barrel length

[jacksgundogs]

im buying a .22 soon but which barrel length do you think is the best16 or 20 inch.

[Alycidon]

If this is a rimfire then 16 inch is plenty assuming you are mainly using subbies. Longer barrels offer no real advantages and are awkward to handle inside a vechicle at night. Dont forget you will probably want to add a 6 inch long moddy.

 

A

[col48]

As Geoff says really

i have mine the shortest that you are aloud by law.and i had a long barreled cz to start with.i must say i have noticed no discernable difference in the rifles ability to put rabbits to sleep

the only things i have noticed are all positive.

the rifle

shoots better

handles better

better in the truck

 

its all good

 

ATB

Colin

[Guest Custard]

16" if you intend to using subsonic ammunition, 19" if you intend on using HV or any of the target ammunition.

 

Added bonus of the HV choice is you can forget about lumbering yourself with a mod. I don't find the rabbits notice that much. The big red boxey thing on wheels with a 2.5lt diesel engine clanking away tends to give the game away.

[baldie]

A 22 long rifle round burns its charge inside 9" of barrel. You can have 30 cms minimum by law[12"] it doesn,t take a lot of working out. Target ammunition is subsonic too. 12.5" barrels work better than any other length, for the simple reason that the bullet is in the barrel for a shorter time, thus giving the shooter less time to interfere with the shot after the trigger is tripped. We sell more short barrels than any other length. CZ paid our shop a visit several years ago, to see why we were shortening so many of their rifles. They then went home, and released the 16" versions of all their rimfires. 16" being a compromise for looks and balance, otherwise they would have had to do some stock alterations.

I have a top of the range anschutz silhouette rifle that cost over a grand, and i,ve been shooting it this morning with its 22" ish barrel. Its going in the lathe this week, and its getting shortened down to the end of the stock, which will be about 13", and i know it will be easier to shoot. Just look at the little anschutz x1v carbine.That has a 14" barrel, and its probarbly the most accurate sporting .22 made.

Long barrels on .22,s were put on for one reason only.....open sights fixed at both ends. The length ensured a long sight plane, which is essential for open sighted accuracy...no use whatsoever with optics.

[Guest Custard]

Dave.

 

I guess all those US and Australian 100m and 200m .22BR shooters have got it all wrong then. I know some are utilising a few inches of free bore but.............

 

My info came directly from Eley re recommended barrel length. IIRC it was part of an article in one of the shooting mag's. I would have thought they would know a thing or two about .22LR ammunition.

 

Let us know how you get on with chopping your Anschutz barrel back.

[baldie]

I wouldn,t hold any great store on eley,s current knowledge of rimfire ammo, because apart from tenex and match, the rest of it is pure shite, and thats the main reason, we and a lot more places dont sell it any more.Eley seem to have have virtually given up on the lower end of the market, concentrating mainly on the olympic grade stuff on which they made their name. Every other manufacturer jumped in with a better, and cheaper product, such as cci with its "std" round, this outshoots the bottom 3 colours of eley in virtually every gun i,ve tried them in.

Br smallbore is a relativley new phenomenon, and they utilise allsorts of weird things to aid accuracy, such as barrel tuners. I bet you a pound to a pinch of snuff, that a br gun with its tuner removed, and its full length barrel, is no more accurate than a 14" carbine. I know this for a fact, because i,ve tried it several times.

Rimfire ammo is so technically poor in comparison to centrefire, there is only so much you can do, ammo, and barrel wise.

BR guns are a minute spot on the face of .22 rimfire shooting. In the real world of the club shooter, the rabbit basher, and the casual shot, the short barrelled gun will aid the shooter every time.

I also have another anschutz, its another match 54 actioned special, built by ivan hancock. It has a full length barrel, or rather did have. The first 13" is barrel, the other 12" or so, is a very cleverly designed silencer, that is made out of the old barrel, so it looks like a full length gun. This rifle will hold 1/2" 5 shot groups with eley tenex, or eps match, at 100 yards, on a still day, and thats off a bipod, and rear bag.

