KABOOM

42 minutes ago, newsatten said:

Just the one lol, 

By theses i meant Mopar Muscle cars,  The Challenger was a replacement for a Fab 440 RM23 Road Runner,

The E body being a bit smaller and running a hipo 340 small block, is quicker and is a riot on the road, 

I was a body and paint man and worked in the restoration trade for 35 years, mainly E types, sooooo many boring E's

67-72 Muscle has always been my thing,  5 years of outrageous over powered,simple and rubbish handling cars,

Dinosaurs from another age, virtually extinct now apart from few survivors, 

ive been lucky enough to own one almost without a gap since 1977'  

Ive done this particular car to a level that unless its launched it will still be here when the gas finally runs out...........  

Very nice ride! IMHO the best looking car of that era. The modern version is a wonder as well. I cant afford it but my admiration of them is boundless.

The P14 contracts to US arms makers inspired our P17  that was produced faster than Springfield or Rock Island Armory could manage 

with the 1903 Springfield. Our Army had far greater numbers of the P-!7 than Springfields in France during WW1. The USMC never used the P-17. After the war the P-17 was relegated to war reserve and reissued to reserve and national guard units and pow camp guards during WW2. Art Alphin of A-square fame and misfortune used these actions as the basis for his line of African cartridges the "Hannibal" action.

A fine rifle that I enjoy shooting the one flaw is the lack of windage adjustment in the rear sight. A rebuild was undertaken between the wars

resulting in some with 2 groove barrels, others with 4 and 5 groove barrels. These were also the basis for the Model 30 Remington rifle produced after WW1.Some do not like the cock on closure action , I feel its a lack of shooter adaptation once you get the manipulations right imo you don't really notice the difference while shooting.

Very nice! that is a USGI 1907 sling im fairly sure that stock came from the US 1917 as I don't see where the volley sight would be.

Never seen one with that sight before with that price it should sell fast. I had a P14 and after a year of not shooting it I sold it.

10 hours ago, Rangefinder said:

Hi can anyone advise on what causes a different POI with cold bore shot, can this be eliminated? 
 

thanks Jimmy 

My thoughts are some barrels simply require some fouling to maintain zero, others do not. As for shooter warm up the 2 min prep time we had in the USMC was sufficient to adjust the body and establish the natural point of aim. Having shot NRA junior small bore in my youth I soon learned a clean bore required several sighters to re establish zero. Breath and trigger control are always important and dry fire practice is a very good tool. Calling and plotting shots will teach volumes recording sighting changes and conditions as well. Will heat change the poi?, possibly I think only if the assembly isn't square (thread mating) I haven't seen changes in impact while hot or at least enough to matter. As other have said consistency in cheek weld is important, follow through after the shot and not disturbing your shooting position between shots for any reason. Best wishes for good shooting.

11 minutes ago, martin_b said:

Thanks guy's,  I have reloaded in the past not many about 50, but they all went bang and went in the general direction in which they were aimed.  however this is part of the problem as Ive also been given some empty cases and Ive got no idea which have been fired X1 x2 x3... etc..  So after checking the price of new brass, I think I'll start off with 100 new PPU cases, bin all the old cases and then I have a known basline I can start from.

 

c

My solution to the unknown number of firings is brass bucket and sold to a recycler as  scrap. I am in full agreement with new brass. other members made a few points I was going to so I wont be verbose. Best wishes for good loading and shooting.

1 hour ago, Popsbengo said:

Isn't Sweets ammonia based?  This may have something to do with the pitting - it's got a bad rep. for the very problem you have

The problem is getting it all out when you're done.

There are plenty of way better products

Yes ammonia based as is Montana Extreme 50BMG copper killer, I use both with zero issues. However when I finally run out 

Bore Tech is my choice. My sole reason to change is the smell of Sweets and Montana Extreme. Would firing strip rust and make pitting?

I wonder, my natural skeptic is engaged on that idea. Never have fired a shot through a rusted bore seemed a poor idea, and the one rusted bore that was purchased by a friend we cleaned with extreme vigor to remove the "furry rust coat" before firing. This was a Swedish Mauser

M-94 infantry model likely shot with corrosive ammo and ignored before we rescued it from a pawn shop, zero pitting in that bore and I cant explain why not. This is one topic that makes my brain itch. My barrels are Savage, Shilen, Ruger,  Husqvarna, Brno, CZ, Rock Island,  Eddystone,  Springfield (USG version) Smith Corona. None of these pitted after Sweets or Montana Extreme, I don't think the barrel steel differs a huge amount and one of these bores was pre pitted from corrosive GI Ball in service. Best wishes for good shooting.

