223 or 223AI

[247sniper]

Hi I have finely made my mind up and I am getting my 223 re barrelled with a 1 in 8 twist 24 inch long to shoot the 75grain amax need to know if it's worth getting it chambered for 223AI your thoughts please

Thanks Stephen

 

 

Hi Stephen, Some good advice on here pal.

 

I have a .223 AI 1:7 twist shooting the 80 grain Amaxs. I have spent many an hour load developing and fine tuning what was a very accurate load into a super accurate load with very little exstream spread and SD.

 

Fireforming the brass - I loaded a near max .223 load and just shot the rifle to fireform the brass, I was astounded how accurate it was, the velocity was down a little but accuracy was shockingly accurate, I used these as a hunting round and longish range vermin round, shooting .2's at 100 and 200 yards on paper and 1" groups on steel at 400 yards and accounting for for 3x rabbits at 578 yards, 580 and 568 yards, these rabbits were shot all within a couple of minutes one after another, a memorable experience to say the least.

 

Brass stretch - I fully prepped my lapua match brass, if you want the best results you have to put the time in to the preparations, (In any scenario) The cases DO NOT stretch much, if at all! My mate is forever trimming his standard .223 brass.

 

Barrel/throat life- Due to the powder being fully burnt in the AI case and not around the throat, barrel/throat life is meant to be better.

 

Feeding- My rifle feeds from a mag and feeds "OK" it does not feed as good as a standard .223 but that's because of the more tapered should angle of the standard .223 case and not the 40 degree shoulder from the AI. (So it never will)

 

External Ballistics - Gaz6br also has a .223AI 1:12 twist. He has a load using 40 grain Nosslers at 3960ftps, this turns the rifle into a ultra flat shooting vermin and fox setup, very fast, very flat, it out performs the very fast .20 cals. He also uses a 52 Amax load to fantastic effect, 1 inch groups at 400 yards have been witnessed too.

The AI does provided greater velocities in the field and better ballistics over the standard .223 for sure, yeh naturally more powder, faster speeds etc......does it make a massive difference in the field- Not really.

 

My setup - Launching the 80 grain Amax's with their True BC and not the underestimated manufactures one at 2960 ftps is a pretty awesome little round for around 25 grains of powder, out shoots the likes of a 308 using 168 AMax in terms of drop and drift (A bullet twice the weight) and with almost half the powder! I have yet to a standard .223 shoot the 80 Amax at anywhere new 3k ftps, although i do know of one .223 shooting the 75Amax at 3030ftps! with no pressure signs!

 

Summary- To honestly sum it up the AI does have several advantages over the standard .223, likewise the standard .223 has some advantaged over the AI, (Factory ammo, feeding, no brass prep/fireformin etc)

 

But to answer the op question, there is not a big advantage in the field tbh when comparing the two, a styandard .223 will also do the same thing lobbing those big bullets.

 

Think its just down to choice my friend and what you want.

 

Any helps of questions mate just fire away bud.

 

 

Steve

[stephentri]

 

 

Hi Stephen, Some good advice on here pal.

 

I have a .223 AI 1:7 twist shooting the 80 grain Amaxs. I have spent many an hour load developing and fine tuning what was a very accurate load into a super accurate load with very little exstream spread and SD.

 

Fireforming the brass - I loaded a near max .223 load and just shot the rifle to fireform the brass, I was astounded how accurate it was, the velocity was down a little but accuracy was shockingly accurate, I used these as a hunting round and longish range vermin round, shooting .2's at 100 and 200 yards on paper and 1" groups on steel at 400 yards and accounting for for 3x rabbits at 578 yards, 580 and 568 yards, these rabbits were shot all within a couple of minutes one after another, a memorable experience to say the least.

 

Brass stretch - I fully prepped my lapua match brass, if you want the best results you have to put the time in to the preparations, (In any scenario) The cases DO NOT stretch much, if at all! My mate is forever trimming his standard .223 brass.

 

Barrel/throat life- Due to the powder being fully burnt in the AI case and not around the throat, barrel/throat life is meant to be better.

 

Feeding- My rifle feeds from a mag and feeds "OK" it does not feed as good as a standard .223 but that's because of the more tapered should angle of the standard .223 case and not the 40 degree shoulder from the AI. (So it never will)

 

External Ballistics - Gaz6br also has a .223AI 1:12 twist. He has a load using 40 grain Nosslers at 3960ftps, this turns the rifle into a ultra flat shooting vermin and fox setup, very fast, very flat, it out performs the very fast .20 cals. He also uses a 52 Amax load to fantastic effect, 1 inch groups at 400 yards have been witnessed too.

