Catch-22

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@woodsie99

ill have the AICS .308 mag please.

Just to confirm, it is a proper AICS pattern Double Stack, Single Feed?

Personally I agree with the above.

.223 will limit your range unless you buy factory ammunition loaded with heavy bullets (eg 77g, 80g +)...but you’ll need a rifle with an appropriate twist (1-8”, 1-7”) to properly accommodate and stabilise the heavy bullets...likely meaning a custom barrel = spendy.

A good off the shelf rifle should suit your needs, one in one of the following calibers will do you well out to 1000m. All these calibres have suitable factory and/or military surplus ammunition available, suitable to get you out to those ranges. In no particular order;

6mmBR, 6.5x55 Swede, 6.5 Creedmoor, .308/7.62 NATO

There are plenty of other suitable calibres out there but the above will be easily available to buy ammunition for. Personally I’d look at a .308w/7.62 NATO for hitting steel with, or entering F class, particularly if on a budget...ammunition will be a bit cheaper compared to the others. 

My 2 pennies worth.

Agree with the above, though you’ll need a medium/long action for the 6.5x55 Swede as it’s a fair bit longer than a 6.5x47, 6.5 Creed, .260 etc. 

Though I have owned several 6.5x47 and it’s a lovely round. Very easy to reload and find a very accurate load for. 

Not UK based but have you seen the Shotmarker system by the designer/maker of the Autotricker system?

https://www.autotrickler.com/shotmarker.html

Owning an Autotricker/Autothrow combo, I can attest to the quality of Adam’s products. I’m positive his Shotmarker system would be of the same high quality.

Seems you can connect multiple systems together, linking up an entire range.

Bit more high tech than the retrieval system but probably needs less maintenance in the long run. Plus it gives instant feedback...no waiting for retrieval’s. 

Price reduced

Sunny afternoon bump 😎

I choose to look at the online data provided by the powder manufacture (select cartridge, powder I’m using and general bullet weight).

For example, I use both Vihtavouri and Reload Swiss powders, so will consult their online data for given cartridge and bullet weights. I always found the Hodgdon online resource helpful too in the past. 

And I also trawl various forums, using a basic Google search for matching cartridge, powder and bullet weight. But you’ve got to be mindful of the BS some people chat...so plumbing for a good average is wise (eg 20x people with a very similar charge, not just one person).

I take this bunch of varying load data and make a judgement, comparing against the data of the powder manufacture, to determine both a starting load and a safe max load for an initial OCW load test.

Often I find my start loads can be 15% higher than the ‘official’ start load and be no where near to max pressure.

Hmm, I would disagree re barrel weights.

Thing is, the AI’s had lighter profile barrels because it’s all about compromise. The solider, with heavily laden Bergen, a rifle that’s heavy to begin with and carrying all the other kit, plus tabbing somewhere for 12+ hrs isn’t quite the same as the PRS game. Shoot a stage and the rifle gets set down. Plenty of time to have a breather and regain ones strength, so no reason not to go heavier if you can.

The heavier profiles are better because they’re stiffer (proven to produce better accuracy), offer better balance and permit longer shot strings before accuracy wanes. 

Interestingly, it seems that the vast majority of PRS shooters in the US are now switching over to heavier profiles after several years of shooting medium or heavy Palmer contours. Some even seemingly use a full bull barrel (I think the PRS’s 6th top shot was shooting a 26” bull). So I wouldn’t shy away from the heavier profiles.

https://precisionrifleblog.com/2019/01/05/best-rifle-barrel-2/

48 minutes ago, Shendy said:

I was thinking something in 6.5 or heavy 6mm.

barrel 24-26 just so its easy moving on stages.

ffp scope as you say quick corrections

 

The 6’s are ballistically better but will be harder on barrels and might be more difficult to spot splash at distance, especially in bad weather.

26” barrels give great velocity without needing to up charge weights too far. The extra length and weight will give greater balance and stability keeping you on target better.

FFP scopes are definitely better for quick holdovers and turret dialling. But do consider looking at specific holdover reticles, like the ‘Christmas Tree’ type. Some may think they’re too cluttered but you soon get past that with some training. The benefit is that you simply have a 100m zero and you never need to touch the turrets when transitioning between targets, just use the reticle holdovers. This saves HUGE time on stages that require multiple engagements in a short time frame.

