njc110381 Posted March 28, 2008 Report Share Posted March 28, 2008 Hey guys. Now I've got past the "what bullet" problem, I've now stumbled across the next confusing part - compressed loads? How do they work? I'm using Varget inn a .223 case, under bullets that could range from 40-55grn. The load data suggests the loadings range from 25-28grns of powder, but you can only fit 25.5grns in the case! I can't find any info on how compressed loads work, so I don't want to do anything silly. Do I just put the charge in and ram the bullet down on top of it (obviously after working up from minimum load), or are things not that simple? I quite like my hands and face (although it's not that pretty, it holds my brain in!) so I'm not too happy about doing this until I know the score. Almost all top end .223 loadings are compressed, and I'm confused! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
davo Posted March 28, 2008 Report Share Posted March 28, 2008 I'm new to reloading as well but my understanding of a compressed load is basically what you have said, an amount of powder in the case that requires you to push the bullet down onto the powder to get it to fit i.e. compressing the powder. You said that all most all the top end .223 loads are compressed, that will depend on what powder you are using, but don't get fixated with putting as much powder into the case as you can I've found that the fastest fps load on the data page ISN'T all ways the most accurate. Somebody with 'loads' (excuse the pun) more experience will be along shortly to explain it a bit better than I have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted March 28, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 28, 2008 Tell me about it! My 6.5x55 likes a Speer 140grn soft point on top of 33grns of Varget. That's the most accurate I can get so far, but it's only doing about 2300fps I can fire 3 shots at a target at 50 yards and it looks like only one round has hit it, but I have a feeling it's too slow for Deer Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Streeker59 Posted March 28, 2008 Report Share Posted March 28, 2008 No need to be confused Njc. Compressed loads are common in many calibers when using what could be construed as slow burning powder for said caliber. What i mean is that Varget would be considered a fast to medium burning powder for say .243 yet in a .223 it is a slow powder. Using slow powders for some calibers requires bulking up. To a large degree, little or no free space in the case is desirable as the powder should burn more consistently due to there being no air spaces. Also bear in mind that if you're using milspec cases, you will have less room for the powder and pressures will increase. In a small case such as the .223, the smallest deviation in powder charges will make a big difference in velocities and shot to shot deviation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted March 28, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 28, 2008 I was told Lapua cases were the best when I started loading for my 6.5. I'll probably just buy them for the .223 as well. So it is just a case of filling the neck with powder and shoving the bullet in then? That's simple enough. I've read that the fastest possible powder that holds safe pressure and fills the case is the best loading, but as I have Varget already it would be good for me to have a go using that (at least to start with). It's nowhere near the top of the table, but I'll give it a try. Thanks for the info. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elwood Posted March 28, 2008 Report Share Posted March 28, 2008 I doubt very much if you will get a full load of Varget in a Lapua .223 case. I'm told the case capacity for Lapua is less due to the thickness of the brass. I like varget but not in a .223, there are better powders out there such as H322, Benchmark and N133 to name but a few, but some people do get good results with Varget, good luck. Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted March 28, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 28, 2008 What other brass is better? I've heard Norma is good, but is that thick too? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elwood Posted March 28, 2008 Report Share Posted March 28, 2008 What other brass is better? I've heard Norma is good, but is that thick too? Lapua is as good as it gets, Norma is also very good but to damned expensive. Stick with Lapua but you will have to settle on the fact that you might not get a top end load in 223, not that is a problem, it's accuracy that counts. You could always try a drop tube, that will help get a bit more powder in the case, or just gently tap on the side of the case. Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eldon Posted March 28, 2008 Report Share Posted March 28, 2008 Experiment a bit when you put the powder in the case and you will find certain methods will get more in. For example don't pour the powder into the bottom of the neck but pour it down the top edge of the funnel and let it trickle down, as it seats into the case it will compact in better. I would be tempted to use a faster powder, vit 133 seems to get good results and benchmark seems to be another good one in 223. I have used 4198 in my 222 and is fast and good. If one powder did it all why do we have so many options I know what you are trying to do and I did the same by using BLC2 originally but it was slow velocity wise compared to a more appropriate powder. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted March 28, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 28, 2008 I've searched on google for .223 powder and every topic I read seems to mention Benchmark. My reloading manual doesn't have it listed though, so I may need some advice on a minimum/maximum load (unless it's written on the tub?). I checked brass prices. £40 for Lapua, £25 for Winchester and £20 for Remington (per 100). What a variation! I'm happy to pay for Lapua if it's worth paying for, but it seems a little steep How many rounds can I expect to get from a standard size tub of benchmark? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