[Guest Custard]

I wouldn,t hold any great store on eley,s current knowledge of rimfire ammo, because apart from tenex and match, the rest of it is pure shite, and thats the main reason, we and a lot more places dont sell it any more.Eley seem to have have virtually given up on the lower end of the market, concentrating mainly on the olympic grade stuff on which they made their name. Every other manufacturer jumped in with a better, and cheaper product, such as cci with its "std" round, this outshoots the bottom 3 colours of eley in virtually every gun i,ve tried them in.

Br smallbore is a relativley new phenomenon, and they utilise allsorts of weird things to aid accuracy, such as barrel tuners. I bet you a pound to a pinch of snuff, that a br gun with its tuner removed, and its full length barrel, is no more accurate than a 14" carbine. I know this for a fact, because i,ve tried it several times.

Rimfire ammo is so technically poor in comparison to centrefire, there is only so much you can do, ammo, and barrel wise.

BR guns are a minute spot on the face of .22 rimfire shooting. In the real world of the club shooter, the rabbit basher, and the casual shot, the short barrelled gun will aid the shooter every time.

I also have another anschutz, its another match 54 actioned special, built by ivan hancock. It has a full length barrel, or rather did have. The first 13" is barrel, the other 12" or so, is a very cleverly designed silencer, that is made out of the old barrel, so it looks like a full length gun. This rifle will hold 1/2" 5 shot groups with eley tenex, or eps match, at 100 yards, on a still day, and thats off a bipod, and rear bag.

 

Dave

 

Eleys rep is second to none as far as .22 ammunition production is concerned. The fact that they are still held in very high regard in the target shooting world where the demands for accuracy and consistency are at their greatest says volumes IMO. Their knowledge base regarding .22 ammo is I suspect as good as any and significantly higher than many.I have never judged the quality and suitability for usage of a factory produced round by its cheapness, and I don't think I ever will. All though I know many who do.

I think you may well loose you bet regarding the Anshutz accuracy when compared to the semi customised .22BR rifles and the full custom jobs the some of the specialist riflesmiths are now producing .22BR may be in its infancy here in the UK but its certainly not over in the USA, Australia, Italy, Austria to name but a few. What exactly have you tried against your fabled 14" carbine?

Seeing as most club shooters I know will adopt any technical improvemnet in order to seek the slightest improvemnet in their scores. I await them to all universally adopted the 13" barrel? Its only advantage is when utilised as an out of the truck window rifle.

I'll stick with my 19" barrel on my .22 hunting rifle. Its worked superbly up till now.

How does your Ian Hancock 54 Shoot with out the additional weight of the barrel extension? Taking your theory to its logical conclusion it should shoot as good if not better.

 

Head spacing is more important than barrel length IMO. But thats a whole different discussion.

[baldie]

Eleys reputation outside of the olympic/match circuit user, who only uses tenex/eps, could not be any lower, and thats why firms like rws are rapidly gaining a very large foothold in the market. Eley dont give a toss about the club/rabbit shooter, and have had their collective head so far up the olympic arse for that long, they,ve lost their strangle hold.

 

My IVAN Hancock rifle shoots just the same, with or without the moderator fitted. Its a moderator, not a barrel, it has no effect on the bullet, only the noise.

Do you know what "follow through" is ? Its what buggers up most "ordinary" shooters...because it affects a rimfire, just the same as an airgun. Thats the main reason, why a short barrel is more successful in 99% of cases. After the first 9", the bullet is also decelerating, so whats the point?

The original poster, and the main respondants to it, are talking about probarbly a field rifle, not a benchrest gun. Two totally different beasts, that dont even use the same type of .22 ammo.

 

I,ve shot several short anschutz,s, and all manner of 10/22,s etc, and also all the UIT/match weapons from anschutz, walther etc. Also converted many into benchrest guns for customers.

I,m the gunsmith at the largest, supplier and builder of rimfires in the UK.....so i,m not really qualified to comment i suppose.

Happy new year Harry.

