jeffo223 Posted June 28, 2014 Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 I've got a 223 sako 1-8 twist with varmint barrel at the moment but I hardly use it for any long range work so the 75gr bulletsare wasted on short range stuff. Thinking of trading it in for a 17 hornet cz. I've seen the cz shoot out to nearly 400yards on steel on fairly still day as I know wind would be a issue, so I think it may suit my needs for shooting but I am not sure? What should I do? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6.5shooter Posted June 28, 2014 Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 Keep the 223! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gaz6br Posted June 28, 2014 Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 17 rem if I was having one, and I might end up doing with a drone pro on top Gaz Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffo223 Posted June 28, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 17rem a bit of a barrel burner I was told, can't really afford to keep paying out for new barrels. I like the idea of the hornet because of the flat shooting to 250 yards ish. I have tried light bullets in my 223 but due to the twist of the barrel they don't group well at all. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pork chop Posted June 28, 2014 Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 have both Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffo223 Posted June 28, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 Love to but would struggle with costs. Thats why I am struggling to decide. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
triple2 Posted June 28, 2014 Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 Had a savage Hornet, traded it in for a .204. Keep the 223 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
visiter1 Posted June 28, 2014 Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 i have a a 17 hornet built on a cz action and its great for crows and for foxes but its no 223 shot placement is key , if u have any questions you think i can help with feel free to mail me , Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pork chop Posted June 28, 2014 Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 Love to but would struggle with costs. Thats why I am struggling to decide. i'd keep the 223 then.i like the sound of the 17 but the 223 is more versatile Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gunner Posted June 28, 2014 Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 223 , you probably know but there are many bullets in between 50-75 grain bullets. There are 55 60 63 69 70 etc its a no brainer . Atb tim Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffo223 Posted June 28, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 Most 223 are versatile but the twist rate of mine struggles with lighy bullets Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alycidon Posted June 28, 2014 Report Share Posted June 28, 2014 The 17 Hornet centerfire with 20 gr bullets is not on my book a fox round, loads 25s and it may be. Great crow round though. Shoot foxes on a regular basis then keep the 223, if foxes are only now and again then maybe the 17 HH but makes sure you always have some 25s to hand in case. A Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gbal Posted June 29, 2014 Report Share Posted June 29, 2014 OK each cartridge has its pros and cons. 17 Hornet is remarkable efficient with Superformance factory loadings,pretty much 223 trajectory to 300+( ie drop around 20 inches with 200 zero-beyond that energy is getting too low for fox-only 100ft lb at 300-but can you get this powder....if not,the 17 H won't be a cheap cartridge to buy loaded).I didn't fully understand the '75g 223 bullets are wasted'....they don't cost much more than lighter ones-granted at 200y you don't need them,but way better slightly overgunned than undergunned!) MY Sako75 varminter does shoot 55s into .3,but all rifles can be bullet fussy-have you tried a few good lighter bullets-or just one make? The 17 Hornet will be considerably more wind sensitive,but still is a viable 250y small varmint cartridge on low wind days-Hornady noticeably didn't publicise it's drift and energy performance-it's no 223 on those criteria,but if you can live with the limitations,OK. As others have said,the 223 is way more versatile,but if the 17 H fits your needs,it is a delight to shoot,if there is no wind and ranges are relatively short.