.22 Hornet

[Gerald D.]

I know its a good bit harder for you folks to own a goodly brace of arms, but here in the states I can't imagine not having my CZ527 .22 Hornet and CZ 527 HS Precision .223 also, same with a full compliment of rimfires, each has its place in the overall scheme of things if you can have them. Good shooting, I enjoy reading your threads.

 

Gerald

[charly hunter]

Thank for the replies guys, but I am still none the wiser (no surprises there I hear some say ) Is a hornet good for the ranges I shoot out too of about 200, 250 yrds I have the 223 and never yet have I had the need to go past this range, so do I need it?????

 

Sorry Teach for high jacking your thread

 

Gerald D. what is your opinion???? Bob Tail said he has shot several foxes at 250yds. Will it???

 

I am very close to getting one just can't be sure and I can't really warrant having them both, besides it's a rare thing for me to pick up a rifle these days, so I was thinking the hornet may suit my needs (well some of them )

[Andrew]

Thank for the replies guys, but I am still none the wiser (no surprises there I hear some say ) Is a hornet good for the ranges I shoot out too of about 200, 250 yrds I have the 223 and never yet have I had the need to go past this range, so do I need it?????

 

Sorry Teach for high jacking your thread

 

Gerald D. what is your opinion???? Bob Tail said he has shot several foxes at 250yds. Will it???

 

I am very close to getting one just can't be sure and I can't really warrant having them both, besides it's a rare thing for me to pick up a rifle these days, so I was thinking the hornet may suit my needs (well some of them )

 

I play only with the light bullets in the Hornet, generally, but since I have the stats on my latest load on hand I'll pass this on.

 

I am shooting a Midway 34 grain "Dog Town" varmint bullet with a BC of .132 @ about 3000 ft/sec from my CZ. Zeroed at 150 it has a -9" trajectory at 250 with 177 pounds remaining energy. Admittedly, I think I could push that a bit more with a tad more Lil Gun but would that handle your fox?? The 45 grainers would hit harder, of course. I hit prairiedogs at 200 with my CZ regularly so accuracy isn't an issue. ~Andrew

[charly hunter]

prairiedogs are a little smaller than a fox though I havd foxes run a long way after receiving a masive blow from a 50gr V-Max so how much damage would the hornet do at that range????? not enough me thinks

 

Thanks Andrew

[Bucko]

I have both 22 Hornet and 223. If I could only have one it would be the 223.

If your current 223 shoots well and you have confidence in it, I'd stick with it.

 

cheers

 

Neil

[Andrew]

prairiedogs are a little smaller than a fox though I havd foxes run a long way after receiving a masive blow from a 50gr V-Max so how much damage would the hornet do at that range????? not enough me thinks

 

Thanks Andrew

 

The prairiedog reference was only related to size /accuracy requirements. They are a darned sight smaller than a fox! If the Hornet isn't enough, it isn't enough. I would probably use a Deuce or .223 on fox myself. (though I have hunted them with a .32 caliber muzzle loader but it's different kind of hunting entirely) They run away from a massive hit from a 50 grain V-Max?? Maybe you should consider a 308 !!~Andrew

[charly hunter]

The buggers here are on Steriods pard, Silent hit one one night I took him out with his 300wm and the bugger ran near 60yds before hitting the deck. On another evening he had one with his 762 and dropped on the spot and in seconds a second one came in at the same sort of distance and Silent had to give it a second shot as it took off to the first one On closer inspection of the fox the first round entered near the shoulder as the fox was looking at us the bullet traveled right through it, came out of the butt and cut a very clean line off the fur diagonally across it's tail. When we looked at the fox we could see the exact line the bullet had taken because the fur was stood up on end all the way down it's back to the exit wound Hard buggers down this way pard, and that's just the foxes you should see some of the women

[Redfox]

Hornet does not meet the minimum legal energy requirements for deer, including Muntjac and Chinese Water deer. The 222 is the lowest you can go and is a far better round for foxes etc too. Nice and soft on the shoulder, not too noisy and extremely accurate, a much better bet, 223 is good too.

Redfox

[blackjack]

i thought about getting a hornet for my first c/f, nige, but was put off by the fact it is supposed to be tricky to load for,if you want something a bit smaller than the 223 have a go on my 222 nice and light and virtually no recoil.