[eldon]

Have to agree with dave, I used to use tenex and they performed well but other eley products .....no.

For the original posted question,

I had a long barrelled cz brno or whatever they call them and as dave said the only benefit was with the original open sights.

I like many others disregarded these and fitted a scope so no advantage what so ever.

What a pain in the arse a long barrel with mod on the end is. Trees, vehicles, generally lamping . Shorters definetly better.

 

Chopped mine from 24" down to 18" ( so between the 16 and 20" options) and wouldn't go back to longer.

 

16" will do you fine.

[col48]

Eleys reputation outside of the olympic/match circuit user, who only uses tenex/eps, could not be any lower, and thats why firms like rws are rapidly gaining a very large foothold in the market. Eley dont give a toss about the club/rabbit shooter, and have had their collective head so far up the olympic arse for that long, they,ve lost their strangle hold.

 

My IVAN Hancock rifle shoots just the same, with or without the moderator fitted. Its a moderator, not a barrel, it has no effect on the bullet, only the noise.

Do you know what "follow through" is ? Its what buggers up most "ordinary" shooters...because it affects a rimfire, just the same as an airgun. Thats the main reason, why a short barrel is more successful in 99% of cases. After the first 9", the bullet is also decelerating, so whats the point?

The original poster, and the main respondants to it, are talking about probarbly a field rifle, not a benchrest gun. Two totally different beasts, that dont even use the same type of .22 ammo.

 

I,ve shot several short anschutz,s, and all manner of 10/22,s etc, and also all the UIT/match weapons from anschutz, walther etc. Also converted many into benchrest guns for customers.

I,m the gunsmith at the largest, supplier and builder of rimfires in the UK.....so i,m not really qualified to comment i suppose.

Happy new year Harry.

 

 

Dave

i was going to send you a PM but i see you have spotted him by your self.

it gets easier and easier.

ATB

Colin

[Guest Custard]

Chopped mine from 24" down to 18" ( so between the 16 and 20" options) and wouldn't go back to longer.

 

Always the best compromise 18-19".

[Guest Custard]

Eleys reputation outside of the olympic/match circuit user, who only uses tenex/eps, could not be any lower, and thats why firms like rws are rapidly gaining a very large foothold in the market. Eley dont give a toss about the club/rabbit shooter, and have had their collective head so far up the olympic arse for that long, they,ve lost their strangle hold.

 

My IVAN Hancock rifle shoots just the same, with or without the moderator fitted. Its a moderator, not a barrel, it has no effect on the bullet, only the noise.

Do you know what "follow through" is ? Its what buggers up most "ordinary" shooters...because it affects a rimfire, just the same as an airgun. Thats the main reason, why a short barrel is more successful in 99% of cases. After the first 9", the bullet is also decelerating, so whats the point?

The original poster, and the main respondants to it, are talking about probarbly a field rifle, not a benchrest gun. Two totally different beasts, that dont even use the same type of .22 ammo.

 

I,ve shot several short anschutz,s, and all manner of 10/22,s etc, and also all the UIT/match weapons from anschutz, walther etc. Also converted many into benchrest guns for customers.

I,m the gunsmith at the largest, supplier and builder of rimfires in the UK.....so i,m not really qualified to comment i suppose.

Happy new year Harry.

 

Dave

 

So according to you, we are to ignore Eleys years of experience, and expertise just because you feel they have abandoned the lower end of the budget priced .22 ammunition market. There by demonstrating their disinterest in the club/rabbit shooter. An interesting proposition but one I'll chose to pass by if you don't mind.

 

Yes I am fully aware of what "follow through" is and what it does. I know several shooter that use non budget ammunition for all of their shooting requirements to claim that "dont even use the same type of .22 ammo". Is an assumption not to be confused with the actual.

 

I am well aware of who you are and where you work, and more importantly how you started etc. Its well documented. I didn't know Roger was the largest supplier of rimfires in the UK. I am sure there are a few around who would contest that one. But it matters very little. Your comments are always welcomed, certainly by me. But we are not compelled to agree. personally I prefer to pay heed to the likes of Carfree, McGowan, Vincotatina, etc. Some of the best rimfire custom builders and barrel makers in the world. My choice I know but they do have the track records to prove their judgement calls.