eldon Posted March 28, 2008 Report Share Posted March 28, 2008 Your powders most likely to be a pound ( not vit powder as can be 1kg). So that is 7000 grains. Your load is ????grains, likely to be around 25grains say, 7000 = 280 rounds 25 If you look about this forum, silent I think it was posted his load which I think was 25.2grs of benchmark? Check around it was quite recent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted March 28, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 28, 2008 I've worked the cost out per shot now. Interesting. 70.5p per load for the first 100 (covers the brass) then 30.5ppl after. Not bad, although I've not included the dies in that. After the first 100 rounds home loading is cheaper than PPU or Wolf ammo, and I'm sure my loads will be much better Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elwood Posted March 28, 2008 Report Share Posted March 28, 2008 My top end load with Benchmark and 52 grain Amax was 26.3 giving me a 0.141 three shot group, if I remember rightly I was getting around 3400 fps. But as always this load was safe in my rifle so start below and work up. I have quite a bit of data for .223 and 52 grain bullets, please don't hesitate to ask. Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
menial 1 Posted March 28, 2008 Report Share Posted March 28, 2008 Hey guys. Now I've got past the "what bullet" problem, I've now stumbled across the next confusing part - compressed loads? How do they work? I'm using Varget inn a .223 case, under bullets that could range from 40-55grn. The load data suggests the loadings range from 25-28grns of powder, but you can only fit 25.5grns in the case! I can't find any info on how compressed loads work, so I don't want to do anything silly. Do I just put the charge in and ram the bullet down on top of it (obviously after working up from minimum load), or are things not that simple? I quite like my hands and face (although it's not that pretty, it holds my brain in!) so I'm not too happy about doing this until I know the score. Almost all top end .223 loadings are compressed, and I'm confused! 23 to 24.5 of Viht 130/133 fits far more easily into a .223 case without need for compression and possible high pressures. Either of these powders would deliver 3400fps + with extremely good accuracy with 50 grain bullets. Pete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
silentsoulsleave308holes Posted March 28, 2008 Report Share Posted March 28, 2008 25gr benchmark 52gr a-max sub 1/4 " at 100 x5 rounds one in nine twist 223 cz kev var confirmed in quite a few guns now as being a tack driver even a 1 in 8 twist sako 75 use it,love it and you'll want nothin more Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted March 29, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 29, 2008 25gr benchmark 52gr a-max sub 1/4 " at 100 x5 rounds one in nine twist 223 cz kev var confirmed in quite a few guns now as being a tack driver even a 1 in 8 twist sako 75 use it,love it and you'll want nothin more Could I substitute the A-Max for a V-Max, or are the A-Max ok to hunt with? I know this sounds like a really amateurish question as they are target bullets, but I've been told they do actually expand quite well on live quarry? If they do expand, will they do so reliably? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elwood Posted March 29, 2008 Report Share Posted March 29, 2008 Could I substitute the A-Max for a V-Max, or are the A-Max ok to hunt with? I know this sounds like a really amateurish question as they are target bullets, but I've been told they do actually expand quite well on live quarry? If they do expand, will they do so reliably? Yes the Amax will work the same as a Vmax. I have been told of three different differences between the two bullets 1 They come in different a box! 2 The Vmax has a slightly larger hole behind the ballistic tip 3 The Vmax has a slightly thinner wall than the Amax And remember when dealing with reloading and firearms the only dumb questions are the ones never asked. Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
njc110381 Posted March 29, 2008 Author Report Share Posted March 29, 2008 And remember when dealing with reloading and firearms the only dumb questions are the ones never asked. Ian That's the way I see it. I'd rather make myself look daft than not ask and find out the hard way! I think I'll just copy silents load then. I'm not too worried about what the bullets are designed for, as long as they work. This forum is great, if this load works for me it will save a huge amount of messing about Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest varmartin Posted March 29, 2008 Report Share Posted March 29, 2008 Go for it njc and follow the `Silent majority` and load a 52 Amax...if you can get them buy as many as you can carry... Quote... 25gr benchmark 52gr a-max sub 1/4 " at 100 x5 rounds one in nine twist 223 cz kev var confirmed in quite a few guns now as being a tack driver even a 1 in 8 twist sako 75 Yep I will admit to firing a five shot group with Silents home load recipe in my rifle and ` on the day` they were more accurate than my standard accuracy load of H4895 over 60Vmax. When I find a stash of 52 Amax I will be buying them all. ( and they stabilize in a 1~8 )...go figure Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ejg223 Posted March 29, 2008 Report Share Posted March 29, 2008 Another one for 52 a-max, worked well in my 223 with 25gr h335, 7mm group, they also work well in my 22-250 and make absolute shite of what they hit. Only thing I didn't like is they are not consistent in length over 0.2mm but they work. edi Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest fern Posted April 1, 2008 Report Share Posted April 1, 2008 Yes the Amax will work the same as a Vmax. I have been told of three different differences between the two bullets 1 They come in different a box! 2 The Vmax has a slightly larger hole behind the ballistic tip 3 The Vmax has a slightly thinner wall than the Amax And remember when dealing with reloading and firearms the only dumb questions are the ones never asked. Ian Hi guys, like the DUMB QUESTIONS statement, never a truer word spoken.Ive been reloading for 20 yrs or perhaps i should say ive been putting bullets together and nothing more.Over the last few yrs after joining forms such as this and asking the Qs my success in RELOADING has came on in leaps n bounds,CHEERS GUYS FERN Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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