(the 223 of course drifts too,and the 75s are not hugely better than lighter bullets,say 8" at 300,and that is getting near the limit of accurate enough wind judging abilities for small varmints. Almost any cartridge can be 'walked in' to hit 400y gongs.You get one shot at a magpie. I'd take a bit of prising away from an accurate Sako,but then I have a 17rem too..... Gbal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony.H Posted June 29, 2014 Report Share Posted June 29, 2014 its a shame your .223 does not like the 40s, not sure why it would not even, in an 1:8 twist... f you load your own rounds then you have other choices but if only factory ammo then this narrows the field. i sold my .223 and had a choice of 17rem and 20tac, i asked on here which would be best, i wanted it for fox, 20 tac only just came though with more say the 20tac over the 17rem and personnally if fox is your quary, then 17rem i would say is a minumum imo, i only shoot fox at what i call sensible ranges, 200 or less, ive not had call for any more than that. but if you could push the 40s in your .223 then stck with that, if not 17rem or one of the 20s imo tony Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gbal Posted June 29, 2014 Report Share Posted June 29, 2014 its a shame your .223 does not like the 40s, not sure why it would not even, in an 1:8 twist...f you load your own rounds then you have other choices but if only factory ammo then this narrows the field. i sold my .223 and had a choice of 17rem and 20tac, i asked on here which would be best, i wanted it for fox, 20 tac only just came though with more say the 20tac over the 17rem and personnally if fox is your quary, then 17rem i would say is a minumum imo, i only shoot fox at what i call sensible ranges, 200 or less, ive not had call for any more than that.but if you could push the 40s in your .223 then stck with that, if not 17rem or one of the 20s imotony Hmmmm..... there is a pretty fair choice of commercial loadings for 223-over 90 in the us,not all available over here,but then we have the european ones too....especially in the mid range 55-69 g. 40g may be just outside your rifle's comfort zone-but what advantage does 40g-let alone less- have for fox/anything especially under 250yards? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony.H Posted June 29, 2014 Report Share Posted June 29, 2014 Hmmmm..... there is a pretty fair choice of commercial loadings for 223-over 90 in the us,not all available over here,but then we have the european ones too....especially in the mid range 55-69 g. 40g may be just outside your rifle's comfort zone-but what advantage does 40g-let alone less- have for fox/anything especially under 250yards?i was thnking that with the op saying he a wanted fast and flat and the 40gr in the .223 would be ideal for the 250yards, as he was looking at the 17hornet as an option, which idmit, i know nothing about, but i did plenty of researh of the 20s and 17rem for a simlar reason Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeffo223 Posted June 29, 2014 Author Report Share Posted June 29, 2014 Spot on tony! That's why thought of a 17 hornet, fast and flat ideal for my needs to say 250 yards. Gbal what bullets do you recommend? Tried 55 vmax & amax grouped like a shotgun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony.H Posted June 29, 2014 Report Share Posted June 29, 2014 Spot on tony! That's why thought of a 17 hornet, fast and flat ideal for my needs to say 250 yards. Gbal what bullets do you recommend? Tried 55 vmax & amax grouped like a shotgun. so you have tried the 40s in your .223, just because its a fast twist, that does not mean it will not shoot them, if you sell you .223 and decide on another for fox and vermin then as i said before 17rem or a 20cal, .204 s a factory offering atb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gbal Posted June 29, 2014 Report Share Posted June 29, 2014 Spot on tony! That's why thought of a 17 hornet, fast and flat ideal for my needs to say 250 yards. Gbal what bullets do you recommend? Tried 55 vmax & amax grouped like a shotgun. Fast and flat-well,fine,but the cartridges won't differ much...to 250/300y: !7 rem 1'' 0 4.4 204 .6 0 4.1 223 1 0 5.5 these are drop figures at 100 200 300 yards-the 223 can be varied a little by heavier bullets...eg.69g 1.5 0 7.5. NO effective difference in drop within 250y. (a very fast 243 is 1.5 0 4.3) - so no joy there .You just don't get any flatter,except with real hot numbers.....and even then not a lot.....inch maybe at 250y.... Bullets to try-if you must-why not the heavies that shoot well-Berger,lapua-maybe no 40 g will shoot in your rifle -but so what-it's not a great 224 bullet weight anyhow...try 55-69 g...a 1 in 8 isn't ideally designed for light bullets,but they have no advantage at all within 250 yards....feed it appropriately-what's to lose? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