[Guest alan108]

Hi everyone, thought i would add my findings with a .22 hornet,i own a .223 and .22 hornet and reload for both,for the .22 hornet i use LIL'GUN at 13gr,with 45gr sp heads and find for bunnies,200 yds is about right,i've shot foxes at 175/180 yds with this load,I enjoy using my hornet,light recoil and easy to moderate,also I find it easy to reload,had lots of advice from other users,most important is seating the head,i set the die to just touch the case then back off 1/2 turn,NO crushed cases so far! and i never crimp the case.Hope that may help in some way. Alan

[charly hunter]

Well thanks for the replies guys, I guess I will stick with my 223 for the time being at least I know that will kill a fox at 250 yds, I will just have to keep thinking what other cal. I could do with 30-06 maybe

[Andrew]

Hi everyone, thought i would add my findings with a .22 hornet,i own a .223 and .22 hornet and reload for both,for the .22 hornet i use LIL'GUN at 13gr,with 45gr sp heads and find for bunnies,200 yds is about right,i've shot foxes at 175/180 yds with this load,I enjoy using my hornet,light recoil and easy to moderate,also I find it easy to reload,had lots of advice from other users,most important is seating the head,i set the die to just touch the case then back off 1/2 turn,NO crushed cases so far! and i never crimp the case.Hope that may help in some way. Alan

 

Alan,

Good to hear from another Hornet shooter! By lightly expanding the case mouth you will almost completely eliminate the likelihood of crushing a case and your bullets will seat straighter and easier. I, and others, have found that a crimp works well in the Hornet. I use a Lee Universal Neck Expander and Factory Crimp Die, respectively, for these operations.

 

A good friend of mine on the in the Eastern US is using that 45 grain SP for woodchuck (Eastern Marmot) that run in the 10 - 18 pound class and he has found that this bullet performs best. His load and yours are identical.~Andrew

[eldon]

Charly I have just reread the thread and if you need to spend some money , I know I think we all get ourselves into this from time to time what about getting a mod for the 223.

That way you get a capable round that is quieter and has the punch and distance if you need it. Most mods seem to tighten the groups up as well so added bonus.

Quieter might lead to more practice and more confidence with it and you may become inseparable.

[Guest alan108]

Alan,

Good to hear from another Hornet shooter! By lightly expanding the case mouth you will almost completely eliminate the likelihood of crushing a case and your bullets will seat straighter and easier. I, and others, have found that a crimp works well in the Hornet. I use a Lee Universal Neck Expander and Factory Crimp Die, respectively, for these operations.

 

A good friend of mine on the in the Eastern US is using that 45 grain SP for woodchuck (Eastern Marmot) that run in the 10 - 18 pound class and he has found that this bullet performs best. His load and yours are identical.~Andrew

Hi Andrew,i've only just stopped crimping the heads,it was advice in the Lyman booklet that i got with my tumbler,i think that for my needs the hornet is an ideal gun,its a shame that more shooters dont realise what a cracking gun it is,I rarely shoot over 200 yds for rabbits and foxes, i know it will reach out farther, though,if i'm shooting longer,i'll use my .223,both guns are CZ 527 American,screw cut for moderator,(i use a T8AR)but in all honesty,i find it heavy for the hornet,i'm looking at a forward mounted moderator,Stalker MK 11,not sure what to do at the moment. Alan

[Andrew]

The Lyman book advised against crimping? I guess what works, works. I found my groups tighter using the Lee Factory Crimp Die by at least 30%.

 

Luckily, I live in the US in east central Montana. Moderators are unnecessary for the purposes of civility. I also use a CZ 527 Hornet (the "American" model) and think it s the finest Hornet I've owned over the last three decades. My son has one, as does my shooting buddy. I was the last to get one, doting on my Anschutz until the bitter end. When I was hunting antelope ground squirrels on the Mexican border I watched my buddy flipping these diminutive little critters out of stubble fields at 200 yards. That convinced me to get one for my son when the opportunity came and sure enough, it shot far better than my Anny. It also didn't bloat the brass like my Anny did. One day the local trading post got in a CZ. I made a phone call and sold the Anschutz then swung in and picked up the CZ. Never a regret. Remarkably, all three of these CZ Hornets are identically accurate with the identical loads. That speaks well for CZ. Good Shooting! ~Andrew

[charly hunter]

Charly I have just reread the thread and if you need to spend some money , I know I think we all get ourselves into this from time to time what about getting a mod for the 223.