4 minutes ago, Lloyd said:

If it was the sweets that did it surely it would be throughout the entire barrel? 

 

I have used Sweets for years and zero pitting or other issues, I am extremely careful to purge the bore of it before storing the rifle.

Mostly I use what ever gun oil at hand to purge the Sweets. If possible I flood the bore with a saturated swab then patches with yet more oil.

Probably doe this for 20 mins to ensure all residue is gone , hope this helps.

Having investigated the costs involved this project wont happen unless the donor rifle comes at a very low price point.

RugerNo1 tend to be expensive and not found often in the used market my desire for one with a shot out bore is probably

unobtainium.

On 6/15/2020 at 8:19 AM, Lloyd said:

 

My thought was on corrosive primers but no, so perhaps a few patches of JB Compound and see what happens. If they warranty this great.

Best wishes for good shooting.

On 4/12/2020 at 2:58 PM, Countryboy said:

Hi everyone,

Been reading all the topics on here the last few months, watching videos on YouTube and getting out and practicing as much as I can. Been shooting just over 10 years now mainly shotgun (had my SGC 12 years), a bit of rifle stuff but only just got my own FAC about 6 months back after saying to myself for years about getting round to getting it sorted. I was lucky enough to be a gamekeeper for a couple of years in the uk and abroad so have been lucky enough to experience lots of shooting. 

Anyways, I got my FAC granted for 22lr, 17hmr and .243. I was well chuffed, went straight out and bought myself a 17hmr and have been loving it. I work/live on a farm so I'm lucky enough to get out a fair bit. 

Now enough of my jabbering! I like the idea of joining a club to meet up with like minded enthusiasts, enjoy some good sport and get out of the house a bit more! I'm based in kent and have found a few clubs online but wondered which ones people recommended and I guessed there might even be some members on here too! I know what with the current coronovirus lockdown it might not be happening anytime soon but il be keen as mustard as soon as everything is back on track again!

Sorry for the long post but thanks for any replys 👍👌

Welcome always good to see a new member.

8 hours ago, Popsbengo said:

No that's no help 😂

 

Sir I admire the work you have done. Never in my wildest thoughts would I consider this I do hope it  results in better ammo and groups.

Once again you give me pause to ponder the science involved. My thought is you may be able to improve a consistent pressure while seating. Best wishes for good shooting.

8 hours ago, martin_b said:

15.1MOA...   However I was shooting Magtech 55g cooking ammo and I do wonder if the printed BC of .272 is a trifle optomistic. If it was say .24 then  that makes very little difference at 300Y but a big difference at 600y (subsonic @600)

Should also say i aimed the last shot deliberately high, so i think the issue was speed rather than aim.

I think running a few shots over a chronograph is in order. Perhaps MagTech was doing some creative B.C (BS).  Perhaps create a range card by shooting at assorted distance recording elevation changes and drop. Best wishes for good shooting.

On 6/10/2020 at 1:01 PM, VarmLR said:

Major edit and an embarrassing admission.  It was not N130 (not even I would have loaded that far over book!) it was N133.  Max charge for a hpbt was listed as 24.7gr so I was well below this on my loads.  Redoing the Pmax calculator, it sows things in a more sane light, thankfully.  The primers blowing and the high MVs still point towards a fairly peppy powder batch just opened, so the lesson learned is re-do load dev for each now powder batch.  Batch to batch variations can be significant as I found out yesterday.

New PMax calc , 27.5hr H20 ccase capacity, 23.9gr N133, 26 inch 1/8 barrel:

56.4 Kpsi; 3159 fps.

Actual avareged MV over 10 shots was 3236fps.

Still a peppy load but nowhere near what I would have expected to blow primers.  I checked and the case heads are not bowed, and primer pockets are still nice and tight, so brass is A1 ok.  

Still, clearly over pressure so backing off to closer to 23gr seems sensible.

 

 

Glad things are working out! My worst error was using data with one bullet and I used another with about twice the bearing surface.

At 32 degrees F it was ok the velocity was high enough to make me smile and I should have realized things were amiss. Sadly I didn't until summer. Stiff bolt lift, very flat primers made me look at things closer. After that shoot I disposed of all that brass and reworked the load with new brass and much less powder. Nosler developed data with the same bullet and powder yet even less powder, Im ok with that they have pressure testing ability I don't so I will use proven data from them. I have yet to blow a primer I hope I never do. The variables in dimensions, case capacity and lot to lot changes with powder make me very skeptical of things like Quik Load and any other calculated  un shot data. After re reading your total posts about this situation I think your def on the right track. Learning happens some times easy and harmless and others its HOLY BLEEP lets not do that again. Best wishes for good shooting.

