type of long range target/live?

bullet weight?

[Ronin]

What end use application

 

 

Target

 

 

Deer

 

Fox

 

Vermin

 

Hard Target

[terryh]

As Ronin pointed out, work out what you want the rifle to 'do' and work back from there, be honest with youself! (And your budget )

 

Terry

[Sherlock]

whats the best barrel for long range and does it actually make a difference, would a 24" be ok or do you have to have 26".

What would be the best scope I was looking at the zeiss Divari 6x24x72

 

thanks

 

 

 

 

NO - the barrel length doesn't have to be 26 ins, A 24 inch barrel will be fine. You might lose a few fps that's all.

 

The Zeiss 6-24x72 is a monster of a scope which in real world situations doesn't offer much over the 56mm version.

 

 

Shelock

[cmsds]

hi guys , I would be using the long range rifle for target and foxing in daylight.Calibre is 243 with a Ballistic silverpoint 55grain

[brown dog]

hi guys , I would be using the long range rifle for target and foxing in daylight.Calibre is 243 with a Ballistic silverpoint 55grain

 

The 72 Zeiss is definitely a 'no' for that requirement. I'm sure we'll all chip in with our favourite brands; but I'd be recommending the S&B 5-25; just don't like Zeiss scopes - horses for courses

 

55gr in a 243? Is that a typo? I'd reflexively say that in 243 you'll need to be looking at 115gr bullets for long range. I think the next question would be to ask how you're defining long range - what distance do you mean by 'long range'? - it'll affect the advice you get

[dannywayoflife]

243 slinging 115 dtacs is a potent range tool!

[1967spud]

what twist barrel as for the 115 grainers youll need a 1: 8.5 and the 55 grainers will want a 1-14 or 15

 

 

currently im using the 55 for fox and they are an awesome round for that application out to reasonable distance but after 350 yards ish they are pants

[gbal]

243 slinging 115 dtacs is a potent range tool!

Indeed it is.(243/115g).And 243/58 is a terrific varminter.

But the same rifle (twist) won't do both.

 

Just to repeat what everyone else is avdising : 'long range' is too vague-give it in yards eg "mostly 600,but sometimes out to 1000".

 

Same is true of scopes-and some budget is useful-no good saying a March 50x is the bees knees for 1000(even if. it were) if your budget does not run to £thousands . And the March is not a fox scope.Mid range leupolds,or somewhat more expensive Night Force could fit either use,but there are less costly options (sightron eg).You will need min25x,better up to 40x for 1000y.A variable might just get you into fox mag at the other end (say 8x). You would lose too much with a 20" barrel for 1000y,fox won't notice,and 26 would have a slight velocity edge-you need it,if possible.

But really,it's all too general without more detail of use and budget.

Gbal

[cmsds]

hi guys long range to me is 400/1000yds as far as budget for a scope I thought 2k and for the rifle I was thinking about a remy 700 varmint 26inch barrel. My previous scope was a swaro Z6i 2.5x15x56 but it just was not capable to see out to 1000yds

[gbal]

hi guys long range to me is 400/1000yds as far as budget for a scope I thought 2k and for the rifle I was thinking about a remy 700 varmint 26inch barrel. My previous scope was a swaro Z6i 2.5x15x56 but it just was not capable to see out to 1000yds

OK-calibre? 308 just makes 1000,243 with factory twist does not,eg

Before you spend £2k on a scope for a rem,or indeed anything,look at say the S111 sightron,8-32,for way under £1000.Scopes can be subjective,but the S is a very competent long range scope. Make sure the reticule on whatever you buy suits your use(s),as well as enough mag-as you know from the 2.5 -15,well short of enough,which is 25x min if you want to hit small targets (1moa)-you just have to see it,wihout being blotted out by the reticule.

Gbal

[MJR]

'308 just makes 1000,243 with factory twist does not'

 

What?

[mildot]

My go to rifle for hunting or target is a .243AI with 105gr Amax. with a Zeiss 6-24x56. I use this very successfully out to 1000yds... infact it has less drop by some way than what my .260 does. However with the adjustments in the scope I can only just get to 1k. If any further I have to get a a 20 moa rail.

