KABOOM

11 hours ago, terryh said:

Mr.C,

Tikka's always seem to work out of the box.

Howa's in my local club in 223 are good and folks at my old club rate Bergara. CZ's perhaps?

Really you need to try and get to shoot what you fancy 1st if at all possible, see if the stock feels right.

Sound advice

Western Powder also has data with Tac for this projectile on line.

69 grain SierraTMK over CFE223 as indicated by Hodgdon data on line. I shot these in my 9 inch twist Savage with great results at 200 yards on paper and 500 yards on steel. Way less wind drift. Conditions were 3/4 value wind at 10 -15 mph gusting.

1 minute ago, MarinePMI said:

With respect, your examples are flawed. Anything hit with an FMJ, is likely going to need another FMJ to put it down.   They just don't expand for crap.  Sometimes they're dead and just don't know it yet...

As for the VMax, the opposite happens with the same result; another round is needed.  Varmint bullets like the VMax are designed for violent expansion, causing "bullet splashing" where the round comes apart before it can penetrate enough to do the deed.  We see it all the time on coyotes and wolves here in the States

A properly expanding bullet AND a penetrating shot to the vitals or CNS, is what reliably puts an animal down.  One or the other is (largely) a false argument.

My example was based on the fact that the prarie dog lived because its heart/lungs or head were not hit, fmj was the only ammo we had at the time. The sole intent was to show things can and do survive being poorly hit. Having shot thousands of V-MAX I am well aware of it's capability and limitations.  The need for shot placement with any bullet is  what I intended to show. 

Shot placement is paramount. having seen small rodent's live after a hit with 8x58fmj then another hit with 30calfmj lesson drilled into my head. Same size rodent with 223 VMAX had to be hit again with another VMAX launched from a 22-250 to stop the escape. You must hit the "shut off switch" or things run off.

Not the solution but have you seated the 165RNSP deeper? 

On 7/25/2020 at 7:38 AM, Andrew said:

I don't know as it is grossly unsafe as the seated bullet then expands the neck, and a 243 has enough juice to blow the neck away from the bullet there would be the issue of starting the load development all over again and all the added steps. If you want more neck tension use the Lee Factory Crimp die. Trimming the cases to identical lengths for correct crimping will be waaaay less of a chore than what you were planning.~Andrew

Im with you. I cant understand for the life of me why 020 under would be a good idea. With a 28 degree inner chamfer you might seat a projectile but the very thought of the unknown pressure rise makes me very unhappy.

RCBS case lube cheap and works very well.

On 8/6/2020 at 12:35 PM, brown dog said:

I've got a bizarre hankering after a workhorse side by side hammer 12b, but something made to modern standards - does such a thing exist in UK?

CZ has a hammer double one with 30 inch barrel's the other is a coach gun no chokes 20 inch barrel's. I have the coach gun. Used on rabbit's and 16 yard handicap trap doubles. Yes the high end shooter's looked askance at me until I managed 23 of 25 birds smashed.

Some barrels don't group well with some ammunition price be dammed. Some it just doesn't matter what you use they group fine.

10 hours ago, brown dog said:

I would stand correction, but most mg barrels are hammer forged, which does all sorts of advantageous things (for mgs) to the metal - it isn't autofrettage, but some of the effects are similar , but I agree, I would think that once they're really hot, it's about erosion: mechanical and gas wash

My most marked hot barrel memory was seeing a minimi barrel thrown on snow at about -5degC melt straight down through a foot of snow and start the vegetation beneath smoking!

That's a bit warm sir! 

On 7/23/2020 at 11:14 AM, martin_b said:

Norma Creedmoor Brass seems to be £178 for 100, if I shoot 20 to 30 in an hour that’s a fair few beer tokens.  For competition or precision shooing I fully understand what you say, but when all I’m trying to do is let off a bit of steam and not hit the electronics, “free” brass does have its advantages 🙂

While cost is a factor indeed unknown brass is not the way. Why ask for trouble use brass that you know for sure the number of firings

and keep notes on usage. Safe reliable accurate ammo is the goal, not the potential loss of things you may want ( eyes, fingers ect).

I use the box they come in. 

We use the term fire cracking and I often wonder is it a combined action of thermal action plus erosion. Full auto is in my mind one of the harshest things you may do to a barrel. When I served in uniform 5-10 shot bursts were the norm . That had to induce a huge thermal change between bursts or if fire was more continuing the need to change barrels at 100-200 rounds to cool them off. Having set the chamber end of a M-60 MG barrel on wood right after it came off the gun at 200 rounds instant fire was the result so a large rock to keep the chamber out of the dirt.

19 hours ago, SMLE said:

A golden rule I have for my reloading practice is: If In Doubt - Chuck It Out.........

Very well said sir. My practice as well

I favor two product's, Birchwood Casey Rust Inhibiting Grease or Corrosion X. Both work! I have a heating rod in the gun safe with a low humidity environ I still need something to stop all forms of rust. This is the third rust related Tika post i remember so it may not be all Bore tech related.

10 hours ago, Andrew said:

Never done that. I clean what I can reach and call it done.~Andrew

We are alike and now and then i use the lug recess tool. Unless the action is full of grit ( always possible in wy) i dont worry much.