Impact 737R action

MPA Competition Chassis

6.5x47L, 6.5 Creed or 6 Dasher

Any of the top barrels, 26”, Heavy Varmint or MTU contour

Area 419 Sidewinder brake

Trigger Tech Diamond trigger, set @ #1lb

Harris bipod (quicker to release under time constraints)

Any of the top scopes. I would have a preference for any with a Horus H59 reticle for fast holdovers. Personally I like the 5-25x56 PMII’s turret design...just me.

Just an opinion.

Worth a read.

https://precisionrifleblog.com/2018/12/29/custom-rifle-action/

The guys behind the Impact actions do engineering for NASA, Gov and Aerospace sectors, so know their shizzle about keeping tolerances tight and exact.

Slightly off topic, but the Impact Precision 737R actions are all made to such exact specs that all  barrels chambered and threaded for them are done using CNC machines and never need to be headspaced for each individual action.

Simply buy a barrel off their shelf and screw it on your action. 

Interestingly I’ve heard from a couple of gunsmiths, who CNC chamber barrels for the Impact actions, say that they cannot do the same procedure for other custom actions, including Defiance, as the tolerances simply aren’t identical action to action, like the Impact’s are.

The above is one of many reasons why they’re the preferred action used in the PRS league as those guys go through 3-4 barrels a season.

Another +1 for the Whidden dies (6.5x47L and .338 Norma Mag).

I chose NOT to go full custom route (eg sending them 3 fired cases) and chose their ‘standard’ dies as I too wanted to reuse the same die sets once I rebarrel both calibres. I own the .338NM reamer but not the 6.5x47, so couldn’t guarantee specs to be the same.

Tbh, their ‘standard’ dies are very precise - I don’t think I’d notice/see any difference between them and their custom dies.

And yes, the Whidden family are extremely helpful and customer service is top notch!

4 hours ago, markymark said:

I have both ZP5 & PM 5-25 scopes. 

You are splitting hairs between optical quality on these scopes. I think choice would come down to other areas and price / availability. 

Both have seriously good glass! The PM2 tips it for resolution but only by a nats cock. Brightness, edge to edge the same through my eyes. When conditions are good, the Minox looks lightly better to me, anything other than perfect the S&B takes the win (only just)

MR5 ret is great, and better than the MSR. But I would have the MSR2 which isn’t available on the ZP5. 

Turrets. I prefer the S&B only because I want Locking turrets. If I was going a standard double turn PM2 I would prefer the ZP5 turrets. 

Both track excellently with no issues.

Looks are subjective. Weight & size very similar.

My 2p you can’t go wrong with either. If you were going new, the ZP5 would be cheaper so I would say get that. If you could pick up a good price PM2 with the turrets & Ret of your choosing at a good price. Consider that. 

As mentioned. The ZP5 can hold its own up with the best for a cheaper price. 

Everywhere I’ve looked, the Minox ZP 5-25x56 is more expensive than the PMII.

Where did you find it cheaper please?

Cheers

Bump

Treated myself last year to a bit of bling 😁

https://www.joferusa.com/?wpsc-product=338-lapua-mag-solid-billet-aluminum-reloading-tray

Bump

Bump

Stick an expander mandrel down inside the neck. Rounds the neck nicely, removes dings and pushes brass neck wall inconsistencies to outside of neck, improving neck tension.

Mine is a 1-8” twist, 26” tube. 

I run the 123g Scenars at around 2920fps.

According to both Lapua 6DOF and TRASOL apps i need about 9.8mils of elevation and, the 123g Scenar is travelling around 1246fps at 1000m, so still supersonic.

As per title. Gold/orange colour.

Perfect, as brand new condition, comes with original box, instructions, hard shell case (see pics).

https://r-p-r.co.uk/kestrel/2500-handheld-weather-meter.php

Sold

Thing is the OP is using a DTA...he not looking for a dedicated ELR on a solid action.

But I do agree, one can single load. But not sure if the OP wants to single load. As he’s using a repeater, one can assume that he’ll still want the benefits of using the mag?!? 

Still think it’s a valid consideration to bear in mind....if using the mag is indeed still his intention. I’ve seen a few people get a .338lm only to realise the long bullets they want to use don’t fit...so have to resort to single loading, something they didn’t want/plan to do.

Unfamiliar with the length of DTA mags, but before you go .338LM route, double check how long you’ll be able to load your bullets. You don’t want a short mag length forcing you to seat those long bullets (the 300g are long) deep into the powder column.

Seating 300g bullets out of the powder column when using non CIP length mags was one of the key design considerations of the .338NM & .300NM. 

@John MH

Those Area419 sidewinder brakes are very nice, they definitely do an amazing job on taming my .338NM.