 

A normal .243 you would have to have a 20moa rail without fail.

 

As for scope the zeiss is simply awesome for hunting. However I have just bought a sightron s111 8-32x56 and used it for the first time last week. Its a great scope for target but wont comment on it for hunting as im yet to use it for that purpose.

[gbal]

'308 just makes 1000,243 with factory twist does not'

What?

Since we don't know the calibre choice yet,I,did not seem much point in detailing calibres-just a pointer,bearing in mind "Rem varmint"

 

308 is getting close to transonic by 1000y,and is not too competitive,but will get there,and some factory rifles can sometimes shoot under 1 moa (I have one),in good conditions. For occasional such use,it will do.TR can do better-but hardly typical for a beginner,and not usually with Rem varmints.

 

 

243 in slow factory twists is not 1000 y capable.A fast twist 243 with say 115 DTACS definitely is,and AI would help.

 

For casual/club/not too serious shooting,both are fine in standard form. How many serious shooters shoot factory twist 243 at 1000? I like standard (slow twist) 243 ,and shoot it,but I don't expect it to be effective at 1000y.

 

For me,acceptable accuracy would be something like 1moa to 500y and maybe 1.5 to 2 moa beyond-then it's about worth trying a shot,if we are talking fun shooting,at targets which are a little bigger than those moas,but not barn doors.

 

Gbal

[MJR]

See post #6 - 243 is the intended calibre although I doubt 55gn silver tips will be any good at extended range.

308? Well yes my 175gn smk load is transonic at 1000 yd but hardly 'just making' it.

 

Cmsds, are you asking due to rebarreling? If so a move to a faster 1 in 8 twist barrel may help. It will allow use of heavier bullets for long range and mid weight expanding bullets for foxing.

[gbal]

See post #6 - 243 is the intended calibre although I doubt 55gn silver tips will be any good at extended range.

308? Well yes my 175gn smk load is transonic at 1000 yd but hardly 'just making' it.

Cmsds, are you asking due to rebarreling? If so a move to a faster 1 in 8 twist barrel may help. It will allow use of heavier bullets for long range and mid weight expanding bullets for foxing.

MJR,sorry -it does seem as if the rifle is a 243 -with 55 g silvertips,though as you say yourself 'intended' and "as for the rifle I was thinking about..." is at least ambiguous as to actual or intended.

My point was,given either that 243 was the choice,or possible choice ,that it has limits-I meant "even' the 308 has-it is OK for 1000,especially with heavy bullets (though to be competitive with eg 6.5x 284,the 308 needs about 220 g bullets at 2650 fps mv,and that is not often used,because the recoil is pretty serious.and just about prohibitive in a Rem 700 varminter..(you need a 23+lb rifle,to match the 16 lb 6.5x284) but the point was just to alert that 1000y is a long way for any Rem 700 varminter calibre....and normal weight factory rifle,as 308 might be considerd a 'very good' 1000y choice by a beginner.Well,is it?

As you about concede,and see others (eg Spud'243/55 is "pants" past 350y) the 243 with 55g is no long range combination: I find 500 is within reach,but getting iffy by 650....it is just a terrific varminter though at shorter ranges.The fast twist option that would give it 1000 potential just isn't available in Rem,or is it now? Probably not,as we're way out of varminter territory at 1000y.

A good few varmint type 308s have been shot at 1000 ranges,and most have not have consistently delivered one moa,even with sighters and good shooting positions.Some better 308s have of course,and some (semi) custom are OK-but it does depend a bit on what you would consider acceptable performance. I see quite a lot of 308s among others fail to consistently down military falling men (about 3x2 feet?) at a thousand yards,even with a some potential walk in shots.

Of course 308 can go to 1000y,but it is not the cartridge to aspire to for top performance. I really like the 243,but asking a Rem Varminter to perform at 1000y is a recipe for likely disappointment,guaranteed with 55g bullets.