That way you get a capable round that is quieter and has the punch and distance if you need it. Most mods seem to tighten the groups up as well so added bonus.

Quieter might lead to more practice and more confidence with it and you may become inseparable.

 

 

Finally someone who has read the whole bit that I put up I am glad you said that the mod tightens the group because I have said this to others and they recon it does the opposite, but my 223 with a T8 on it made a hell of a differance to my groups, from a 1 inch to a ragged hole, from that moment on I have never used my rifle without a mod, I also use the same one for my 243 just use a differant bushing.

 

So the answer is I don't need to spend any money on a mod I just don't know what new toy/s to buy

[Guest alan108]

The Lyman book advised against crimping? I guess what works, works. I found my groups tighter using the Lee Factory Crimp Die by at least 30%.

 

Luckily, I live in the US in east central Montana. Moderators are unnecessary for the purposes of civility. I also use a CZ 527 Hornet (the "American" model) and think it s the finest Hornet I've owned over the last three decades. My son has one, as does my shooting buddy. I was the last to get one, doting on my Anschutz until the bitter end. When I was hunting antelope ground squirrels on the Mexican border I watched my buddy flipping these diminutive little critters out of stubble fields at 200 yards. That convinced me to get one for my son when the opportunity came and sure enough, it shot far better than my Anny. It also didn't bloat the brass like my Anny did. One day the local trading post got in a CZ. I made a phone call and sold the Anschutz then swung in and picked up the CZ. Never a regret. Remarkably, all three of these CZ Hornets are identically accurate with the identical loads. That speaks well for CZ. Good Shooting! ~Andrew

Hi Andrew,again thanks for the reply and advice,i'm loading some .22 hornets and i'm crimping 50% and NOT crimping the rest,i'll go to the range on Sunday and check my grouping will let you know the results.I agree with your comments on the CZ, lower priced they may be,but,excellent value for money,mine shoots straight,no jams,etc,its cleaned after every outing and oiled in the right places.I do find with the moderator that groups are tighter,with the bonus of reducing muzzle flip,recoil and sound. cheers Alan

[Andrew]

Hi Andrew,again thanks for the reply and advice,i'm loading some .22 hornets and i'm crimping 50% and NOT crimping the rest,i'll go to the range on Sunday and check my grouping will let you know the results.I agree with your comments on the CZ, lower priced they may be,but,excellent value for money,mine shoots straight,no jams,etc,its cleaned after every outing and oiled in the right places.I do find with the moderator that groups are tighter,with the bonus of reducing muzzle flip,recoil and sound. cheers Alan

 

I will be interested in your results. Are you using the Factory Crimp Die? Or the standard "built-in" crimper? I live in a very different climate than you do, I'm sure, so don't be too alarmed when I say I clean my CZ Hornet about every 500 rounds, and then only a drag with a "Bore Snake" endowed with a single drop of oil. I clean the action religiously, but the bore only gets the attention I described. For the record, when I have sought to get copper fouling from my CZ I found I had none to speak of! By the time you're eating your evening meal I shall be out in the prairiedog towns reminding myself why I like that CZ Hornet so much! ~Andrew

[Guest alan108]

Hi Andrew, the results of crimping versus not crimping were very interesting, the crimped ammo shot 1/2" groups at 100 mtrs,and the uncrimped shot 3/4 out to 1",so looks like I shall be crimping in future.I'm using the Lee Pacesetter dies with the crimping tool supplied in the set and f/l size my cases. cheers, Alan

[Gerald D.]

Sorry to appear rude but for some reason couldn't log on here for some time, as to Charly Hunters question a while back I think 250 would be a push for a Hornet on Fox, likely 200 would be my limit. The CZ would have no problem connecting, I'd just be doubtful of the energy, but a head shot is a head shot too!

 

 

Gerald

[Andrew]

Alan,

Great! It is usually the case with the Hornet. If you can lay hands on a Lee Factory Crimp die without too much grief I think you'd appreciate it. I had very similar results to yours. Other refinements helped too. As I mentioned, I like to bell the case mouth gently for trouble free (straighter) seating and I use small pistol primers. Of course, crimping necessitates trimming every time around though, depending on the lot of brass, I don't get much stretch with the Lil Gun.

