7-08 or 7-08AI

[kernel gadaffi]

I'm wondering if anyone is using either of the above calibres for Sika and Reds and what their opinions is, also, what's the best/financial way to convert to AI, buy a 7-08 and work on it or use a donor rifle and get the barrel replaced and worked on?

 

Cheers.

 

Alan.(KG).

[gbal]

Having gone down the Ackley route myself I can say with a certain amount of experience that it is a complete waste of time. Stick with the standard calibre because the additional hassle of fireforming the brass and getting hold of the dies and other reloading bits just isn't worth the hassle.

 

With the .223ai I was getting about 150-200fps extra which didn't kills varmints anymore than my standard .223rem did, but I did get really p#ssed off getting the reloading bits for it.

 

I am pretty certain that the reds won't tell the difference between a 150grain 7mm bullet hitting them at 2650 or 2800fps either. ;)

 

The more I shoot the more I stick with the KISS system of doing things.

 

Keeps

It

Simple

Stupid !!!

Amen to that!150 fps won't be noticeable in terminal performance.The 7-08 is essentially 7x57 ballistics and they didn't need 'improving',and weren't! In adition to avoiding all the hassle of fireforming etc,you can just buy a standard ready to go rifle-it does not need to be a premium make,but f you addd in what you save on not having to buy extra AI bits,a Sako (eg) won't disappoint-you don't need 1/4 min of angle accuracy-and probably won't get it in field conditions with any rifle,but a good factory rifle will put the first shot within an inch at worst of where you want it.That is what matters.

george

[baldie]

Its becoming popular again, this cartridge. Very accurate when built/barrelled right.

 

I always try and talk people out of Ackleys personally, as the extra 150 fps can be approached with modern powders these days, plus you dont have the hassle of custom dies, fireforming, and poor feeding.

 

Dead simple, a donor with a .308/243/22-250 bolt face and a barrel blank, and away you go.

[jordang]

i have a 7-08AI and its great. No problems with feeding, super accurate and the cartridge just looks 'right'. Yes the dies cost a bit more and you need to fireform cases but it shoots normal 7-08 rounds really well so I lose nothing.

[tackb]

whatever calibre your using from 243 up will work , just put it in the right spot. a sika/red will go down faster shot properly with a 243 than it will shot badly with a 460 weatherby !

[jordang]

cant argue with that.

[Andrew]

i have a 7-08AI and its great. No problems with feeding, super accurate and the cartridge just looks 'right'. Yes the dies cost a bit more and you need to fireform cases but it shoots normal 7-08 rounds really well so I lose nothing.

 

I have always advised people to keep away from the Ackley chamberings. I have had some very fine rifles built based on these Improved cartridges but in all cases, I have shown so little gain in velocity that it made it hardly worth while unless it was a cartridge that was under-bore capacity to begin with. (30-30 IMP is a fine cartridge and a jump ahead of the standard version) I have only one "Improved" rifle left in my safe: a 30-06 IMP target rifle that gives very little extra velocity at max loads. About 85 fps with the heavier bullets. Ackley himself cautioned against "improving" high intensity cartridges as, in the end, the gains wouldn't be significant enough to warrant the expense.

 

It is simple to rationalize:

[Andrew]

i have a 7-08AI and its great. No problems with feeding, super accurate and the cartridge just looks 'right'. Yes the dies cost a bit more and you need to fireform cases but it shoots normal 7-08 rounds really well so I lose nothing.

 

I have always advised people to keep away from the Ackley chamberings. I have had some very fine rifles built based on these Improved cartridges but in all cases, I have shown so little gain in velocity that it made it hardly worth while unless it was a cartridge that was under-bore capacity to begin with. (30-30 IMP is a fine cartridge and a jump ahead of the standard version)

 

It is simple to rationalize: If (without changing powder, bullet, or barrel length) you take a cartridge operating at 60K max pressure for "X" velocity, and you increase the case capacity of this cartridge and load it back up to the same pressure, you will still be very close to "X" velocity again. Some studies have shown that, generally speaking, velocity increases at 1/4 the increase in case capacity. A 10% increase in case capacity = a 2.5% increase in velocity.

 

I have only one "Improved" rifle left in my safe: a 30-06 IMP target rifle that gives very little extra velocity at max loads. About 85 fps with the heavier bullets. If the rifle wasn't a collectible gun I'd have gotten rid of it years ago.~Andrew

 

EDIT: I don't know how the first of these two posts got posted before editing! Not enough coffee, Sorry.

[flytie]

Having read, and re-read, P O Ackley's books I am always puzzled why people think he was on a quest for the ultimate speed, and only that, from a given case. My reading of the books is that he was really after extending case life, as well as making extraction of the case easier and increasing the efficiency of the burn of the powder.

 

He has been misinterpreted badley over the years and taken out of context.

 

I still fancy an ackleyised rifle.

 

FT.

[gbal]

Having read, and re-read, P O Ackley's books I am always puzzled why people think he was on a quest for the ultimate speed, and only that, from a given case. My reading of the books is that he was really after extending case life, as well as making extraction of the case easier and increasing the efficiency of the burn of the powder.

 

He has been misinterpreted badley over the years and taken out of context.

 

I still fancy an ackleyised rifle.

 

FT.

Your choice-the 7-08 is a short action 7x57 ballistically,and even PO didn't think the great 7x57 needed any 'improvement',and he was right especially for UK deer-better just use a heavier bullet if your hard to please.

You have a point about his motivations re brass etc-but things have improved since his day-I doubt that he'd be thinking much about 'Lapua Improved ' brass,and the short- fat approach has some merit too-(cf 7-08)-so there are other options.If you must have,why not-but the question 'Why?' is a good one too! If you just want (why?) a little more velocity,then these days some other standard case will probably be available-there were a lot less to choose from in PO's day,so he made some-the notion that a wildcat is superior is just naive-domesticats (factory) get there because they have the advantages,but not the disadvantages.

george

[kent]

I used a 7-08 rem for a number of years with 140 grn Gamekings , it was very terminal on all deer but sometimes too much energy for Roe. A good choice for Sika and never struggled with much meat damage