 

I agree it was overly ambitious to deal with the 308 in one line.

 

Gbal

[oaken]

Personally I would look at a tikka varmint in .243. I don't know what you have granted on your ticket but doubt you will get anything larger for varmint shooting.

24" 1:10 twist barrel of the Tikka will shoot the 87gr Vmax fast enough to make 1000yds and be a very competent tool for any varmint requirements at lesser ranges.

You will be dissapointed with anything below 70gr beyond 600yds! It will do it but not well.

The S3 6-24 has ample elevation for 1000yds without an inclined rail and the moa (illuminated now available) reticle is fine enough for both target and long range varmint. Being cheaper, it will also enable the purchase of the Tikka well within your budget.

Rup

Tikka is a much more refined rifle than the remmy despite what Remington owners will tell you!

[gbal]

Personally I would look at a tikka varmint in .243. I don't know what you have granted on your ticket but doubt you will get anything larger for varmint shooting.

24" 1:10 twist barrel of the Tikka will shoot the 87gr Vmax fast enough to make 1000yds and be a very competent tool for any varmint requirements at lesser ranges.

You will be dissapointed with anything below 70gr beyond 600yds! It will do it but not well.

The S3 6-24 has ample elevation for 1000yds without an inclined rail and the moa (illuminated now available) reticle is fine enough for both target and long range varmint. Being cheaper, it will also enable the purchase of the Tikka well within your budget.

Rup

Tikka is a much more refined rifle than the remmy despite what Remington owners will tell you!

+1 Rup,about what I was trying to say.

I'd have a good look at the Sako before I bought the Tikka,and yes,it is ambiguous-they are both good rifles,and I have a Rem.

Gbal

[swagger700]

I wouldn't recommend 55s for Fox's we had guest 2weeks ago was shooting em in rite place and they were not stopping them wounds were on outside of body 70s miles better out of 243 .as for scopes I have 2 zeiss and there very clear bought big sightron s111 in spring and it compares to them on night good value for money

[1967spud]

55grainers are perfect for fox swagger but bullet type mkes a huge differnece

[Elwood]

I wouldn't recommend 55s for Fox's we had guest 2weeks ago was shooting em in rite place and they were not stopping them wounds were on outside of body 70s miles better out of 243 .

 

 

What nonsense.

[gbal]

I wouldn't recommend 55s for Fox's we had guest 2weeks ago was shooting em in rite place and they were not stopping them wounds were on outside of body 70s miles better out of 243 .as for scopes I have 2 zeiss and there very clear bought big sightron s111 in spring and it compares to them on night good value for money

Bullets of the same weight can differ by design in construction for different purposes-including intended species.So not all 55 g are the same-some extreme varmint ones are designed for explosive expansion on very small varmints-much smaller than fox.

I think it's likely you used inappropriate 55g bullets.While something of the same is true of 6mm,I am not surprised that 70g 243 was more effective-energy etc is considerably higher,and quite likely bullet construction was more suited to Fox than your 55g.

(Bear in mind too,US bullets were not primarily designed for UK varmints,though there is some overlap in species.)

 

Gbal

[6mmBR]

I'm afraid bullet placement is everything and like Ian I'm afraid I've never heard so much rubbish!

I have shot literally 100's of foxes over the years and my main fox Rifle was a .17 Rem and I never encountered problems with a 25grain bullet!!!

A fox is thin skinned and hasn't got a hide like a rhino!

I suggest poor bullet placement was more the cause!

[gbal]

Elwood & 6BR,

Of course bullet placement is critical-the right bullet in the right place,with sufficient energy etc.

The report stated "shot 'em in the rite place"(sic) and implied that the bodies were later inspected as the wounds were described as "on the outside of the body"-which I take to mean poor penetration to vital tissues.

I suppose 'rite place' is possibly vague,but 'on the outside' isn't,so is not bullet performance more an issue?

I agree to some surprise with 55g,but perhaps we will find out just what the actual bullets which failed were,and other experience can be brought to bear?

 

Gbal