outlanda

8 hours ago, Duster31 said:

Does any one know if we will ever get a heavier 20cal bullet again as Berger don’t make the 50gr any more I think the 20cal guns would be unreal if we could get some 50/55gr 

Only bullet manufacturers know the answer and no doubt will make them if they can sell them. Fact they have stopped making them is probably a clue. No real gain over the 40gr performance and a faster twist barrel that eliminates all factory rifle options. The .223 looks more appealing at 50/55gr onwards. 

10 hours ago, pwinnall said:

Hello Steve,

I have spoken with Oto,  here is his email address. I will send his mobile to you by PM.

oto@cotswoldclassicarms.co.uk

 

thanks Phil 

Good evening Phil.

Thank you for your help. I am going to contact Oto and see what he can do. I have made some progress with the Tippmann but i cannot see it achieving 1/2" at 50yds with some work and that costs so will replace probably end of year to give Tippmann every chance. Also not a good time for a variation in Devon and Cornwall right now.

Cheers

Steve   

35 minutes ago, pwinnall said:

Hello Steve,  

It’s a standard 16” CMMG barrel with eley ammo.

Do you have a muzzle brake fitted?  They can open up the groups.

speak to Oto, at classic arms. He has done lots of research to get the optimal accuracy.

thanks Phil  

 

Thank you Phil. I use a sound moderator  not a muzzle break on my Tippmann and 1" at 50yds is more the normal. I have made some progress with it now. I have gone back to the Eley Action i started with and 150 rounds no stoppages so far. I have been following this thread and very interested in the Cotswold build, i have tried to email Oto from website and wasn't successful.

Thank you

Steve   

On 8/16/2021 at 11:41 PM, pwinnall said:

Hello,

Have a look at Aero Precision M4E1 upper and lower. It has the forward assist but you don’t need to install the pusher. 
Aero hand guard too is nice.. Better mag adapter for use of the S&W mags.

You can get a .223 upper too. Aero bits are all .223 based and mil spec. 

Lots of trigger options. I use a CMC single stage. 
CMMG bolt group and 16” barrel gives 1/2 at 50m all day long. 
I had Gavin at Brownells make mine or you can use Oto from cotswold classics arms.  Or if you have lots of money ask Oto for a Battle Arms rifle.
Oto can pencil your barrel and fit a carbon sleeve for weight reduction. It is still accurate too.   

You can make a big saving and wait for a Black Friday deals on Aero bits from Brownells.  Brownells offer a lifetime warranty too. 
ps. Aero make spikes and a few other brands. Aero Precision used to be an aerospace company but found they have more business with AR’s 

Good luck Phil 

What barrel have you fitted, interested in 1/2" groups at 50m. Thank you.

Steve 

38 minutes ago, srvet said:

What issues have you had if you don’t mind me asking? Or is it just the AR platform you dislike? 

I like the AR platform and decided Tippmann was way to go. Disappointed i started looking at a replacement AR even. Have since learned i need to be spending 2K to be sure of something decent. Maybe a bolt gun but not on a toy. $500 or less in US and that's how it shoots. Unique bolt design makes it feel like a springer air rifle. I liked the mag design at first; the 10 round mag drives me mad. Takes longer to load than shoot it. I dont care for authenticity, function more important. A bog standard out the box 10/22 will match Tippmann performance and with a few tweaks would be a better option; i think for me anyway. I would like to find the best AR .22lr s/a so interested in comments on this thread and thank any one sharing their experience. Apart from odd lucky find, i don't believe the ultimate AR exists in the 1K budget hence why i looking at alternatives. This budget will build a decent 10/22 

Got a Tippmann. I don't think i would recommend it although many owners seam very happy with them. Giving up on AR types and building a ruger 10/22 again so may well be a Tippmann for sale by end of year.

On 5/18/2021 at 7:47 PM, clivej said:

bungee costing me a small fortune in ammo so far. All the 'Target' ammo didn't shoot at all great IMO grouping 25mm/35mm with flyers. I've still to try Eley ammo, when I can find some.

But a better day shooting my CZ 457 LRP today. Just a little wind this morning and shot the best groups so far at 50m. Using SK Standard Plus, in the yellow box. I'll say the groups are a tad smaller than I've writen down, small red circle is 1/2". First group, top right, is with a cold clean barrel. Then shot right to left , then down.