2 hours ago, borbal said:

The Vihtavuori manual does not give data for the Vmax, but it does for the 60 grain SP by Hornady. The COAL was 57.0mm which gives a  calculated usable case capacity of 27.5 grains of H2O. The maximum load in the manual was 23.1 grains of N130, which should leave the case about 96% full (with the bullet seated). The quoted MV was 3173 ft/sec. P-max predicts 3197 ft/sec. with a warm peak pressure of 62717 psi.

23.9 grains of N130 gives a loading density of 99%, so a full case, and an MV of 3305 ft/sec., but the P-Max pressure is now distinctly "red" at 70776 psi. 

It looks like P-Max agrees that reducing your load or increasing your case capacity would be a good move....

70776psi!! wow almost a proof load , That requires backing off the powder !Does the published data show this charge weight? Do you weigh each charge? Mixed cases can cause trouble, I would rework the whole load for safety.  

On 2/1/2020 at 1:49 PM, Popgun said:

i have done a 1-4-1 & have 17hmr on the ticket due back any day now.

I have a superb Anchutz 1417 LR, Deluxe with Pard 008 lrf  that is a keeper & as i have paddock perms that req a quiet rifle

So wise ones what 17hmr do i get ???

I really like the 1417 but do i need to invest so much,in a 17. i fondled a Tikka this afternoon + & a Sako Quad & a Savage, the sako shouldered much nicer than the savage

I have just gained another 600 acres of rabbit corvid land 

tia

Roger

I have and love my Savage 17HMR, but if you don't like the feel buy what feels good at that price point. Best wishes for good shooting.

9 hours ago, Rammer223 said:

I have a Remington 700 vssf in 223 just lately I have had trouble with the bolt been stiff to cam over into firing position , and noticing brass bits brass around bolt face I have checked head space thinking brass wanted bumping but that doesn’t seem to be the problem, the rims of the brass are rough to the touch too what are your thoughts? , I am wondering if whatever chewing the brass is presumably what’s making the bolt stiff 

thanks in advance lee 

 

Sounds like the extractor, seen this in M-9 pistols and some rimfires. Tight stiff bolt lift is a sizing issue or pressure or both. How do the cartridges feed and bolt closure before firing? Stiff then probably sizing, I like a crush fit bolt closure. I have one chamber that insists I fl all the way so  I do. Does factory ammo do this as well? My single shot Ruger No1's I try to chamber with a slight effort, and if I got the fl die set right its hard to get a loaded cartridge to just fall out of the chamber. Best wishes for good shooting

Thank you gentlemen seems things are easier than I thought , still not a done deal and so far the guys with the white wrap around sleeve coat cant find me . this would def be my last rifle build and now for the cash...……. where are those lottery winnings?

4 hours ago, Scooby-93 said:

I know of x2 24” 22 creedmoors shooting 75gr bullets at 3500.

personally I would go 8 twist And shoot the 85.5berger or 90atip

Thank you most of what I saw on .22 creedmoor was in very short barrels and this gives thought to stopping at 26 inches. Good point on twist rate and I will ponder and plot.

9 hours ago, terryh said:

Personally like falling blocks and the No.1 is an updated take on a turn of the century  British rifle.

Think you’d need a gunsmith who knows about them? 

Re.22 CM, do you need all that speed vs accuracy?? Would have thought a 22-6.5x47 or 22BR had more potential? Seen 6-6.5x47’s that are silly accurate.

Triggers are available and I’d fit a ‘Hicks tuner’ as a safety net.

As to stainless and laminate, IMHO making a nice looking rifle on this action would be the way to go and due to how the fore end is mounted would not detract from accuracy 

 

That is one pretty rifle! I don't think speed and accuracy are a one or the other my hope would be .50 or less for  shots at 100 yds. My .204 No1V does way better than that. I have always admired the Farquarson  type action and Daniel Fraser too . A walnut color laminate with stainless would be a real eye catcher. At this point im still dreaming and if im employed at Christmas this may happen. In my world the perfect optic would be a Unertel with external adjustments or the Lyman Target Spot from days gone by, haven't seen either for sale in years. 

I have been doing a mental rifle build in 22 creedmooor intended for long range varminting. Action of choice is Ruger no1 Stainless with 28 inch .75 inch taper barrel.

3 groove barrel and laminate wood. 9 inch twist. The 69grn tmk at 3800 fps makes my brain itch! A donor rifle in 22-250 with a shot out barrel would be a way to do this somewhat cheaper.

