.223 twist rates

[pork chop]

Would it not be best just to use one bullets weight, find an accurate load and stick with it? Is the same poi with each load? Could just imagine been out after Charlie thinking I had the heavy load, spotting a fox 250 yards out, stands like a statue, wont come to call just stands there, shot is on, hold over required amount for the heavier bullet, and put the lighter bullet over its back! Would possibly drive me bonkers!

not intending to use both would like to use the 75 amax but if nit succesful would like to fall back on the 53,s

[pork chop]

head head head

[Wsm]

Apologies if this thread looks somewhat disjointed but I've had to edit out the off topic shenanigans

[bradders]

head head head

I bet you're on the BBS, aren't you?

[pork chop]

no just here,not going to fall out over a term you call them what you want as will i

[bradders]

no just here,not going to fall out over a term you call them what you want as will i

Fair enough, but I haven't given up just yet

[bradders]

Back on topic, I'd always choose a 8 twist over anything else purely for the versatility.

No need to go faster and not much point going slower

[tackb]

Back on topic, I'd always choose a 8 twist over anything else purely for the versatility.

No need to go faster and not much point going slower

 

Good advice , unless you are going to be using 80-90g HEADS?

[bradders]

Good advice , unless you are going to be using 80-90g HEADS?

Careful now!!

You can shoot 80's from an 8 twist all day long.

90's have too much voodoo written about them but really are a waste of time in a .223

[tackb]

I'm running a 20" barrel , I doubt I'd do much with an 80-90g that I can't do with the 75 Amax ?

[bradders]

The 8 twist in my .223 stabilised the 80 grain Berger VLD's without any issues, I had good results with them.

Yes, some people used to think that you needed a 7 twist to shoot 80 VLD's such as Bergers and JLKs, but more recently people have just settled on 8's.

For a while they also went to a 6.5 twist for 90's, but you can shoot 90 SMK's out of a 7 or 8 twist.

The problem is that an 80 will outfly a 90 so the 90's aren't popular anymore

[bradders]

I'm running a 20" barrel , I doubt I'd do much with an 80-90g that I can't do with the 75 Amax ?

True

Theoretically the 75 Amax should be better than an 80 SMK, but if that was the case they'd be more popular in US NRA Highpower, but they aren't.

Sierra just make better more consistent bullets.

 

I'm a big fan of JLKs and have had good success with both their 75 and 80gn VLDs

 

Tests have proven that you can not get enough velocity from a 20" service rifle length barrel to gain any advantage with a 90.

 

My pals Derrick Martin and Barrett Tillman and benchrester Dana Beasley did some extensive testing at Rio Salado with start/stop chronos both on the firing point and down range at 500yds to prove this.

 

I have a Precision Shooting article that Derrick and Barrett wrote, but it's a bit too long to post here

[tackb]

I use one round for everything I want to do with my 223 , the 75g Amax fills that role for me?

[bradders]

I use one round for everything I want to do with my 223 , the 75g Amax fills that role for me?

That's fair enough

[minkstone]

Would it not be best just to use one bullets weight, find an accurate load and stick with it? Is the same poi with each load? Could just imagine been out after Charlie thinking I had the heavy load, spotting a fox 250 yards out, stands like a statue, wont come to call just stands there, shot is on, hold over required amount for the heavier bullet, and put the lighter bullet over its back! Would possibly drive me bonkers!

I agree, i would stick with a lighter bullet, .223 out to 250yds with a 50-55gr point and shoot.

 

Regards.

[tealo]

Does anyone know where you could buy a barrel and action, something like a remmy, tikka or would it have to be something more custom like and probably more expensive. Just a thought because if its £650 to rebarrel and around £300-£400 for a stock wondered how much the last piece in the puzzle was.

[gunner]

Been searching through guntrader for a tikka varmint stainless or heavy remmy stainless for a month. So how far could I get out to with a 1-12 is it just the fact the lesser grain bullet gets effected by the wind or is it something else.

i shot 223rem , 1:12 and with 50 grain blitzkings from a 26" barrel were going unstable at about 550 yards and keyholeing slightly on the target at 600 yards ! 55 grainers were about 50 yards further then doing same thing ! i was able to pick out the bullet heads from the piece of worktop i was using as target , they were perfectly shaped with rifling grooves cut into the jacket ,but the balistic tip had broken off..

[gunner]

i shot 223rem , 1:12 and with 50 grain blitzkings from a 26" barrel were going unstable at about 550 yards and keyholeing slightly on the target at 600 yards ! 55 grainers were about 50 yards further then doing same thing ! i was able to pick out the bullet heads from the piece of worktop i was using as target , they were perfectly shaped with rifling grooves cut into the jacket ,but the balistic tip had broken off..

i used a chissel to get em out the worktop ! not with my fingers..

[simonl]

Can someone help me to understand...

I appreciate that a tighter twist is required for a heavier bullet to achieve enough RM to allow stabilisation.

I can also understand that if the twist rate is too tight that a lighter buller can spin too fast & self destruct.