A beauty or what. Elements Helix 6-24x50mm SFP, with the MRad reticle

Good groups with that scope choice. The centre dot is too big for best accuracy, worth trying a scope with a finer reticle. Or first just use one of the hash marks as they are finer than the dot just to see if what i have discovered makes any sense.

Another for .17HMR as preferred option. Never was very impressed with .17Hornet. A .20 cal or .223 will do everything the .17H will do and more. Noise,  barrel length, carry weight, magazine capacity,  safety and bulk ammo deals are reason for preference.

23 hours ago, terrierman said:

Hi. 

I’ve got a.204 on order but would just like to see what recommendations there are out there. I’m not bothered about the weight. More concerned about which is the quietest. 

All suggestions appreciated. 

Hi 

I have a 20 practical so slightly smaller than a .204R. So my experience may well differ from others none the less i thought i would contribute. My experience with .204 is that its a noisy calibre and hard to moderate and as yet i haven't found the ultimate moderator. Of course others may hear it differently and have a different opinion. 22" barrel helps, i would prefer shorter but i would expect it to be even noisier. Tried old faithful T8 and was probably best but heavy and rust problem. Replaced with wildcat predator, weight saving but no light weight, better build but not as quiet. Now use a wildcat evo which is noisier than predator but is lighter. Velocity is faster through evo than predator but don't know why. I have both .223 and .204 baffles for evo and no difference in sound moderation. I want to try Stalon one day only because its lighter -  i don't expect any miracle improvements the .204 is noisy just not quite as bad as 22/250. Compared to .223 i find the same sound moderators more effective on .223.  

22 hours ago, Furyan said:

Im thinking of moving upto the 223 form the 17Hornet Now i do like the hornet but the wind dont like it even with 30grn bullets . Im wanting to shoot out to 600-700 yrds vermin ,Any suggestions on twist, barrel, length,

Bullet ?

it will also be used for deer where applicable.what are the Tikka tac1 like anyone got or used one ?

good move. Factory rifle then Tikka with 1/8. Save the cost of exotic custom build calibres and spend it on stock upgrade. 

20 hours ago, Bangbangman said:

Is it sold?

 

Thanks 

Yes sold.

Thank you 

On 11/18/2020 at 7:15 PM, Richiew said:

Hi all 

ideal setup for me is daylight bunnies upto 100 yds = 22lr  anything over that and night gear is the 17 hmr to 140 yds and the odd close fox . Longer range fox will be a 223 eventually . 22lr in daylight doesn’t make too much noise to spook the bunnies but you do need to know the drops in the scope . Night time with the flat shooting hmr just need to get used to how big the bunny looks in the scope at effective ranges and adjust for a bit of wind . 
cheers 

 

HI. This seams to arse about face to me. Generally daytime rabbiting is at longer range than night time lamping unless you like that field craft thing where you are crawling round on your belly. Why make it so complicated? Use the advantage of the flat shooting .17HMR for Longer range in day and if you must use .22lr then keep it to 50-60yds lamping at night, although harder to estimate range at night so use .17hmr instead  Quick and simple.

I have been on this same path as OP and then come to my senses. I pretty much agree with comments above except .17hmr bashing..

I also convinced myself i needed a 17 hornet. Great factory ammo but hopeless rifle choice and overpriced because it was the 'in thing'

The ad said it shoots like a 55gr .223 and one day the penny dropped. So why not just shoot a .223 especially if you already have one. And in my case i also have a 20 cal. So i had 3 rifles to do the same thing and any one will do just fine. I didn't like the 17 hornet enough to drop the .17hmr and the hornet went instead. .17hmr is a useful round especially when you already have the rifle. If you got that yearning for a 17H then go for it and see if its for you, i would never say otherwise but you already have a rifle that will match it in every way and exceed it in others.  

I have used A tec wave, SAK and Wildcat whisper & Panther. SAK is the bench mark and A tec equal to it in sound moderation on 16" barrel. Sak strippable and Wave is not but not important. Prefer Wave because lighter and no light shine off back of mod unlike the SAK when lamping. I have a Panther that is going to be sold.

