CliveWard Posted March 16, 2011 Report Share Posted March 16, 2011 Hi Guys, After talking to one of the members on here earlier this topic of conversation came up so I thought I would post a couple of photos on our forum here: http://www.nightvisionforum.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=147 Been too busy to play with it yet. Cheers Clive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elwood Posted March 17, 2011 Report Share Posted March 17, 2011 Hi Guys, After talking to one of the members on here earlier this topic of conversation came up so I thought I would post a couple of photos on our forum here: http://www.nightvisionforum.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=147 Been too busy to play with it yet. Cheers Clive Looks good Clive, but how about some detailed specifications, you know all that lpm/noise ratio stuff that no one understands Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CliveWard Posted March 18, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 18, 2011 Looks good Clive, but how about some detailed specifications, you know all that lpm/noise ratio stuff that no one understands Hi Ian, Right...lol. Tube in this one is our XG spec which is a multi-alkali 65-70 lp/mm, 625-750 photo response, 26-28 snr. Also available in GaAs if you do your varminting in a cave All aluminium housing. No plastic Schott glass in all the optics. 6x magnification, F1.5 objective lens with internal focusing. Adjustable eyepiece +/- 4 diopters. The reticle is glass etched fine cross hair with stadia hatches. Can be either black on green but also have completely variable amber illumination. 1.2cm at 100m clicks. Runs off a single CR123 battery, 60 hour run time. Mount for variable power LED IR illuminator (supplied). Mount redesigned and strengthened so there is no possibility of mis alignment after a heavy impact. Weight is around 1300g from memory and it's smaller than a D760 or MARS Cheers Clive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garyw Posted March 18, 2011 Report Share Posted March 18, 2011 clive-how much for this unit and what mounting system does it come with? thanks. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CliveWard Posted March 22, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 22, 2011 clive-how much for this unit and what mounting system does it come with? thanks. Hi Gary, It's a picatinny mount interface as standard. Price for the XG is going to be £3500 inc. VAT. Cheers Clive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrelsniffer Posted March 22, 2011 Report Share Posted March 22, 2011 Hi Gary, It's a picatinny mount interface as standard. Price for the XG is going to be £3500 inc. VAT. Cheers Clive Clive do you think there will ever be a price drop on NV scope in the UK as we all know they are overly expensive for what they are.? ie some sell for 5000/7000 Mick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CliveWard Posted March 22, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 22, 2011 Clive do you think there will ever be a price drop on NV scope in the UK as we all know they are overly expensive for what they are.? ie some sell for 5000/7000 Mick Hi Mick, As you know the heart of the system is the intensifier tube, which is a military technology with associated pricing (assuming the manufacturer is using mil-spec tubes) All the time the tube factories can sell everything they can produce at these high prices, things aren't going to change. On a 6x scope like this another big cost is the glass. Big fast lenses are expensive. Then finally the housing and associated lens mounts, focusing mechanics and reticle adjustments are precision components, again with associated costs. None of our products are 'mass produced' and generally we sell all we can produce, with orders going onto scheduled manufacture at busy times of the year. Personally I know for the quality of the scope and where it sits in the market there's nothing to touch it, it's seriously good value. Especially when you consider a more mass produced 'plastic' scope retails for almost twice the price! We've always strived for the top end of the market and tried to make the very best quality possible, continually pushing our suppliers on performance with price being secondary, as that's what I'm interested in. Having said that we've noticed that the price chasm between Gen1 and Gen2 and better has been widening, only to be filled with that awful digital tat or junk with 30 year old mil surp tubes. So to address this we've got another new scope due out in a couple of weeks. This will be 4x mag with a SG 55-60 lp/mm tube with an introductory price of around £1700 Inc. VAT. Cheers Clive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barrelsniffer Posted March 22, 2011 Report Share Posted March 22, 2011 Thanks clive..Just such a huge price diff between US and Europe..even the japanese "Gen 3" tubes that thomas jacks are using in some of there units are 5000+ Mick Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eldon Posted March 23, 2011 Report Share Posted March 23, 2011 Clive, With this new unit out soon (£1700 ish) what sort of performance specifications do you expect, you know distance to recognise a fox or similar etc? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CliveWard Posted March 23, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 23, 2011 Thanks clive..Just such a huge price diff between US and Europe..even the japanese "Gen 3" tubes that thomas jacks are using in some of there units are 5000+ Mick Hi Mick, The sad fact is that even after you've got your hands on your wages after the govt. have robbed you of up to half of it in income tax, employers and employees stamp...when you spend what's left the poor bugger receiving it then has to give again up to 50% back to the government in VAT, corporation tax and subsequent income tax, employers and employees stamp, and so the circle goes on... It's very expensive to run a legitimate business in the UK We try to keep prices sane by dealing direct with the end user and keeping trade discounts to a sensible level, especially considering the value of the individual items. The US isn't taxed as heavily as the UK, so things are cheaper. But even if it were legal once it came into the UK with carriage, duty and VAT a D760 would be £3000 and a raptor near £5000 I imagine Japan is similarly tax heavy, hence the higher price of their tubes. Cheers Clive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CliveWard Posted March 23, 2011 Author Report Share Posted March 23, 2011 Clive, With this new unit out soon (£1700 ish) what sort of performance specifications do you expect, you know distance to recognise a fox or similar etc? Hi Eldon, From experience with a similar housing with a similar spec tube, max range on a fox would be 250 yards and 150 yards for a rabbit for reliable recognition. You'll pick up eye shine from the reflected IR much further but ID will be difficult due to the lower mag. Should be ideal for a bit of budget bunny busting on a .22RF/.17 or fox control on a centre fire. It just wont be able to do the ever so satisfying long range bunny varminting on a centre fire that you can with a 6x All joking aside 4x is a really nice magnification on an NV scope with a 'decent' tube. You get a much wider field of view, better depth of field and smaller, lighter scope. I'm looking forward to having a play when they arrive, as are a few others now. Cheers Clive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
243ack Posted March 23, 2011 Report Share Posted March 23, 2011 'that awful digital tat' Have to take exception to that globalisation Clive. I find my N550+doubler+your laser far superior to the maxikite it replaced in ALL departments. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CliveWard Posted April 9, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 9, 2011 'that awful digital tat' Have to take exception to that globalisation Clive. I find my N550+doubler+your laser far superior to the maxikite it replaced in ALL departments. Hi 243ack, Each to their own. In my testing the image was fine, especially with our N1000AP laser. Useable detail was good out to 250+ yards. The tat part is as follows: Due to the size of the sensor / lenses there are very different focus points for the different wavelengths of light (ambient / on board IR / additional IR). There was considerable POI shift on the focus mechanism. Stupidly short run time compared to a tubed system. Very poor ergonomics with the scope sitting very far from the bore line. This could have been easily fixed by offestting the eyepiece as it's not a direct image transfer. But the biggest problem is that all digital systems have an inherrant delay between input and output. The fanboys scoff at this because they don't appreciate or understand the problem. I'm not talking about framerate issues! There is a delay between what goes into the objective and what comes out of the eyepiece. So you are always pulling the trigger on something that happened in the past. If you are using anything other than a perfect front and rear rest, accuracy will suffer, and so will your intended target! A good analogy is having a rifle that has a dodgy trigger that always goes off too soon. Could you be an accurate shot with that? Following on from this, I've had a lot of reports from users that they have experienced headaches and dizzyness after using the N550. The problem is that your brain notices the delay between movement and what is seen even if you are not concious of it. Cheers Clive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