 

Gerald,

The 34 grain Dog Town bullet I'm shooting from my CZ at 3000 fps (BC .132) had 215 ft/lbs energy at 250. I know it will expand on a prairiedog at 200 so it might just have the huevos to open up at 250. I don't know as I only hunt fox with a muzzleloader! ~Andrew

[Guest alan108]

Hi, checking my Pacesetter dies for the crimping die,I found that the set that i have includes "Exclusive,this set includes a LEE FACTORY CRIMP DIE" both the .22 hornet and .223 die sets have the same, so i'm very pleased about that!

[Andrew]

Hi, checking my Pacesetter dies for the crimping die,I found that the set that i have includes "Exclusive,this set includes a LEE FACTORY CRIMP DIE" both the .22 hornet and .223 die sets have the same, so i'm very pleased about that!

 

Alan:

Good news! Have fun experimenting. I loaded 100 rounds of Hornet last evening in hopes that the rain will break soon.

 

I was going to ask: Can you get "Accurate Arms" powders? If so, look for a powder called 1680. It is an exceptionally good Hornet powder though running on the slower side for velocity. Likewise, Hodgdon's H-110 is also very good with velocities at the top end of the scale. I ran some thirty-three grain V-Max over H-110 one afternoon and registered 3262 fps on my chronographs. (the load shredded rabbits at 150 yards) Anyhow, I use Lil Gun for it's low pressures, 1680 for uniformity, and H-110 for raw speed. All will tie for accuracy honors with proper loading. My mainstay is Lil Gun because the brass lasts forever.

 

Keep us up-to-date on your load development, won't you? ~Andrew

[Guest alan108]

Alan:

Good news! Have fun experimenting. I loaded 100 rounds of Hornet last evening in hopes that the rain will break soon.

 

I was going to ask: Can you get "Accurate Arms" powders? If so, look for a powder called 1680. It is an exceptionally good Hornet powder though running on the slower side for velocity. Likewise, Hodgdon's H-110 is also very good with velocities at the top end of the scale. I ran some thirty-three grain V-Max over H-110 one afternoon and registered 3262 fps on my chronographs. (the load shredded rabbits at 150 yards) Anyhow, I use Lil Gun for it's low pressures, 1680 for uniformity, and H-110 for raw speed. All will tie for accuracy honors with proper loading. My mainstay is Lil Gun because the brass lasts forever.

 

Keep us up-to-date on your load development, won't you? ~Andrew

Hi Andrew, i've included a photo of the results of crimping the .22 hornet,Winchester brass,cci 400 primer,13gns lil'Gun,and 45gn Sierra soft point heads,I used a bipod and the stock was supported at the rear,(wish i could shoot that well freestanding!!)the target was a 2" shoot-n-c at 100 yards.In answer to your question,yes,1680 is available over here,it was a choice between that and 2230,which i bought for my Cz .223.I'm nearly out of Lil'Gun,so i'll be sorting a different powder in addition to this,and may try 1680,i'll let you know the results, best wishes Alan

[Andrew]

Alan,

Sorry Amigo, the photo wouldn't open. Could you e-mail it to me? (marlinmanssv@hotmail.com)

 

I'm thinking it is a good one!

 

My son and I went out yesterday with the Hornets, a Howa .223 and a Winchester .222. We sat on a ridge in the middle of a prairiedog town shoulder-to-shoulder but facing opposite directions. We killed quite a few dogs (the farthest an adolescent at 185 yards) but never reached for the larger calibers. I got to see him take a pup that was maybe 7" long from nose to tip of tale and 2.5" around the widest part at 156 yards with his CZ/Lil Gun/ V-Max combo. The dog was laying flat across the hole mouth which gave him about 1" or so vertical target height to hit but he flipped him out of the hole nicely. Yes, the kid can shoot, but the load/gun combo is superb.

 

I have been shooting a new 34 grain bullet from Midway that I may try with 1680 or H-110 next time the brass hits the bench looking hungry. You can't beatr H-110, 1680, or Lil Gun. Ever consider small pistol primers?? Worth a look, especially with LG. ~Andrew