 

Happy New Year to you too.

[JR__]

Eleys reputation outside of the olympic/match circuit user, who only uses tenex/eps, could not be any lower, and thats why firms like rws are rapidly gaining a very large foothold in the market. Eley dont give a toss about the club/rabbit shooter, and have had their collective head so far up the olympic arse for that long, they,ve lost their strangle hold.

 

My IVAN Hancock rifle shoots just the same, with or without the moderator fitted. Its a moderator, not a barrel, it has no effect on the bullet, only the noise.

Do you know what "follow through" is ? Its what buggers up most "ordinary" shooters...because it affects a rimfire, just the same as an airgun. Thats the main reason, why a short barrel is more successful in 99% of cases. After the first 9", the bullet is also decelerating, so whats the point?

The original poster, and the main respondants to it, are talking about probarbly a field rifle, not a benchrest gun. Two totally different beasts, that dont even use the same type of .22 ammo.

 

I,ve shot several short anschutz,s, and all manner of 10/22,s etc, and also all the UIT/match weapons from anschutz, walther etc. Also converted many into benchrest guns for customers.

I,m the gunsmith at the largest, supplier and builder of rimfires in the UK.....so i,m not really qualified to comment i suppose.

Happy new year Harry.

 

Hard to group rimfires all in the same boat. Rifles and ammunition included.

[Guest Custard]

Hard to group rimfires all in the same boat. Rifles and ammunition included.

 

Thank you JR.

 

I've read most of the "what improves a .22LR's accuracy" threads pretty much on all of the dedicated fora. Its usually a combination of many things.

 

As a barrel maker of considerable experience what are you views on gain twist in .22lr barrels ? Or any barrel for that matter

[Ronin]

May be an idea to start a new thread on this topic Custard, it is well away from the initial post.

[jacksgundogs]

from what ive deducted from my original thread is that both barrel lengths could be suitable,but the 16" is probably more practacle for general use and in the vehicle.thanks for all your replies.i have also got a lot of advice on ammo that i shall also use when buying regards jack.

[Wsm]

Andy

 

As you know Harry/Custard isn`t really interested in an informative post but would rather try and cause disruption and division where ever he goes

 

I`m glad the majority of this thread has given you some ideas Jack

[eldon]

Jack if you want to have a pop with mine before you buy one you are more than welcome if it will help you decide.

PM me if the idea would help.

 

EDIT; Just seen your new purchase on the other post so please ignore.

[menial 1]

Cut mine back to 14" some years ago and never looked back. Made it a delight to carry or shoot from a truck. Tried the head keepers old CZ in full original length the other night, it was like shooting with a clothes prop.

Pete.

[ChrisF]

I agree , 12 iches is all thats needed ( as i see the main use of a 22LR is subsonic , as its a low power/velocity cal to start with ), the 16 inche that is more about , the minimun lenght allowed by Law in the US etc , than what is the BEST .

 

Later Chris

[JR__]

I agree , 12 iches is all thats needed ( as i see the main use of a 22LR is subsonic , as its a low power/velocity cal to start with ), the 16 inche that is more about , the minimun lenght allowed by Law in the US etc , than what is the BEST .

 

Later Chris

 

Is it? Maybe more, maybe less. Depends on the application mate.

 

JR

[jacksgundogs]

Jack if you want to have a pop with mine before you buy one you are more than welcome if it will help you decide.

PM me if the idea would help.

 

EDIT; Just seen your new purchase on the other post so please ignore.

 

never mind mate thanks for the offer,ive been out today to zero the scopes and i really enjoyed it.took quite a few rounds to get there but it is spot on now.regards jack

[eldon]

whereabouts in north yorks are you

pm if you prefer.

[jacksgundogs]

whereabouts in north yorks are you

pm if you prefer.

 

im in stokesley south of middlesbrough mate,regards jack.