Do any of you shoot with iron sights?

[njc110381]

Hey guys. I'm not sure what the reaction to this is going to be on here. I know it's a long range quarry shooting forum but as a lot of us are keen target shots I am wondering if anyone does any target or even live quarry shooting with iron sights?

 

I plan to use my new combi gun for hunting but it only has irons. I could fit a scope but I don't want to. I will limit my Deer shooting to whatever range I can get a 4" group, but I'd like some idea of how good a group it's possible to achieve so I have something to work to!

 

So, are there any military target shooters that use irons here? How good are you?

[Cornishman]

So, are there any military target shooters that use irons here? How good are you?

 

That's a gauntlet thrown down!

 

A couple of months ago I tested an old Target Rifle (based on an 1896 Mauser) at our local 100m range. I was well chuffed to get a group just over 0.6" but this was all slinged up with a black target on a white background. There's no way I'd conclude that this could be done in the field shooting under pressure, maybe in poor light and with a target that does not contrast well with the background. Bear in mind as well that getting a tight group is not so good if it's six inches away from where you wanted to hit.

 

I'd do some testing by putting up targets with four-inch kill zones and see at what range you can reliably hit.

[njc110381]

I'd do some testing by putting up targets with four-inch kill zones and see at what range you can reliably hit.

 

 

That's my plan. I'll only shoot out as far as I feel happy with. I'm not the sort to go out taking pot shots at wildlife unless I'm certain I'm going to give it a clean ending.

 

.6 inches is taking the p***! I hope that wasn't dropped in as a target for me to beat because if it was, you win!

[bbrc]

I've messed around with open sights on a few of my rifles over the years. Regularly got sub 3" groups out of a 308 military mauser 98, one of my best groups was 1.5" from a remmy model seven (All at 100m).

You need a big dot to see to shoot at though!

[Vermincinerator]

I shot a 1 1/4" 10 shot group @ 100yds with my old Sharps BPCR supported some years ago, prior to that 15 shots into 5" @ 100yds with an AR15 off hand before the semi-auto ban

 

Ian.

[menial 1]

I'll know how well I shoot with irons shortly as I picked up my new toy today and I'm going to use it for fallow in the woods once I've had a little time with it.

http://www.marlinfirearms.com/Firearms/xlr/1895XLR.asp

Pete.

[njc110381]

A Deer is a pretty big dot! My idea is to make some A4 sized Deer pictures and shoot them at 25 yards. If I can place my shots right on them at that range then a full sized Deer at 100 should be simple enough.

[Vermincinerator]

I'll know how well I shoot with irons shortly as I picked up my new toy today and I'm going to use it for fallow in the woods once I've had a little time with it.

http://www.marlinfirearms.com/Firearms/xlr/1895XLR.asp

Pete.

 

Thats gonna sting a bit pete even with downloaded factory ammo, a mate of mine has a Ruger No1 in 45-70 and he loads to levels bordering on low end 458 Win Mag ballistics, you certainly know when you have touched one of them off.

I dont know if they are available here in the Uk but Garrett Cartridges make some super hunting grade ammo for the 45-70 have a look HERE

 

Ian.

[menial 1]

I think the bullets are available here for loading Ian. Bottom end powder loads with 405gr bullets will knock anything in the UK off it's feet, I don't intend intend to go the macho loads route, I'm getting older not younger.

Pete.

[njc110381]

That's an unusual choice of rifle Pete, but I like it! The trajectory is similar to a lobbed brick but at closer ranges it's supposed to be a brilliant woodland calibre. Think of all those small twigs that we can overlook through the scope and they knock our shots off (not regular but it happens), it's going to take a bloody big twig to get in the way of that!

 

There's no need to hot it up. Even at base loads it will knock the s*** out of anything you're likely to come across in the UK! I kind of admire your choice for being something a little different. Please let us know how you get on with it.

[Chris-NZ]

So, are there any military target shooters that use irons here? How good are you?

 

 

I'm no longer but my American mate is. Never fails to impress me how his bog standard 03A3 Springfield can shoot.

Here's a relatively recent 10-shot 100yd group from a Mil BR event.

 

 

He's done 10-shot groups of 1.3" and it's nothing to reel off 1.5" ones. Been there while he's done it

 

Chris-NZ

[Andrew]

Most of my stalking rifles have iron sights, as do all of my non-sniper military rifles and I used them.

 

Hey!! What's this "bog standard" 03A3 stuff??? The 1903 (and 03-A3) are some fine, accurate rifles. They are a thing of beauty! The best in hijacked German engineering!

 

 

This is five shots prone on a 100 yard small bore target using cast bullets and my bog standard 03A3. I had a 10 shot group from the same outing that scored 100-6X but I'll be hung if I can find it! ~Andrew

[njc110381]

My confidence in iron sights is really beginning to improve! Both here and on another forum I've had some really positive replies regarding the use of irons. I was expecting to be told that no quarry should be shot without a scope because the accuracy isn't there, but it seems some of you can get a grouping similar to that of a sporting rifle with a scope shooting factory ammo! I'm really impressed with the ability of some of you chaps!

