Foxes are getting smarter

[sonic]

Robert Bucknell writes in sporting rifle about smarter foxes it make interesting reading. I think he could have a point.

 

I have one patch that is over 600 acres over 4 adjoining farms they lie in a rough triangle twice the size with a village at the point a town on each long sides and a road across the bottom. there is a good mix of ground that holds plenty of food for foxes. First few years I used to see plenty of foxes and it was reasonably easy to keep numbers down. While there always seemed to be foxes moving in to replace those shot.

 

Now it seems habits have changed driving round its rare to get a flash of eyes let alone one standing still. Walking round gets better results but they foxes seen still seem to be lamp shy.

To cap it all I put out my trail cam over a bait point, four lots of photos seemed promising so took my mate (He's after his first fox) park up at the back of the farmhouse. get set up to walk round. look over to where the bait is with the lamp and get eye shine, that's the last we see off anything.

 

I've no misses to explain a lamp shy fox. headlights flash over a lot of the fields so I tend to flash the lamp across the same way.it may be a near miss by a car.

 

Or is it a Robert suggests we have shot the easy ones leaving the smarter ones to breed, once upon a time a car spot for a lamp and shotgun was enough now we're on with NV scopes and thermal spotters.

 

What do you think.

[gaz6br]

Yep I no what you mean when I was 15 me and a mate used shotgun and lamp and we used to do ok, I can remember watching 2 or 3 coming to the call at once. I think the main problem now there's to many out there giving it a go that haven't got a clue.

 

I had a lad the other day ask if I could drop him some dead foxes off when I asked why he said I shoot a farm but keep missing the foxes and the farmer wants to see the dead ones

 

Me and 2 mates do ok, we are lucky to have over 12000 acres plus, last 3 years we have managed to break 200 foxes a year but its had work out twice a week and alot of hours plus the sitting out.

[5R-Twist]

We are in the same boat one bit of down land I shoot is about 1800 acres and a weekly visit would always net at least 5 a trip.

We now try and get them when there young as there more stupid which in turn may have a knock on effect.

Someone said to me that with the last hard winters there is a fall in the mouse population which could account for there not being so many on this ground.

But it wont explain the lamp shy, we changed the lamp filter to another colour it made a difference on the first trip only.

Night vision works ok until we cut loose on the first one, which also may say the noise has an effect.

We also tried walking the ground but found we were no better off and we could not cover the ground in time.

One thing we have noticed is there is more ambient light now and also more traffic at night.

Sorry not really answered the question but would like to know the answer.

Perhaps we underestimate how clever our wildlife is.

We have tried lots of different squeakers but that wont work like it used to.

One that I shot on Friday night had a sandwich in its mouth and he was in the middle of a 80 acre field on his way home ,luckily he stoped for a brief second , so perhaps there not hungry as the house holders feed them.

V

[Gandy]

I think the main problem now there's to many out there giving it a go that haven't got a clue.

+1

[gbal]

+1

and more vulpes darwinious that do!

[garyw]

lamp shy foxes are a product of-dog men after deer and fox -numptys with a .22 bunny bashing and get a fox in the lamp giddy kipperitus sets in -missing them under the lamp when cubs- lamping the cubs and the vixen/dog yells out the distress bark so they know a lamp means danger.

i dont think they have got smarter -they have always been smart its how they survive its just the nut behind the trigger that is the key factor.we can educate them far quicker than they can educate themselves.

to my mind to reduce the numbers we need to know what we are doing and im afraid there are a lot of so called fox men that dont have a clue.i was taught over a few years about fox behaviour and the ways to control them by a well known terrier man who is still active today in my part of the world even though his health has been not good lately,and i use his expertise to my advantage.i dont always get it right thats why i have invested in nv and have another terrier man i can call on when needed.i know when to hold my hands up an admit mr. fox has me beat but he will be stopped.

[foxing2night]

plus one on that,

Put a lamp out with a dog behind it , these people will soon nack up your shooting!!!

and a lot of them have no regard for permission or not they just think that they can go any were

 

Darrel

[simon6ppc]

ye its more to me other folk who have shot it or dog boys who lamp it,where i live some years i can get 20 on one farm then the next year only 3,its a funny game foxing,at the moment not many shoot around where i go so if i do my job right i can get them the first night i see them,just when i think ime an expert though the next night ime not,and its been like that the last 25 years ive been at it,cheers simon

[abolter]

I have 2 lines of thought on this. The first observation I have found in response to longdog men, of which we have far to many, is that the foxes often only run toa hedge or similar and then stop. I was able to gather quite a few on a newly acquired piece of ground by walking into about 150m when they had gone through a hedge.

 

The second is that i do not believe what we are getting is more intelligent foxes it is more timid ones. I believe that some foxes are very timid/people shy naturally and these ones are ones we run into quite rarely. Naturally they are more likely to survive. They are also more likely to only afford us 1 cock up before they avoid people/lamps/NV. I have noticed that spaniels have become more and more timid over recent years which to me proves it is a trait which can be reinforced quite quickly.

 

I believe this "selection" towards temerity is accellerated by the number of muppets out lamping just now.

 

Just my twopenneth

[happyhunter]

Think it's worse this year as the weather has been kinder to us all so more numpties head out for a ratch be it with rifle or dogs on land they certainaly have no permission. The last spot we were at last night produced as its well off the beaten track, anywhere else they can lamp from the road it's becomming almost pointless unless nv is in use. Now nv has its uses but you carn't beat calling a fox in under the lamp and sending it the good news with a v-max

[garyw]

some very good points here i also believe foxes become vehicle shy the sound an engine makes or a squeek and rattle all link the fox to danger.

if it were too easy it wouldnt be half as much fun would it?

[sonic]

I've not had trouble with dog men at all since lambing time when a Saluki was lost/left on the golf couse next door. I got called after the farmer lost some soay lambs. But that aside the Hares end up lamp shy very quickly if there's poachers about.

Maybe its the timid ones rather than smarter foxes.

But it does make sense that selective breeding could give smarter or more wary foxes in the same way dogs livestock etc are bred for the traits we want.

There is the fact that some foxes will be educated that Lamp means danger but it doesn't explain all of them.

[achosenman]

I too have seen more lamp shy foxes over the last few years than I can ever remember. TBH I don't educate them so put it down to enthusiastic amateur's on neighbouring patches.

 

Switching to thermal and NV showed this is not the entire story. I used to run an L200 that had a slight squeak from the rear leaf springs that I could never totally eradicate. I saw evidence that the foxes knew that this squeak was bad news. They also recognised the engine pitch as distinct from normal farm vehicles. I'm not sure but maybe our individual scent comes into play as well. Foxes are territorial, so we all may well know each other.

 

Nowadays I park up more, down wind, and stay quiet. The foxes seem oblivious for the time being...until they learn that is.

 

ATB

[gaz6br]

When we are lamping in the kobota, 8 wheel Argo cat or discovery we are in complete darkness just have the lamp on, seen some chaps lamping a while back in a Toyota hilux middle of a stubble field all the lights on plus spot lights waving a white lamp across the field it looked like a plane coming in to land

[achosenman]

When we are lamping in the kobota, 8 wheel Argo cat or discovery we are in complete darkness just have the lamp on, seen some chaps lamping a while back in a Toyota hilux middle of a stubble field all the lights on plus spot lights waving a white lamp across the field it looked like a plane coming in to land

Yep I always stay dark, even to the point of gaffer tape over any residual instrument lights.

 

ATB

[greg]

foxes getting cute in the midlands of Ireland where I am they have been lamped so often they are now wearing sunglasses.