8 hours ago, srvet said:

I have used this bullet quite a lot and have found the jump to lands or 50 to 80 thou to work well. I think giving these bullet a jump to lands is about avoiding a pressure spike as much as anything.  Plugging the numbers in to Quickload it looks like you have some leeway to increase the powder charge a bit whilst watching for signs of pressure. I have found good results in two 308 win rifles at velocities around 3050fps (20 inch 1 in 10 twist) so it may be that you are just off a node. Half grain increments may also be a bit coarse to identify what is going on, Personally I use 0.2 to 0.3 grain increments. It sounds like you have some chronograph data, what were the SD and ES numbers like?

I have also seen lateral displacement between different bullets, that at least in my lighter profile stalking rifle is very consistent. I put it down to differing harmonics and dont lose much sleep over it. 

Barnes does the.050 off the lands for pressure spike avoidance. As to why they print left imo its nothing more than this projectile just does.... yes simplistic i wish i had a better explanation. Most of my rifles print to center with any projectile weight regardless.........not all.

Baffles me too. Best wishes for good shooting

10 hours ago, spanner said:

Would you buy one for Game if you could only use none toxic shot?  I have seen a lovely 687EELL but with BASC supporting a Lead Ban would you buy one assuming Lead is gone in 5 years?

Are non toxic shells for sale in the uk?

6 hours ago, Rem Imperri said:

Welcome to the joy of long range shooting. Much to be learnt, and unfortunately the further you shoot the more it appears to be black magic... 
Seriously some of the people wind reading on Stickledown are like shamans or something I swear!

That would be the art of S.W.A.G ( scientific wild ass guess). Tech, experience, intuition and let it rip and see what happens. A great way to look heroic or a confirmed goat. best wishes for good shooting.

i should have mentioned i have exactly one push feed plunger ejector action and i dont get marks on my brass shooting in temps around 30c. The rest are mauser type, true mauser, or Ruger no1 with a M-1 Garand because its kinda required by dna. Not that i recall the place i read it but , i have read some on primer flattening and how on firing the primer un seats slams on the bolt face and reseats. Tbh i look more to bolt lift and ease of extraction for pressure signs. I learned to confine my testing to the hottest times of year so my loads will be ok when i shoot the most. Powders that are not temp sensitive are used. 

1 hour ago, Ejcb said:

Hi guys,

Managed to to test the 4451 / CCI450 / 147 ELDM / Lapua 6.5CM SRP brass combo at bisley.

I used a magnetospeed v3 on my 24" Tikka Tac A1 using an MK Machining mount, so the chrono wasn't attached to my barrel.

The wind 10 to 20 MPH from all angles, air and ammo temp was 21C, measured with a kestrel and laser thermometer respectively.

All loads grouped well despite the wind, so I focused on SD/ED and will shoot for groups another day in more favourable conditions.

The below 40.6 grain load had excellent figures, but is quite slow - however Tikka barrels can be known to be slow, however given the relatively warm ammo temperature of 21C, on a more common, cooler day I may see a lower MV, although the IMR Enduron range are meant to be relatively temperature insensitive - ( https://precisionrifleblog.com/2016/06/19/powder-temp-stability-hodgdon-extreme-vs-imr-enduron/#:~:text=That%20is%20very%2C%20very%20low,to%20large%20swings%20in%20temperature. - approx 68 FPS from -3 to 60C)

Unfortunately the other shots of the below series were not recorded, however they grouped very nicely at 600 and seem to have good SD/ES.

I did however notice some marks on the Lapua brass after their first firing, I am unsure whether this is brass wipe or smear from the virgin brass on the bolt face during fireforming, from bolt unlock and cartridge extraction, or from excessive pressure. 

In the picture below the 41.2 load cartridges have been arranged to place the ejector marks at the 6 o'clock position.

What are your thoughts?

 

21c isnt very hot and the primers look fine, maybe a sign of pressure? how was bolt lift and extraction? Possibly compare some factory ammo  and if its the same and no other signs as mentioned above carry on. best wishes for good shooting.

That 162 A-Max will drift less at longer ranges probably compress your charge some what no worries i do that now with a 140TSX Barnes and zero issues. Remington brass, CCI 200 primers and if i recall a max charge of H4831sc for about 2750 fps if memory serves.

On 7/7/2020 at 6:32 AM, Elliott said:

I'm getting just under 3,800fps with N530 so you should easily achieve that with 32gr Blitz.

If you're going for a rebarrel as stated above, get a tighter twist for the 39gr Blitz and go for 25" 👍🏻

CFE223 will do the trick easy! best wishes for good shooting

Each shot fired with whatever powder erodes barrels. Some do more than others possibly. I have 4400 shots through my CZ 22-250 having used 3 powders and it shoots fine. Not as fast as new for sure. i have read and not done that you may add powder to regain velocity lost via throat erosion. i mitigate the throat roughness with JB Compound seems to help. Your requirment's of accuracy will vary from mine, at this point the CZ will do sub half inch at 100 yds plenty good enough for my usage. Best wishes for good shooting