Is higher velocity better at 1000 ydrs

[5R-Twist]

Hi Fellow shooters

Can anyone advise me on this load ?

I am just starting to get into F Class and 1000 yrd

I am running a 284 Shehane

The bullet im using is a Berger 180g VLD

The powder is Hod H4381SC

I have tested loads from 55.5g to 57.5g in stages of 0.5g

The best group At 100 yrds are 55.5g and 57.5g both are under 10mm groups where the others at best are 20mm.

The 55.5g give 2812 fps and the 57.5 give 2936 fps.

My question is

Will the lower velocity be a disadvantage on longer ranges.

Regards

V

 

[jcampbellsmith]

I don't know, but 0.5 gr is quite a big step, even with the larger case capacity of the 284 Shehane. I would be inclined to do more testing and perhaps move in 0.3 gr increments, then retest a likely weight with +-0.2 gr either side versus the likely weight.

 

I'm repeatedly told however fiddling with the load is academic if you can't read the wind.

 

Good luck.

 

JCS

[5R-Twist]

Hi JCS

Thanks for that will refine my loads and see where it takes me

Thanks again

V

[That bald headed Geordie]

There are those that say that the longer the bullet is in flight then the more it will be affected by the wind. And I would agree, but give the best loads a try at that distance and you might just be surprised that the lower load gives better results (or not!).

In my Shehane I use the same bullet or the hybrid which seems more accurate and I use 51.7grains of 4831 short cut which gives about 2900 fps at muzzle and that is accurate for my rifle. Experiment to find out what is best for your rifle. JCS was correct in that you can load all day long trying different load/bullet jam/jump, but if you have no idea of windreading then you do not know if your load is good or the wind blew the bullet into the group.

What you could do if your windreading skills are not good is to go for the least elevation spread which needs to be about 1/2 moa at 1000yds to be in the running, and do not worry about the bullets getting blown sidewards, just as long as your elevation spread is not more than 3/4 moa max you can improve on the wind reading skills and fine tune your loads.

Just my twopennorth.

[5R-Twist]

There are those that say that the longer the bullet is in flight then the more it will be affected by the wind. And I would agree, but give the best loads a try at that distance and you might just be surprised that the lower load gives better results (or not!).

In my Shehane I use the same bullet or the hybrid which seems more accurate and I use 51.7grains of 4831 short cut which gives about 2900 fps at muzzle and that is accurate for my rifle. Experiment to find out what is best for your rifle. JCS was correct in that you can load all day long trying different load/bullet jam/jump, but if you have no idea of windreading then you do not know if your load is good or the wind blew the bullet into the group.

What you could do if your windreading skills are not good is to go for the least elevation spread which needs to be about 1/2 moa at 1000yds to be in the running, and do not worry about the bullets getting blown sidewards, just as long as your elevation spread is not more than 3/4 moa max you can improve on the wind reading skills and fine tune your loads.

Just my twopennorth.

Hi TBHG

Thanks

I think what my main thought was is a faster bullet not affected by the wind so much or is that just hype.

V

[That bald headed Geordie]

Hi TBHG

Thanks

I think what my main thought was is a faster bullet not affected by the wind so much or is that just hype.

V

I think that the less time the bullet is in flight the less it will be affected by the wind, so faster(ish) is probably better than slow(ish). But do not get hung up on fastest is always best and that you must get as higher Mv as possible. Your cases might not last long and if you use that load on a hot day your pressures could go through the roof and be dangerous. You need to try various loads and pick the one with least elevation spread at that distance. You could try shooting say at 500/600yds to find the best load with least elevation and then go to 1000yds to test those same loads. As I said, do not fall into the trap of sending your bullets downrange at the speed of light, you do not need to.

When I was testing my Shehane loads, I loaded up in .3 increments and found the load that just started to give signs of bolt lift resistance. I then backed off half a grain from that load and found a load that gave the lowest extreme spread and no difficulty in bolt opening. I then started to move the bullet in or out to fine tune.

Good luck!

[gbal]

Hi TBHG

Thanks

I think what my main thought was is a faster bullet not affected by the wind so much or is that just hype.

