holding heads for re-loading

[nuttyspaniel]

Here is a question for you lads in the know!!! On a persons firearms ticket it states buy x amount and hold x amount rounds of ammunition! Now lets say the persom can hold 120 rnds can that person hold say 200 heads but not in a completed state?And the same would go for lets say for arguments sake buy 100rnds could the person buy more heads?

 

My reading into the wording actually allows this as it states amunition not heads for re-loading! Now this is could be a huge grey area with lots of different opinions, but just out of interest does anybody have the difinative answer with perhaps links to the law regarding this? Ive been trawlling the internet over the last few days but cant find anything that says no!!

[Streeker59]

MY FAC allows me to purchase "X" amount of ammo and hold "Y" amount. That is for completed rounds of ammo only. I can purchase as many bullets as i want in any caliber even if that caliber is not on my FAC.

Except expanding bullets!! I can buy as many as i want but only in the calibers that my FAC gives me premission for.

Grant..

[Ratwhiskers]

N,S

 

Sometime ago I asked the same question to my local FLO, and the answer I got was........ only "Live Rounds" count as stored. He was not interested in what i had on stock (bullet heads) ready to reload (any case with a primer seated constitutes a live round). I have enough on my ticket that I never actually buy to the "Max" at any one time but try to keep enough on stock that I won't run out.

[DaveK]

It depends on the heads.

 

FMJ heads for target shooting you can hold as many as you want.

 

Expanding missiles (heads) are section 5 ammunition and count as full rounds and count towards your allocation.

 

So if you have 500 expanding heads and an allocation to hold 600 rounds, you can only have 100 made up rounds in addition to the 500 heads.

 

I recently had a renewal visit and asked for my allocation to hold to be increased. He said that only made up ammunition counted and I told him he was talking broccoli (I did). I had to make him record a request for his boss to put it in writing otherwise I wanted the allocation increased.

 

The cert came back with an increased allocation and no letter from his boss.

[eldon]

I think dave is spot on there.

A while ago I discussed this with my FEO and also some fellow shooters and for expanding ammo the general consensus was the limit applies to heads and ammo combined.

[Ratwhiskers]

Cumbria Plod e-mailed and waiting reply

 

Well stuck my finger up the Lions Bum again

Besides a smelly finger

And a very pissed off Lion

l'm just the loony to hang about

To see what happens next

[baldie]

Different forces interpret differently. Only loaded rounds count with section 5 heads in s yorks apparently, so no storage limit.Neither do they have to be kept securely locked. Their only difference to a target head, is they have to be put in the expanding missiles register.Its high time the law was changed, and apparently it may well be, in the next round of firearms reviews.bullets are bullets, and the police realise this.

[DaveK]

Different forces interpret differently. Only loaded rounds count with section 5 heads in s yorks apparently, so no storage limit.Neither do they have to be kept securely locked. Their only difference to a target head, is they have to be put in the expanding missiles register.Its high time the law was changed, and apparently it may well be, in the next round of firearms reviews.bullets are bullets, and the police realise this.

 

couldn't agree more. Ammo isn't so bad as people are in their own force area when they store stuff but whats worse is the inconsistency of FAC conditions such as HMR for fox on your cert but shooting in another force area where it's not allowed, although in YOUR conditions of use could get a black mark against your name with the local plod where you shoot.

 

Back to the point though, I've never had my ammo checked on renewal nor asked what I've got except for on the renewal/variation form. Nor do I always enter reloaded ammunition onto my cert or have expanding heads written in by RFD's (some do and some don't anyway). I used to with a restricted cert to prove use but now its open ......................

 

Which, I suppose, leads to another question. Should you enter reloaded ammo onto your ticket?

 

Dave

[nell]

Years ago i used to enter loaded ammo onto my cert as i was questiond on renwel about the lack of purchaced ammo on my cert, as it was blank for the three year period as it was at the time. For the last couple of years purchaced heads have been entered in my cert by the shop i use. This caused a problem as one calibre on my cert stated i could purchase 40 rounds so i had to apply for a varriation to purchase 100 just so i was able to buy a box of heads.

Is this normal procedure ????

Nell

[baldie]

If we get someone in with 40 rounds on their ticket, nell, and they are allowed expanding, we sell them the smallest box size, which is usually 100 heads.Without any sort of variation etc.

[Alycidon]

If we get someone in with 40 rounds on their ticket, nell, and they are allowed expanding, we sell them the smallest box size, which is usually 100 heads.Without any sort of variation etc.

 

 

Some years ago I went to Norman Clarke for some 55gr .22 NBT's I had hold 100 but 80 on a very recently renewed ticket, he could not sell them to me. I went back to Beds (my force at the time) who disagreed with Normans force (Warwickshire), after a deal of to and fro ing I got a variation FOC.

 

As I understand it hold as many match heads as you want, expanding though have to conform volume wise to whats on the ticket assembled or not. I explained that I reload and liked to batch my heads weight and length wise and had no problems getting buy 500 hold 600.

 

A

[nell]

If we get someone in with 40 rounds on their ticket, nell, and they are allowed expanding, we sell them the smallest box size, which is usually 100 heads.Without any sort of variation etc.

 

It was many years ago when my buy 40 rounds problem arose, the dealer had sold me a box of heads (100), but written 3 different dates of sale on my cert, this was spotted by the flo when checking before renewal (top man shooting fan and knows his stuff) I never heard any more on subject but im sure wrists where slapped

Nell

[nuttyspaniel]

My feo as confirmed no more than the buy may be bought and no more than the hold amount can be held made or just heads!! BTW there is a post on the stalking directory regards importing expanding heads from usa! Its legal and basc are backing this with a written letter!!!! Happy Days!!!!

[baldie]

I assume that these FEO,s can point out the relevant section of the firearms act then?

Its a grey area, as far as i know, and trust me, as a retail shop, we will not knowingly break the law.

[Vermincinerator]

Aly,

Your FAC should be worded the same as mine, i can buy and hold as many expanding projectiles as i want even if i have my full quoto of ammo made up

 

Ian.

[DaveK]

I assume that these FEO,s can point out the relevant section of the firearms act then?

Its a grey area, as far as i know, and trust me, as a retail shop, we will not knowingly break the law.

 

There yer go: -

 

3.17 Category (xv) extends the prohibition

on the various types of prohibited

ammunition to the actual bullet or missile

itself, not just the complete round of

ammunition (a complete round consists of

the bullet, the cartridge case, the propellant

and the primer). Certain categories of shooter

such as deerstalkers and vermin controllers

are exempt from the requirement to obtain

the authority of the Secretary of State to

possess expanding ammunition (see Chapter

4) and will have the appropriate condition

entered on their certificate (see Appendix 3).

There is no need for the bullets to be listed

separately on the certificate, other than in the

circumstances described below. However,

where a certificate holder requests large

quantities of bullets, it should be remembered

that the total number of bullets authorised

 

counts towards their overall limit on

possession of expanding ammunition. The

exception to the rule on listing bullets

separately on a certificate applies in the case

of a certificate holder who wishes to possess

a variety of different types of bullets. This

may be reflected in a relatively higher

overall limit on possession and, in these

circumstances, the bullets may be listed

separately to help avoid unnecessary

stockpiling of complete rounds. It is not

necessary for the dealer making the sale to

record transactions of expanding bullets on

the certificate but the sale

[nuttyspaniel]

Thats the section Dave.