[menial 1]

That's an unusual choice of rifle Pete, but I like it! The trajectory is similar to a lobbed brick but at closer ranges it's supposed to be a brilliant woodland calibre. Think of all those small twigs that we can overlook through the scope and they knock our shots off (not regular but it happens), it's going to take a bloody big twig to get in the way of that!

 

There's no need to hot it up. Even at base loads it will knock the s*** out of anything you're likely to come across in the UK! I kind of admire your choice for being something a little different. Please let us know how you get on with it.

 

Tried 20rnds, 405gr bullet with 47grns Viht 133 to test function as it's a new rifle. Everything working fine with rifle, shoulder showing good bruise, rifle weight is 7lbs and let's you know you've shot them.

Tempted to think about a muzzle brake and maybe a ghost ring for the rear sight, could also be time to try some form of reflex, I don't expect to be taking much on past 100yds.

Pete.

[Andrew]

My son has the 45-70, 1895 Cowboy with the 26" octagon barrel. He loves it. His load of choice is built around a Lyman 330 grain HP cast bullet. He shoots it well and hopefully, he'll use it for deer next year.

 

Oh. A Lyman receiver sight will work really well should you lean that way... ~Andrew

[menial 1]

My son has the 45-70, 1895 Cowboy with the 26" octagon barrel. He loves it. His load of choice is built around a Lyman 330 grain HP cast bullet. He shoots it well and hopefully, he'll use it for deer next year.

 

Oh. A Lyman receiver sight will work really well should you lean that way... ~Andrew

 

I'd like to stay with open sights Andrew, maybe some Warne type mounts to allow quick release scope mounting would be handy.

The Lyman receiver sight fits onto Weaver style mounts or is it screwed straight on top of the receiver. Excuse my ignorance, it's my first lever gun.

Pete.

[menial 1]

Had a look on the Lyman site and the receiver sight looks the way forward. Unable to locate in the UK, Stateside seems reluctant to ship to the UK.

The model I'm looking for is the Lyman 66 receiver peep sight, 66LA, any help locating one of these would be appreciated thank you.

Also require Weaver bases or picattiny rail to suit Marlin 1895.

Pete

[Andrew]

Lyman receiver sights are the way to fly.(Williams are a bit cheaper and just as good in my opinion.) I can pick up and send you a mount and sight if you wish. I can't see why they would balk but I doubt if Uncle Sam would care if I sent them your way.~Andrew

 

PS: Just took a look a Midway UK. They are in stock.

 

http://www.midwayuk.com/apps/eproductpage....leItemID=116045

 

http://www.midwayuk.com/apps/eproductpage....leItemID=189486

[menial 1]

Cheers Andrew, I'll have a go at ordering with Midway UK, if I have no success, I'll take you up on your kind offer.

Will the peep sight function okay when used in conjunction with the standard foresight?

I'm going to buy a Marlin in .44 as well, so anything I learn now will stand me in good stead when that arrives.

Thanks again.

Pete.

[njc110381]

Marlin .44? Add another 4 to that one, now that is a nice calibre

 

Having said that it would be a little too close to the .45-70 to justify really. What do you plan to do with the .44? Is that conditioned for Deer or other game or purely a target gun? I've heard the .44 works a treat on Foxes.

[menial 1]

The .44 is for target and playtime, I already have 4 rifles conditioned for fox. Killing paper and inanimate objects is pretty good fun with a cheap to load round. Will also improve my offhand performance when I need it whilst stalking.

Pete.

[Andrew]

As to the fore sight question: I'd like to say I'm 99.9% certain it will work fine but there is always the case where a slightly higher front sight is necessary. Usually with a 45-70 it is OK.

 

As to the .444 Marlin. I like that cartridge and have built several accurate single shots in it using a 1-18" twist for heavy bullets. They were good rifles... accurate enough so that folks offered me too much money to afford keeping them for myself! A 240 grain would make a heck of a small game round.

 

On that thought... a very good small game load for the 45-70 is made by taking a lightly sized 45-70 casing, flaring the neck a bit, and thumbing in a .457" round ball used for muzzleloaders. I used Unique powder (10 grains) and put a small rime of bullet lube into the small area tangent to the ball left by the flaring. It shoots a ragged hole at 25 yards from my Mauser 45-70. Just an FYI. ~Andrew

[menial 1]

As to the fore sight question: I'd like to say I'm 99.9% certain it will work fine but there is always the case where a slightly higher front sight is necessary. Usually with a 45-70 it is OK.

 

As to the .444 Marlin. I like that cartridge and have built several accurate single shots in it using a 1-18" twist for heavy bullets. They were good rifles... accurate enough so that folks offered me too much money to afford keeping them for myself! A 240 grain would make a heck of a small game round.

 

On that thought... a very good small game load for the 45-70 is made by taking a lightly sized 45-70 casing, flaring the neck a bit, and thumbing in a .457" round ball used for muzzleloaders. I used Unique powder (10 grains) and put a small rime of bullet lube into the small area tangent to the ball left by the flaring. It shoots a ragged hole at 25 yards from my Mauser 45-70. Just an FYI. ~Andrew

 

Cheers Andrew, the .44 will also be a Marlin, so if I can get a 336 stainless then the Lyman peep sight should retro fit from the 1895.

Is Unique a useful powder for .44, my mate has an unopened tub sat on his shelf and asked me did I want it?

Regards Pete.