V

Two main factors that affect bullet drift are time of flight (a faster bullet is affected less),but also BC,ballistic coefficient-essentially how streamlined the bullet is in flight,and the higher the BC,the less drift.

Given bullets of equal BC,the faster will drift less,but given equal velocity,the higher BC will drift less.

Both factors matter,and their is some interaction-better BC can come from increased weight,which reduces velocity....though bullets of the same calibre and weight can have different BC (shape,essentially).

 

As Les(BHG)says,there are other considerations too-the highest velocity may not be the most accurate,or give best barrel life ,or easiest to shoot (recoil) etc etc. No free lunches.

Gbal

[5R-Twist]

I think that the less time the bullet is in flight the less it will be affected by the wind, so faster(ish) is probably better than slow(ish). But do not get hung up on fastest is always best and that you must get as higher Mv as possible. Your cases might not last long and if you use that load on a hot day your pressures could go through the roof and be dangerous. You need to try various loads and pick the one with least elevation spread at that distance. You could try shooting say at 500/600yds to find the best load with least elevation and then go to 1000yds to test those same loads. As I said, do not fall into the trap of sending your bullets downrange at the speed of light, you do not need to.

When I was testing my Shehane loads, I loaded up in .3 increments and found the load that just started to give signs of bolt lift resistance. I then backed off half a grain from that load and found a load that gave the lowest extreme spread and no difficulty in bolt opening. I then started to move the bullet in or out to fine tune.

Good luck!

Hi TBHG

Thanks for some great info

Think I need to go a lot further with my load development

Will try some 600yrd at bisley soon which should help

Regards

V

[5R-Twist]

I think that the less time the bullet is in flight the less it will be affected by the wind, so faster(ish) is probably better than slow(ish). But do not get hung up on fastest is always best and that you must get as higher Mv as possible. Your cases might not last long and if you use that load on a hot day your pressures could go through the roof and be dangerous. You need to try various loads and pick the one with least elevation spread at that distance. You could try shooting say at 500/600yds to find the best load with least elevation and then go to 1000yds to test those same loads. As I said, do not fall into the trap of sending your bullets downrange at the speed of light, you do not need to.

When I was testing my Shehane loads, I loaded up in .3 increments and found the load that just started to give signs of bolt lift resistance. I then backed off half a grain from that load and found a load that gave the lowest extreme spread and no difficulty in bolt opening. I then started to move the bullet in or out to fine tune.

Good luck!

Hi TBHG

Thanks for some great info

Think I need to go a lot further with my load development

Will try some 600yrd at bisley soon which should help

Regards

V

 

Two main factors that affect bullet drift are time of flight (a faster bullet is affected less),but also BC,ballistic coefficient-essentially how streamlined the bullet is in flight,and the higher the BC,the less drift.

Given bullets of equal BC,the faster will drift less,but given equal velocity,the higher BC will drift less.

Both factors matter,and their is some interaction-better BC can come from increased weight,which reduces velocity....though bullets of the same calibre and weight can have different BC (shape,essentially).

 

As Les(BHG)says,there are other considerations too-the highest velocity may not be the most accurate,or give best barrel life ,or easiest to shoot (recoil) etc etc. No free lunches.

Gbal

Hi gbal

Again thanks for your help

Have been loading for about 20 years but this is a level all of its own.

Regards

V

[1967spud]

you want to be close to 2950 as there is a nice node there , what es's are you getting

[1967spud]

im having my tea atm but give us a ring if you want later on

[gbal]

Hi TBHG

Thanks for some great info

Think I need to go a lot further with my load development

Will try some 600yrd at bisley soon which should help

Regards

V

By all means but Les is right-all the load fine tuning is like rearranging deck chairs on the Titanic,if your wind reading skills are way behind-and they are for everyone.Rifles/loads/super scopes etc can be bought-wind reading skill can not-but it is far and away the biggest factor-just check out what a 1mph wind reading error-over say 1000yards of variation-will do to a bullet's point of impact.Ypu will see that ultra fine tuning of loads etc is a very poor second consideration,given a reasonably accurate load-that's easy-others have done it,already.But enjoy the ride!

Gbal