sako Posted July 12, 2014 Report Share Posted July 12, 2014 Keep 223 ,and get a cheap second hand .222. The 222 is not so fashionable,I picked up a mint cz 222 £350 threaded. Cheap factory ammo, cheap to reload,very accurate. 17 hornet is a 20g cartridge.With experience of .17 centerfire, (fireball), it required a 25g bullet to kill fox 150y. Please........dont tell to many people about .222 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony.H Posted July 12, 2014 Report Share Posted July 12, 2014 Keep 223 ,and get a cheap second hand .222. The 222 is not so fashionable,I picked up a mint cz 222 £350 threaded. Cheap factory ammo, cheap to reload,very accurate. 17 hornet is a 20g cartridge.With experience of .17 centerfire, (fireball), it required a 25g bullet to kill fox 150y. Please........dont tell to many people about .222 he wants fast and flat, where would a .222 come into that? unless you neck the case down to a .17cal that would work. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gbal Posted July 12, 2014 Report Share Posted July 12, 2014 he wants fast and flat, where would a .222 come into that? unless you neck the case down to a .17cal that would work. It would come in about here: drop/drift/energy at 200 300 400y in inches,ft lb: commercial loadings for comparison: 17 rem 25g@ 4040 0/5/405 5/12/325 16/23/321 222 rem 40@ 3000 0/5/603 6/12/424 20/25/289 Pretty close,no? Of course the 17/222-once a wildcat- would be a bit less than the 17rem (necked down 222mag/223) Seems the 222 gives nothing away ballistically,and has a real energy advantage. Having used both quite extensively,that is exactly how it works out-love them both-as 250yd cartridges.Both excellent for small varmint,the 222 has an accuracy edge and fox advantage(and small deer). The 22/250 just to compare runs: 40vmax@4150 0/4.4/816 4.5/10.6/585 14.3/20.4/410........more energy,but not much 'flatter' up to 350y,and: 204 ruger40vmax@3900 0/3.3/855 4.3/7.8/674 13.2/14.7/526 You are buying energy,not much more 'flat' out to realistic fox ranges (250y).And pretty much the same deal with 243 55@3910-yet more energy,pretty much the same drop/drift,with a lot more powder and recoil. Gbal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
247sniper Posted July 12, 2014 Report Share Posted July 12, 2014 It would come in about here: drop/drift/energy at 200 300 400y in inches,ft lb: commercial loadings for comparison: 17 rem 25g@ 4040 0/5/405 5/12/325 16/23/321 222 rem 40@ 3000 0/5/603 6/12/424 20/25/289 Pretty close,no? Of course the 17/222-once a wildcat- would be a bit less than the 17rem (necked down 222mag/223) Seems the 222 gives nothing away ballistically,and has a real energy advantage. Having used both quite extensively,that is exactly how it works out-love them both-as 250yd cartridges.Both excellent for small varmint,the 222 has an accuracy edge and fox advantage(and small deer). The 22/250 just to compare runs: 40vmax@4150 0/4.4/816 4.5/10.6/585 14.3/20.4/410........more energy,but not much 'flatter' up to 350y,and: 204 ruger40vmax@3900 0/3.3/855 4.3/7.8/674 13.2/14.7/526 You are buying energy,not much more 'flat' out to realistic fox ranges (250y).And pretty much the same deal with 243 55@3910-yet more energy,pretty much the same drop/drift,with a lot more powder and recoil. Gbal .222 Rem 40 grain Vmax @ 3000ftps at 300 yards with a 200 yard zero = 10.1 inch drop and in a 10 mph full value wind = 16.6 inch. .17 Rem 25 grain VMax @ 4040 ftps at 300 yards with a 200 yard zero = 4.4 inch drop and in a 10 mph full value wind = 9.3 inch The.17 Rem slaughters the .222in terms of drop and drift out to 300 and more. I think 3000ftps is a bit low for the 222 to be fair, but even if a more realistic 3500ftps was used the results are... drop = 6.9 inch and drift is = 13.2 inch. In terms of drop and drift the .17 Rem still slaughters the .222. Steve Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony.H Posted July 12, 2014 Report Share Posted July 12, 2014 .222 Rem 40 grain Vmax @ 3000ftps at 300 yards with a 200 yard zero = 10.1 inch drop and in a 10 mph full value wind = 16.6 inch. .17 Rem 25 grain VMax @ 4040 ftps at 300 yards with a 200 yard zero = 4.4 inch drop and in a 10 mph full value wind = 9.3 inch The.17 Rem slaughters the .222in terms of drop and drift out to 300 and more. I think 3000ftps is a bit low for the 222 to be fair, but even if a more realistic 3500ftps was used the results are... drop = 6.9 inch and drift is = 13.2 inch. In terms of drop and drift the .17 Rem still slaughters the .222. Steve now that steve i can understand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
247sniper Posted July 12, 2014 Report Share Posted July 12, 2014 now that steve i can understand. thanks m 8 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
.jpg.0972b4e2bdf0b5a4109eb96f2b1b62ad.jpg)
(200x135).jpg.0fd0a94f065c6cb243fdff1b40e0819a.jpg)
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.