As is I think it would be a 3k USD build. Feel free to comment and any ideas I will consider, not committed yet maybe I should be?

11 hours ago, Bangbangman said:

Commercially available cast bullets will usually be lubed already.

 

There are some other differences compared to loading jacketed bullets, eg the need to slightly Bell the case mouth and, in some cases, expand it too. Crimp also important in revolvers and tube-fed rifles

 

I'd do a bit more reading around the subject; there seem to be gaps in your knowledge and you can't safely rely on a forum to find and fill them. 

 

The Lyman cast bullet handbook is a good starting point.

 

 

 

 

 

By definition belling expands the case mouth the idea being just enough so adjust up slow!. Other than that total agreement on printed data

in hand! Its hard not knowing the knowledge level of a forum user and guessing about whats known, on the shelf for purchase or just the odd thought. One added thought on belling, just enough that the base enters the case square not off center quit right there. seat first then roll crimp not a dual action. Crimp on the cannelure. Best wishes for good shooting. I know the die maker say dual crimp/seat possible but imo you will wreck less brass in two stages of work instead of just crimp/seat at the same time.

Cant say I want one but I do think the vents in my CZ550 stock help slow barrel heat. As for any better life idk it has 4400 shots down it , 22-250 and groups fine. Who knows for sure. For machine gun use I think that water jacket is great but no country I can think of uses water cooled machine guns now.

3 hours ago, Andrew said:

I have been shooting 44 magnum for 40+ years and almost all of it with handloads and cast lead bullets. All of the above advice is good, but with lead alloy bullets it's important to remember that with a well-fit bullet, velocity does not cause leading; pressure that exceeds the yield strength of the alloy does. Velocity and pressure do not go hand in hand. A look at a Lyman manual will show that some of the fast burning shotgun powders give low velocities but with pressures in the jacketed range. As was pointed out, it's a matter of time. How quickly maximum pressure for the cartridge is reached. A charge of very quick powder burns quickly and produces little gas to push the bullet. Slower powder just the opposite resulting in a slower peak and more gas volume to push the bullet. (simplistically speaking) If you have a bullet that is hard cast with a gas check, you can drive them at jacketed speeds provided you use the correct powder -one that gives the velocities you want but staying within the pressure constraints of the particular alloy of the bullet. I shoot .225" ,  56 grain cast bullets at 2750 fps with MOA accuracy and no leading using this principle.

With that said, Bullseye is a terrible choice for 44 magnum. I used it waaay back for 38 Special revolver loads but finally switched to Unique. The Bullseye was too peaky and a double charge would be disastrous. (I wasn't worried about myself but the thought of my beautiful Colt Shooting Master revolver disintegrating is heartbreaking)  I still have the original canister of Bullseye I was using, unloved and unused.

I have zero experience with Vhit powders so I cannot advise. I used Accurate 5744 and Alliant 2400 for my 200 M handgun loads, and hunting loads from my Remington 44 mag bolt gun and assorted handguns. They worked well. Unique was also a good powder but with bullets in the 240 -255 grain range, about 10 grains was all you wanted to use though I recall 12.5 was the top?? In any event, I settled on 8-10 grains.

Since You are using a rifle, I will warn that  to use cast bullets to the best advantage, your bore should be as free of copper fouling as possible. Copper will cause leading and inaccuracy. Really get the bore to bare metal for cast bullets. I shoot a lot of cast bullets in CF rifles from 222 to 30-06 and all are dedicated cast bullet guns. No copper jacketed rounds go through them.  Good luck.~Andrew

Well said,  had I not been up after a 12 hr night shift I hope I would have said what you did with such clarity.

18 hours ago, Kipper said:

I can source 250gr lead bullets locally,

They have starline brass too.

They stock bullseye powder also, is that suitable ? I'm assuming it large pistol primers too

You will love Starline brass I use it in .44mag. Not knowing what powder is available limits my thought but I would not use bullseye in that huge case, I do use Accurate Arms No 7 and when that dwindles Alliant 2400 over a 240grn swc .

On 5/29/2020 at 3:43 PM, Reecy said:

That's a great find -especially because it was already yours and didn't cost you anything 

what type of powder did you have squirrelled away and when did it enter its hiding place?

good for you😃😃

atb

 

reecy

Cfe223 and Alliant 2400 purchased at some point 2012 to 2016?? Tbh I just don't know. Seems it found the darkest hole in the cabinet normaly used for storage of coffee cans and shop rags. Perhaps all it wanted was a cool dark soft place to raise its young.