ANDY T Posted September 15, 2012 Report Share Posted September 15, 2012 Hi I have a new rifle that has a Stolle Panda action on it.It is chambered for a standard Lapua 6mmbr case but the bolt dose not close easily can you tell me why this might be. ThanksAndy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danpd Posted September 15, 2012 Report Share Posted September 15, 2012 Bit of a general question really. Is this with a case in the chamber, or an empty chamber? Is it new brass or once fired brass? Is it brass from another rifle? Are the bolt to action clearances correct? Is there some dirt or a brush bristle in the action? Etc etc.... being so vague makes it almost impossible to help you at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ANDY T Posted September 15, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 15, 2012 Bit of a general question really. Is this with a case in the chamber, or an empty chamber? Is it new brass or once fired brass? Is it brass from another rifle? Are the bolt to action clearances correct? Is there some dirt or a brush bristle in the action? Etc etc.... being so vague makes it almost impossible to help you at all. Hi This is with new brass and ones fired brass from the same rifle and without a case in it needs some help to close i don't think there is any dirt in action. also have applied some grease as well still stiff to close. Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dannyt Posted September 15, 2012 Report Share Posted September 15, 2012 Hi This is with new brass and ones fired brass from the same rifle and without a case in it needs some help to close i don't think there is any dirt in action. If the brass has only being fired in this gun from new and the the gun has been proofed send it back to the smith who made it. sound like the head space is wrong /IE the cases have stretched to fill the chamber on fireing are you full lenth sizeing the brass after fireing?? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ANDY T Posted September 15, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 15, 2012 If the brass has only being fired in this gun from new and the the gun has been proofed send it back to the smith who made it. sound like the head space is wrong /IE the cases have stretched to fill the chamber on fireing are you full lenth sizeing the brass after fireing?? Trying to have a good look at it have taking the stock off not the stock i think it is the barrel face or it could be from the thread hole that holds the stock to the action not finished of properly as there is a very light score makes on the bolt lugs?. I am surprised that this thread goes all the way through into where the bolt lug turns. I will not know till i take the barrel of and try the bolt without the barrel in. If it is the barrel what can i do about it. are you full lenth sizeing the brass after fireing ( no only neck sizing ) Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danpd Posted September 15, 2012 Report Share Posted September 15, 2012 1347746930[/url]' post='131892']Trying to have a good look at it have taking the stock off not the stock i think it is the barrel face or it could be from the thread hole that holds the stock to the action not finished of properly as there is a very light score makes on the bolt lugs?. I am surprised that this thread goes all the way through into where the bolt lug turns. I will not know till i take the barrel of and try the bolt without the barrel in. If it is the barrel what can i do about it. are you full lenth sizeing the brass after fireing ( no only neck sizing ) Andy Check the action screws are at correct length. Also remove your firing pin assembly and check that the bolt has some back to front play in it, I.e not interfering with barrel face. Sometimes if the clearances are run too tight, then the crush fit from torquing a barrel on will mean the bolt is touching the barrel face. I'm sure if you have any problems then Stuart will sort them out. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gun nut Posted September 15, 2012 Report Share Posted September 15, 2012 If you have a score round the outside of the lugs your front action screw is too long. Just give it a couple of turns to loosen it and if the problem goes away that's what it is. If it is take the action screw out put a nut onto it half way down the threads and file off 2 thread depths, screw the nut off again to clean the thread start and replace in the action,torque up and job done. Mike Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ANDY T Posted September 15, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 15, 2012 If you have a score round the outside of the lugs your front action screw is too long. Just give it a couple of turns to loosen it and if the problem goes away that's what it is. If it is take the action screw out put a nut onto it half way down the threads and file off 2 thread depths, screw the nut off again to clean the thread start and replace in the action,torque up and job done. Mike H i I have had the stock of complete with no screw in the action and still the action is stiff Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ANDY T Posted September 15, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 15, 2012 Check the action screws are at correct length. Also remove your firing pin assembly and check that the bolt has some back to front play in it, I.e not interfering with barrel face. Sometimes if the clearances are run too tight, then the crush fit from torquing a barrel on will mean the bolt is touching the barrel face. I'm sure if you have any problems then Stuart will sort them out. Hi I have sent Stuart a e-mail about this still waiting for a reply from him. i dont have the tools to take the firing pin out. Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dannyt Posted September 16, 2012 Report Share Posted September 16, 2012 Hi I have sent Stuart a e-mail about this still waiting for a reply from him. i dont have the tools to take the firing pin out. Andy youve done the correct thing by conntacting the builder of the rifle. I have three stolle actions of my own and i love them . They all have the action screws that go through the action tenon its how they make em(the lead action screw should not contact the bolt lugs at all)if it does after tightening to much simply trim to suit , if you look on the Kelblys Web page there are action dimentions for threading for there actions, in the drawings it will give the bolt face clearance needed. You can check this yourself ,with shim steel place a cut out slip under size by 0.001 place the shim between the bolt cone and barrel rebated cone/ bolt should close ,and a piece 0.002 over size bolt should not close. this will tell you if the space between the bolt and the barrel is correct. but you should be able to close the bolt on an empty chamber with no problems with bolt tightness. As you have stated your problems are with once fired cases and the shoulder should not move forward on BR cases after one fireing with new brass, First try bumping the shoulder back a thou at a time until you get the bolt closing with out a crush fit. keep note of how much you have to bump the shoulder back with your body die. These are a few thing you can do for your self to check . Get hold of a sett of no go and go gauges and check the head space with these?, keep asking and run a check list and you will sort the problem out and be wiser for it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ANDY T Posted September 16, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 16, 2012 youve done the correct thing by conntacting the builder of the rifle. I have three stolle actions of my own and i love them . They all have the action screws that go through the action tenon its how they make em(the lead action screw should not contact the bolt lugs at all)if it does after tightening to much simply trim to suit , if you look on the Kelblys Web page there are action dimentions for threading for there actions, in the drawings it will give the bolt face clearance needed. You can check this yourself ,with shim steel place a cut out slip under size by 0.001 place the shim between the bolt cone and barrel rebated cone/ bolt should close ,and a piece 0.002 over size bolt should not close. this will tell you if the space between the bolt and the barrel is correct. but you should be able to close the bolt on an empty chamber with no problems with bolt tightness. As you have stated your problems are with once fired cases and the shoulder should not move forward on BR cases after one fireing with new brass, First try bumping the shoulder back a thou at a time until you get the bolt closing with out a crush fit. keep note of how much you have to bump the shoulder back with your body die. These are a few thing you can do for your self to check . Get hold of a sett of no go and go gauges and check the head space with these?, keep asking and run a check list and you will sort the problem out and be wiser for it. Hi Thanks for the reply the problem is also with new brass as well as ones fired brass i will loosen the barrel of today and see how the bolt closes with the barrel rebated cone forward. I have now taking the barrel of and its not the gap with the action and barrel rebated cone i think it may be the bolt ? I have now taking my bolt apart and it looks like there is a small lump or wielding solder sticking out from where they attach the bolt handle that my be the problem for the price you pay for this action you would think that the quality control would be spot on Sorted that bit out and it is still stiff so something else on bolt help needed Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dannyt Posted September 16, 2012 Report Share Posted September 16, 2012 Silly question Andy / is the chamber tightneck or no turn neck. If its a tightneck chambering and the loaded ammo has not been turned down enogh this can give simular results. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garyw Posted September 16, 2012 Report Share Posted September 16, 2012 ANDY- DONT F==-K ABOUT with the action/bbl let stuart sort it out.hes a good enough bloke to sort it out for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ANDY T Posted September 16, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 16, 2012 Silly question Andy / is the chamber tightneck or no turn neck. If its a tightneck chambering and the loaded ammo has not been turned down enogh this can give simular results. Hi Its not the ammo i have taking the firing pin out and the bolt drops back down with no effort put the pin back in and it goes stiff again. Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gun Pimp Posted September 17, 2012 Report Share Posted September 17, 2012 Hi Its not the ammo i have taking the firing pin out and the bolt drops back down with no effort put the pin back in and it goes stiff again. Andy Andy, Your tests have established that the problem is not with the gunsmithing - as everything works freely with the firing-pin assembly removed. My first custom action was a Stolle Panda - about 20 years ago. I loved the 'knife through butter' bolt closure and all 'benchrest' Stolles are the same. However, when I built an F/TR rifle on the Panda F Class action (the one that Stuart used to win the Europeans in 2011) I was a little surprised at the bolt-closing 'effort'. It's not a problem and I didn't investigate further as the rifle shot superbly and it's a lot better than say a Barnard. If we could put the F Class Panda bolt next to a benchrest Panda bolt we would probably see some difference in the male chickening ramp and/or the firing-pin spring. It might be possible to 'work' on this but, it's not a problem to the rifle's functioning, so just shoot it and enjoy it. If you can find a target shooter with a Swing action - ask to try his bolt!! Vince Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gun Pimp Posted September 17, 2012 Report Share Posted September 17, 2012 Andy, Your tests have established that the problem is not with the gunsmithing - as everything works freely with the firing-pin assembly removed. My first custom action was a Stolle Panda - about 20 years ago. I loved the 'knife through butter' bolt closure and all 'benchrest' Stolles are the same. However, when I built an F/TR rifle on the Panda F Class action (the one that Stuart used to win the Europeans in 2011) I was a little surprised at the bolt-closing 'effort'. It's not a problem and I didn't investigate further as the rifle shot superbly and it's a lot better than say a Barnard. If we could put the F Class Panda bolt next to a benchrest Panda bolt we would probably see some difference in the male chickening ramp and/or the firing-pin spring. It might be possible to 'work' on this but, it's not a problem to the rifle's functioning, so just shoot it and enjoy it. If you can find a target shooter with a Swing action - ask to try his bolt!! Vince Er male chickening ramp?? How did that get there - should be male chickening ramp! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Gun Pimp Posted September 17, 2012 Report Share Posted September 17, 2012 Er male chickening ramp?? How did that get there - should be male chickening ramp! What's happening here? every time I type the correct phrase it alters it to 'male chickening' ramp! Vince Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
1967spud Posted September 17, 2012 Report Share Posted September 17, 2012 err Vince its the board swear o meter what word are you trying to type Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6mmBR Posted September 17, 2012 Report Share Posted September 17, 2012 I wonder what other words it doesn't like male chicken delightful chap spiral staircase blancmange football Arse Only one got through Have a guess what the others were Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garyw Posted September 17, 2012 Report Share Posted September 17, 2012 other words it doesnt like deciduous tree nob ed spiral staircase up this one will get through -FELTCHER! :lol: our AUSSIE cousins will know that one. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ANDY T Posted September 17, 2012 Author Report Share Posted September 17, 2012 Hi all I have been on the phone to Stuart and going through everything he thinks it might be and he seams to think it may be a problem with the trigger ramp so the action has gone back to him to have a look at. Yes Vines it dose still shoot ok as is and there is no problem with the build in anyway but the action needs looking at this may get worse as time goes on. Andy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6mmBR Posted September 18, 2012 Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 other words it doesnt like deciduous tree nob ed spiral staircase up this one will get through -FELTCHER! :lol: our AUSSIE cousins will know that one. Oh dear I see what that is all about :o "In retrospect, lighting the match was my big mistake. But I was only trying to retrieve the Gerbil," Eric Tomaszewski told bemused doctors in the Severe Burns Unit of Salt Lake City Hospital. Tomaszewski and his homosexual partner Andrew (Kiki) Farnom, had been admitted for emergency treatment after a felching session had gone seriously wrong. "I pushed a cardboard tube up his rectum and slipped Raggot, our gerbil, in." he explained. "As usual, Kiki shouted out 'Armageddon,' my cue that he'd had enough. I tried to retrieve Raggot but he wouldn't come out again, so I peered into the tube and struck a match, thinking that the light might attract him." At a hushed press conference, a hospital spokesman described what happened next. "The match ignited a pocket of intestinal gas and a flame shot out of the tubing, igniting Mr. Tomaszewski's hair and severely burning his face. It also set fire to the gerbil's fur and whiskers which in turn ignited a larger pocket of gas further up the intestine, propelling the rodent out like a cannonball." Tomaszewski suffered second degree burns and a broken nose from the impact of the gerbil, while Farnom suffered first and second degree burns to his anus and lower intestinal tract. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garyw Posted September 18, 2012 Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 Oh dear I see what that is all about :o "In retrospect, lighting the match was my big mistake. But I was only trying to retrieve the Gerbil," Eric Tomaszewski told bemused doctors in the Severe Burns Unit of Salt Lake City Hospital. Tomaszewski and his homosexual partner Andrew (Kiki) Farnom, had been admitted for emergency treatment after a felching session had gone seriously wrong. "I pushed a cardboard tube up his rectum and slipped Raggot, our gerbil, in." he explained. "As usual, Kiki shouted out 'Armageddon,' my cue that he'd had enough. I tried to retrieve Raggot but he wouldn't come out again, so I peered into the tube and struck a match, thinking that the light might attract him." At a hushed press conference, a hospital spokesman described what happened next. "The match ignited a pocket of intestinal gas and a flame shot out of the tubing, igniting Mr. Tomaszewski's hair and severely burning his face. It also set fire to the gerbil's fur and whiskers which in turn ignited a larger pocket of gas further up the intestine, propelling the rodent out like a cannonball." Tomaszewski suffered second degree burns and a broken nose from the impact of the gerbil, while Farnom suffered first and second degree burns to his anus and lower intestinal tract. WHAT A BEUTY!very funny dave -any way lets not drag ANDY T thread down,looks like hes getting sorted- enjoy the stolle ANDY-. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6mmBR Posted September 18, 2012 Report Share Posted September 18, 2012 WHAT A BEUTY!very funny dave -any way lets not drag ANDY T thread down,looks like hes getting sorted- enjoy the stolle ANDY-. It made me laugh. Any way sorry Andy enjoy your new rifle. Cheers Dave Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gary C Posted September 21, 2012 Report Share Posted September 21, 2012 It made me laugh. Any way sorry Andy enjoy your new rifle. Cheers Dave Dave it didn't say what happened to the Gerbil? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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