243ack Posted April 9, 2011 Report Share Posted April 9, 2011 Hi 243ack, Each to their own. In my testing the image was fine, especially with our N1000AP laser. Useable detail was good out to 250+ yards. The tat part is as follows: Due to the size of the sensor / lenses there are very different focus points for the different wavelengths of light (ambient / on board IR / additional IR). There was considerable POI shift on the focus mechanism. Stupidly short run time compared to a tubed system. Very poor ergonomics with the scope sitting very far from the bore line. This could have been easily fixed by offestting the eyepiece as it's not a direct image transfer. But the biggest problem is that all digital systems have an inherrant delay between input and output. The fanboys scoff at this because they don't appreciate or understand the problem. I'm not talking about framerate issues! There is a delay between what goes into the objective and what comes out of the eyepiece. So you are always pulling the trigger on something that happened in the past. If you are using anything other than a perfect front and rear rest, accuracy will suffer, and so will your intended target! A good analogy is having a rifle that has a dodgy trigger that always goes off too soon. Could you be an accurate shot with that? Following on from this, I've had a lot of reports from users that they have experienced headaches and dizzyness after using the N550. The problem is that your brain notices the delay between movement and what is seen even if you are not concious of it. Cheers Clive Hi Clive You really think the N550 sits higher than a maxikite????. I have detected no move in poi with focus change - principally because with the Sony doubler, adjusting focus is almost redundant. Image to target timelag: this can be no more than milliseconds, can it?. I have purposefully looked for it and cannot discern any lag whatsoever. Eye strain: yes, I can go for this - but after spotting with other devices; how long do you need to be looking down the 550?. Battery life: rechargeables, as supplied, last me an evenings outing without issue, so why worry if your £4k device lasts 3 eons on one AAA?. My Maxikite owed me over £4k. My complete digi setup owes me less than £1500 - and in my humble opinion is much more user friendly, (and accounts for all the foxes I ask it to). But. as you say: each to his own. Thomas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
CliveWard Posted April 9, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 9, 2011 Hi Thomas, The Kite and Maxi variant are old 'military' designs, and as you found are completely unsuitable for a sporting rifle. Great optics, but they sit stupidly high off the bore, had some POI shift problems in the focus mechanism, 1" - 2" clicks depending on model and the maxi is an enormous scope! They needed the huge optics to get the most of the tubes available at the time. Now thankfully things have moved on somewhat The lag on the N550 is there trust me. You can just about notice when you move the scope, the image lags ever so slightly behind. The best test is to shoot a group with a less than perfect rest, i.e. off sticks where there is some movement and you need to be able to pull the trigger at that moment when the cross hairs move onto the target. I was refering to the mount height on the N550 because it is unecessarily high by a good margin, all Yukon / Pulsar scopes are like this for some reason. They seem to want to house bulky items like power supplies, etc. under the optical path raising the height of the scope and then stick it all on a high mount system. The point I'm making is that while the N550 maybe more ergonomic and better value than the vasty overpriced 2nd hand Kites; there are now proper 'tubed' scopes on the market that are considerably better than the N550 for not a great deal more money. Cheers Clive Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bri2506 Posted April 11, 2011 Report Share Posted April 11, 2011 'that awful digital tat' Have to take exception to that globalisation Clive. I find my N550+doubler+your laser far superior to the maxikite it replaced in ALL departments. Please tell me how you made your doubler. The mag is the only thing that lets the 550 down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
camo304 Posted April 12, 2011 Report Share Posted April 12, 2011 Clive when are we going to see some pics thru the scope and a review then it can be compared against the D760 and the likes? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
243ack Posted April 12, 2011 Report Share Posted April 12, 2011 Please tell me how you made your doubler. The mag is the only thing that lets the 550 down. Have a look on you-tube. 'Lordlardoframs' from Airgun BBS posted his method of doing this. My only improvement was to lock the adaptor (which I had made in brass) in place with loctite and four grub screws. Results are superb: over 7x mag and very little need to adjust focus for most sensible foxing ranges. Please get back to me if you have problems. No, I don't want to make them or sell them, but I'll do what I can to help. Well worth the effort though. As said above; mine is for use!!!. Much easier to use than any tubed system I've seen - and not susceptible to 'stray light'. Before Clive comes back, though: 'each to his own'!!!. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
camo304 Posted April 12, 2011 Report Share Posted April 12, 2011 If you do a search Dr bob if think he is going to be doing these if not already http://www.rapid7ownersclub.com/viewtopic.php?f=28&p=142095&sid=1ecdbaf953b8f8b74829f947745ede81#p142095 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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