 

1. Are there widely accepted upper & lower RPM limits? Is there a table somewhere?

2. Is it beneficial to get really close to the upper limit? Does that give better accuracy?

 

I'm struggling to understand why people would want 1 in 12" for a 223 when it seems lighter bullets are still ok in 1 in 9" and tht tighter twist would give the flexibility of bullets up to 75gr ish.

 

thanks,

Simon.

[gunner]

Can someone help me to understand...

I appreciate that a tighter twist is required for a heavier bullet to achieve enough RM to allow stabilisation.

I can also understand that if the twist rate is too tight that a lighter buller can spin too fast & self destruct.

 

1. Are there widely accepted upper & lower RPM limits? Is there a table somewhere?

2. Is it beneficial to get really close to the upper limit? Does that give better accuracy?

 

I'm struggling to understand why people would want 1 in 12" for a 223 when it seems lighter bullets are still ok in 1 in 9" and tht tighter twist would give the flexibility of bullets up to 75gr ish.

 

thanks,

Simon.

hi , i dont shoot that gun anymore its now a 1;8 twist 223AI with long throat for VLDs ! at the time it was my 2nd rifle and i didnt have enough experience to know then that i would need - prefer a fast twist ! your right about the 1;9 - more versatile !

[ricky5042]

Hi guys i have a howa 1500 in 223 with a 1-12 twist 24" barrel and iv just started reloading iv tried a few heads from 55gr hornady hpbt match which were not that good, but the 52grn A-max heads with the H335 powder has given me a 0.060" group at 50m i know its only 50m but the the max for my local range these same 52grn A-max heads with H4189 as i couldnt get any H335 i managed to get all bar 1 round out of 10 into a 4" target not out standing but not bad for me as im new to reloading and its an off the shelf rifle with a cheap bipod so for me thats not bad im going to be trying some 75grn A-max heads when my local shop get some in so il update you once my test have been done.

 

Rick

[gbal]

Hi guys i have a howa 1500 in 223 with a 1-12 twist 24" barrel and iv just started reloading iv tried a few heads from 55gr hornady hpbt match which were not that good, but the 52grn A-max heads with the H335 powder has given me a 0.060" group at 50m i know its only 50m but the the max for my local range these same 52grn A-max heads with H4189 as i couldnt get any H335 i managed to get all bar 1 round out of 10 into a 4" target not out standing but not bad for me as im new to reloading and its an off the shelf rifle with a cheap bipod so for me thats not bad im going to be trying some 75grn A-max heads when my local shop get some in so il update you once my test have been done.

 

Rick

Hi Rick,

9/10 in 4'' does not tell much without the range-given your one other group-very good- at 50,I doubt that you have reached the limit of the Rifle's performance,unless this was 300+ yards.One 'tip'-use bullets rather than heads,then you'll get more advice about your shooting rather than your vocabulary.-'tip' of course can be used both ways-reloading isn't quite as simple as some make out!!

 

george

 

PS check out 'twist rate' for barrels-it limits max bullet weight -heavier bullets will need a faster twist... (see eg 6br site for general guidance)

[happyhunter]

Hi guys i have a howa 1500 in 223 with a 1-12 twist 24" barrel and iv just started reloading iv tried a few heads from 55gr hornady hpbt match which were not that good, but the 52grn A-max heads with the H335 powder has given me a 0.060" group at 50m i know its only 50m but the the max for my local range these same 52grn A-max heads with H4189 as i couldnt get any H335 i managed to get all bar 1 round out of 10 into a 4" target not out standing but not bad for me as im new to reloading and its an off the shelf rifle with a cheap bipod so for me thats not bad im going to be trying some 75grn A-max heads when my local shop get some in so il update you once my test have been done.

 

Rick

 

Rick a 1-12 twist .223 won't stablise 75grn a-max, you have a good load stretch its legs and see how it performs at longer range.

[ricky5042]

Hi Rick,

9/10 in 4'' does not tell much without the range-given your one other group-very good- at 50,I doubt that you have reached the limit of the Rifle's performance,unless this was 300+ yards.One 'tip'-use bullets rather than heads,then you'll get more advice about your shooting rather than your vocabulary.-'tip' of course can be used both ways-reloading isn't quite as simple as some make out!!

 

george

 

PS check out 'twist rate' for barrels-it limits max bullet weight -heavier bullets will need a faster twist... (see eg 6br site for general guidance)

Doh soz that was at 400 yards lol ok there bullets from now on an old guy at my club kept telling me there not bullets there heads! now i can correct him as well just looked on the box of bullets and it says at the bottom 1-14 twist so im guessing thats what hornady say is optimum twist for that weight of bullet?

Thanks

 

Rick

[ricky5042]

Rick a 1-12 twist .223 won't stablise 75grn a-max, you have a good load stretch its legs and see how it performs at longer range.

Hi i didnt think it would stabilise the 75grn either but on of the guys at my club told me the 52grn a-max would be to light and to go for 68-75grn instead but iv tried factory loaded 62s & 68s both of which were crap, i know there factory rounds which is why i was going to try some 75grn a-max to see how they did just out of interest would a quicker burning powder help stabilise heavier bullets?

Thanks

 

Rick