The AI does provided greater velocities in the field and better ballistics over the standard .223 for sure, yeh naturally more powder, faster speeds etc......does it make a massive difference in the field- Not really.

 

My setup - Launching the 80 grain Amax's with their True BC and not the underestimated manufactures one at 2960 ftps is a pretty awesome little round for around 25 grains of powder, out shoots the likes of a 308 using 168 AMax in terms of drop and drift (A bullet twice the weight) and with almost half the powder! I have yet to a standard .223 shoot the 80 Amax at anywhere new 3k ftps, although i do know of one .223 shooting the 75Amax at 3030ftps! with no pressure signs!

 

Summary- To honestly sum it up the AI does have several advantages over the standard .223, likewise the standard .223 has some advantaged over the AI, (Factory ammo, feeding, no brass prep/fireformin etc)

 

But to answer the op question, there is not a big advantage in the field tbh when comparing the two, a styandard .223 will also do the same thing lobbing those big bullets.

 

Think its just down to choice my friend and what you want.

 

Any helps of questions mate just fire away bud.

 

 

Steve

hi steve

did you put a accuracy international mag on your 223 to feed the longer cartridges

[247sniper]

No mate I modified mine myself. However I ted to single feed anyhow with my type of shooting. I think you can now get extra long magazines anyway mate.

[247sniper]

No mate I modified mine myself. However I ted to single feed anyhow with my type of shooting. I think you can now get extra long magazines anyway mate.

[Si-Snipe]

What 80's?

Amax bullets.

[Sherlock]

if your wanting more speed from the 75 gr 22br or 22/250 would be my choice. that would need some bolt work/change though and a variation which can be a long drawn out process these days.my shooting buddy has just sold his 223AI and is having a standard 223 for the 75 amax

 

 

Its an interesting thread , with some excellent posts and direct experiences.

 

I pondered going down the tight twist 223 Ackley road on more than one occasion.....

However I was always felt the velocity gains over the standard 223 were to small too offset the downsides of fire-forming and potential feeding issues that are associated with the Ackley shoulder design.

 

The lighter bullets seem to get the most benefit from Ackying the 223 case.

A good friend of mine zips a 40 grain bullet at 4000 fps - That's a decent increase over the 223 rem and makes a great "point and squirt" rifle.

 

 

Back to the thread - I would either stick with a tight twist 223 and accept that velocity will be around 2800 - 2900 fps ... and sitting the longer bullet in a standard mag isn't usually possible ( without modifiying or buying an expensive after market jobby)

 

I agree with Mr Pork Chop - If you want a BIG improvement in performance and trajectory - then consider a 22 BR or a my favourite the .22.250.

 

Here how the some of the alternatives calibres stacks up ( from a trajectory point only )

 

223 - Bullet 75 Grn Amax @ 2850fps - Drop @ 500 yrds = 53.3 ins - Drift 21.4 ins (10 mph / 90 degree)

 

223 AI Bullet 75 Grn Amax @ 2950fps - Drop @ 500 yrds = 49.1 ins - Drift 20.2 ins (10 mph / 90 degree)

 

6mmBR Bullet 105 Grn Amax @ 2850fps - Drop @ 500 yrds = 50.5 ins - Drift 18.1 ins (10 mph / 90 degree)

 

243 win Bullet 105 Grn Amax @ 3050fps - Drop @ 500 yrds = 42.9 ins - Drift 16.5 ins (10 mph / 90 degree)

 

22.250 Bullet 75 Grn Amax @ 3360fps - Drop @ 500 yrds = 35.5 ins - Drift 16.4 ins (10 mph / 90 degree)

 

 

Accuracy is outstanding in my 22.250 with both 75 grn or 80 grn Amax ( this was 3 shots with the 75's)

 

 

ATB

S

[Shuggy]

What twist do you use Sherlock - 1 in 8?

[Sherlock]

What twist do you use Sherlock - 1 in 8?

 

 

Yes - 8 Twist LW barrel.

[Shuggy]

Thank you.

[247sniper]

For your informantion, here is whet my .223 AI put out with 80 grain Amax's. Not bad even with the flyer?

 

 

As you can see from the above data how comparable the little .223 is when compared to the 6mm BR shooting 105 Amax's down range with the high BC bullets.

 

The windage value on my rifle and set up is identical to that of the above listed 6mmBR data, in fact my AI pips it slightly.

[stephentri]

Good shooting hope mind does as good when I get it