11 hours ago, brown dog said:

Nice, but the 2nd target is about 0.9 and 4th is about 1.1 to my eye - and that's the reality / frustration of .22!

The whole thrust of this thread is that people shouldn't ignore the parts of their groups that they don't like just because it's a .22! 😂😊😊 

 

Agreed 100%. I don't understand how shots are not counted in the group regardless of reason. Brexit pro euro thinking. If I discounted shots I messed up I would be incredibly good lol.

Forgive me if I miss the point of the thread. Are Vudoo and Bergara .22lr practice rifles for centre fire Rem actions primarily and of similar weight for that reason?. Also the T1X could be Tikka equivalent? And as if it ever gets off the ground in the UK there is only one open class then anything goes. Surely weight is immaterial as long as you can hold the thing. If there is to be a sub class then why not 'base' class as it is across the pond where its limited to factory spec rifle and scope and rrp say £1000?
Otherwise I don't see what the Bergara or voodoo offer over an Anschutz etc etc; as long as it has a 10 round or more magazine which is where the 1761 fails - and no chassis of course(why oh why is there no chassis for a Sako Quad? MDT)    

2 hours ago, Twodogs said:

Standard Sako Quad. 50m outdoors. Eley Tenex. 

Oh YEs - very nice groups Two dogs. I know the quad can do that; I just wish I could do that. 8/8 

22 hours ago, brown dog said:

A pic showing all the groups on the neighbouring aiming marks would be useful for 'balance', if those are cherry-pick groups.

Reading the post and the clue is consistency means these are cherry picked. However I will confirm the quad capable of this accuracy as mine can do the same with Eley match and SK match consistently. As for all the time then my abilities are the cause of poor groups. I use my quad for benchrest. I  keep up with Anschutz's and beat some sometimes.

4 hours ago, Andrew said:

 I have no clue why the average shooter would buy one of these rifles and immediately toss the SAKO-made barrel. All of mine shoot well under MOA. .~ Andrew

 

Totally agree Andrew. I don't understand the barrel swapping 'upgrading?' when many that have done so, say its a real pain to do and no noticeable improvement in accuracy. Only thought is maybe to upgrade for a heavier larger dia barrel to fill the barrel channel on custom stocks, if that's the case then probably best look at a CZ457 HB option instead - easier?

Steve 

I have selected and attached photo of best 5 shot group at 50m with tikka t1x trying some eley action for first time. It may look good but only when i see the rest of the groups do I know what the accuracy is really like and in the conditions I just got lucky. I was also trying different sound moderators which will have an effect. Average group 13-15mm at 50m Tikka T1x with cheap ammunition. All shots should be included.

16 minutes ago, John MH said:

He's not Tiff.

Yes thank you I know.

8 hours ago, lapua said:

The bergara barrelled action was £699, pretty good value. Extra mag was about £50.

I'm interested in this Tiff. 

12 hours ago, Aggy said:

Everything shot should  be part of the group good or bad ,

Yep agreed. Multiple groups of 5 or 10 shots with .22lr ammunition in same conditions at 50yd/m to determine accuracy and to eliminate 'fliers' or a bad shot. Just picking the best group says little about reliable accuracy imho.

6 minutes ago, Ronin said:

 

 

Problems with T1 x - ovoid Action due to factory torquing the three barrel set screws to the extent they warp the action body

Sort barrel yourselves using Anchutz take off and Win 52D reamer or similar that suits your use 

Or build on a custom rimfire action or use a Annie 1710 action or convert a 54 to repeater or find a Win 52 for original twin lug kudos 

T1X are quite accurate out the box even if the action is warped and despite the tacky placky factory stock. Easy to replace trigger with B and A if you have one but factory trigger is OK just with spring replacement.

I don't doubt there is better but not for £500. Totally upgradeable sure but go to the trouble of building custom this and that custom that for a .22lr  - just shoot the bloody thing and enjoy affordable accuracy.  

I have for sale a Factory fitted alloy trigger guard and a 10 round .223 Tikka magazine taken off of my Tikka T3X CTR purchased new in March 2019 . Probably could be used for other calibres as mag has insert to reduce to .223 - but I don't really know for sure. Sold together for £150.