Si-Snipe Posted April 10, 2011 Report Share Posted April 10, 2011 Hi guys I am taking the plunge into the Amax world as I feel it will be a more suitable bullet for varminting than the Scenars. I don't want to give up much BC if possible, the V max 95g load is too low BC for the ranges I want to be using them at. So the only other options seems to be 120 or 140g Amax. I am wondering what speed I will get these guys going at. Currently pushing the 123g Scenars out of the 6.5x47 at 3030f/s. Anyone any rough ideas of the speeds I would expect with the 120 and 140 Amax? The 123g A max are prob the best for me but impossibly hard to get a hold of! Cheers, Si Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elwood Posted April 10, 2011 Report Share Posted April 10, 2011 37.2 grains of RL15 got me to 2920 fps with the 120 Amax. My barrel is quite slow so I expect you will make the 3000 fps mark. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Si-Snipe Posted April 10, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 10, 2011 37.2 grains of RL15 got me to 2920 fps with the 120 Amax. My barrel is quite slow so I expect you will make the 3000 fps mark. Thanks Mark What length barrel are you using? I have a 26" on mine. I'm using 38.3g RL15 for the 3030f/s of the 123g Scenars. I might be able to juice them up to 3050+ with more charge but I'll check on how the pressures are with them being different bullets. Si Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elwood Posted April 10, 2011 Report Share Posted April 10, 2011 Thanks Mark What length barrel are you using? I have a 26" on mine. I'm using 38.3g RL15 for the 3030f/s of the 123g Scenars. I might be able to juice them up to 3050+ with more charge but I'll check on how the pressures are with them being different bullets. Si The name is Ian I'm using a 26 inch barrel, but I have never been able to get the velocities or loads that other people achieve, 38.3 grains of RL15 would get me into high pressure. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Si-Snipe Posted April 10, 2011 Author Report Share Posted April 10, 2011 The name is Ian I'm using a 26 inch barrel, but I have never been able to get the velocities or loads that other people achieve, 38.3 grains of RL15 would get me into high pressure. Thanks IAN Have you tried the 95g V max? If so how did they shoot and at what velocities? Si Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Elwood Posted April 10, 2011 Report Share Posted April 10, 2011 Thanks IAN Have you tried the 95g V max? If so how did they shoot and at what velocities? Si I have loaded some 100 gr Noslers today and hope to test them later this week. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest richness Posted April 13, 2011 Report Share Posted April 13, 2011 I got exactly the same speed with the 123s as the 123 scenars, it so happens. I reckon the 120s may go a shade faster if the bearing length is the same. The 140 (PRE RL17) only got to 2700fps which was nowhere near fast enough IMO to make them worthwhile ballistically. I'd be MOST surprised if you get the 140s going at a suitable speed in your 26" tube but i have high hopes for the 120s for you as they should nip along nicely, be good and explosive, accurate and not a million miles off the pace WRT ballistics (and the 6.5x47 can spare a little for what we're doing) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rabbit fingers Posted April 13, 2011 Report Share Posted April 13, 2011 Been using 140 amax in the 47 and getting 2780fps easily with 26" barrel, very accurate with no pressure signs. Sure, it can be pushed harder but the gain is not worth the hammering the brass would take IMO. My go to load if the wind is up a bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest richness Posted April 13, 2011 Report Share Posted April 13, 2011 Been using 140 amax in the 47 and getting 2780fps easily with 26" barrel, very accurate with no pressure signs. Sure, it can be pushed harder but the gain is not worth the hammering the brass would take IMO. My go to load if the wind is up a bit. Hi rabbit fingers The thing is mate, the 123 range of bullets at their higher speed are actually much better through the air than the 140 heads are below 2800. They really need to be up at 2950 to improve on the 120range heads at 3050 where Si has the 123s.... Ah, ballistics - all good fun Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rabbit fingers Posted April 13, 2011 Report Share Posted April 13, 2011 Hi rabbit fingers The thing is mate, the 123 range of bullets at their higher speed are actually much better through the air than the 140 heads are below 2800. They really need to be up at 2950 to improve on the 120range heads at 3050 where Si has the 123s.... Ah, ballistics - all good fun You talking about elevation or windage. If windage I can't say I agree with you. 120 amax @3100 windage at 500yds 17.4" 140 amax @2800 windage at 500yds 15.4" the 120's need to be driven at 3380fps to match the 140's for wind. If you're talking elevation then Yes, the 120's are flatter but do a few extra 1/10's of a mil matter when engaging ranged targets? Windage is the thing that gets me most so I'll take all the BC I can get. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest richness Posted April 13, 2011 Report Share Posted April 13, 2011 You talking about elevation or windage. If windage I can't say I agree with you. 120 amax @3100 windage at 500yds 17.4" 140 amax @2800 windage at 500yds 15.4" the 120's need to be driven at 3380fps to match the 140's for wind. If you're talking elevation then Yes, the 120's are flatter but do a few extra 1/10's of a mil matter when engaging ranged targets? Windage is the thing that gets me most so I'll take all the BC I can get. Cool, i'm sure Si'll find that useful in making his decision. What do 123gr scenars at 3050 and 3130 give you according to that model? Many thanks, Richard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rabbit fingers Posted April 14, 2011 Report Share Posted April 14, 2011 If you use lapua's own data of a G1 BC of .527 with 3050fps @500 windage = 15.4" and at 3130 =14.8" so to beat the 140's at a modest 2800 you have to push the 123's pretty hard. I put the 41.7 rl17 123 scenar load through quickload ( not sure about your oal I used 2.73)it gave a max peak pressure of 65982psi IF you pushed the 140 amax with the same pressure you'd have 2933fps ( I'm NOT recommending it) and a drift at 500 of 14.4" Just as a side note I don't know for sure how lapua and hornady BC's compare in the real world. (I think the hornady BC is an average over maybe 1000yds?) Lapua are a little on the optimistic side in my experience (I use an average BC of .51 with 123 scenars) Would love to know what they really are. anyone? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest richness Posted April 14, 2011 Report Share Posted April 14, 2011 If you use lapua's own data of a G1 BC of .527 with 3050fps @500 windage = 15.4" and at 3130 =14.8" so to beat the 140's at a modest 2800 you have to push the 123's pretty hard. I put the 41.7 rl17 123 scenar load through quickload ( not sure about your oal I used 2.73)it gave a max peak pressure of 65982psi IF you pushed the 140 amax with the same pressure you'd have 2933fps ( I'm NOT recommending it) and a drift at 500 of 14.4" Just as a side note I don't know for sure how lapua and hornady BC's compare in the real world. (I think the hornady BC is an average over maybe 1000yds?) Lapua are a little on the optimistic side in my experience (I use an average BC of .51 with 123 scenars) Would love to know what they really are. anyone? You know, i had it all the wrong way round rabbit fingers. I was sure that the 123s pushed fast took a lot of beating by the 140s but 2800 is really not too hard. I'm glad you stepped in because i must have read my figures wrong and have been advising Si the wrong way. I may in fact try shoving my 140 amax with RL17 up toward 2950 where they should be pretty sueful. Many thanks, Richard FYI i use a BC of G7 .280 for 123gr scenars in my calculator and it matches my empirical figures well mate Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rabbit fingers Posted April 14, 2011 Report Share Posted April 14, 2011 FYI i use a BC of G7 .280 for 123gr scenars in my calculator and it matches my empirical figures well mate My field calculator is G1 only what do you use that accepts the G7 BC's? cheers Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest richness Posted April 14, 2011 Report Share Posted April 14, 2011 My field calculator is G1 only what do you use that accepts the G7 BC's? cheers I use BulletFlight for iphone4 mate. Like others i've used, it takes liberties around the primary zero area where things are crossing rapidly (not that that is very much of a problem) and only really is trustworthy until about 650y but it is really excellent for helping dope the wind. I find the G7 calcs using that BC matches my observed figures very well. Si uses G1 and his calculator seems better than mine (don't know what type it is) and seems glued to his observed figures all the way out.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest richness Posted April 14, 2011 Report Share Posted April 14, 2011 You talking about elevation or windage. If windage I can't say I agree with you. 120 amax @3100 windage at 500yds 17.4" 140 amax @2800 windage at 500yds 15.4" the 120's need to be driven at 3380fps to match the 140's for wind. If you're talking elevation then Yes, the 120's are flatter but do a few extra 1/10's of a mil matter when engaging ranged targets? Windage is the thing that gets me most so I'll take all the BC I can get. You know, i've just checked my figures for 140 amax all the way up at 2950 and they don't beat 123scenars at 3130fps for me? I know i was previously backtracking but now i'm not sure what's going on lol My calculator gives me: 6.6moa drop and 2,5windage for the 3130fps scenars and 7.7moa and 2.6windage for the 140 amax at 2950fps. 10mphfrom 3o'clock and 500y Hence my previous argument.... I'm using .280 G7 for the scenars (which i find best as i've said) and .585 G1 for the amax140s. Oh well, the thing for me to do is load up some rl17/140amax as fast as they're accurate and see how they go downrange in the real world....I'll report back sometime mate! Richard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rabbit fingers Posted April 14, 2011 Report Share Posted April 14, 2011 Interesting. don't know what's going on there. Let us know how you get on. Just looked it up. Lapua give the G7 BC as 0.263 how did you arrive at 0.28, are you pointing them? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest richness Posted April 16, 2011 Report Share Posted April 16, 2011 WELL rabbit fingers....After you advising me that the 140gr AMAX have a better BC than i thought, i made up some test powder weights with RL17 as i had some on the shelf from previous testing with RL15, and went to the range. I already knew the seating depth so i just checked the powder charge. 39-40.1gr tested. Only at 100y. All sub .5 moa but 40.1 very nearly single hole so i built remaining 18up for rabbits today to test expansion vs Scenars. They chono'd at 2930 which was grand. Pressures absolutely no problem; i'm sure i could go higher but they were accurate so I didn't go mad. Well sweet j3sus there is no problem with the expansion. We had some rabbits thoroughly and impressively blown apart at range, which is great as shots possibly caught by the wind so as to make them sub-optimal in their placement are now much more lethal than the Scenars can provide without a ballistic or accuracy downside. On that note, the 500y wind clicks needed seemed inseparable from my very fast 3130fps 123gr Scenar load, which has me very happy. I now have a much more explosive load without the ballistic hit that i feared. Thanks for the valuable info, Richard Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rabbit fingers Posted April 16, 2011 Report Share Posted April 16, 2011 Great stuff. Thanks for the update. Glad it worked out for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
terryh Posted April 17, 2011 Report Share Posted April 17, 2011 Gents, Also found a sweet spot for R15/123g Scanars at 37.5g, 2900+ from memory, 25" 5C barrel. Also comfortably cleared 2830fps with the R17/139g Scanars. If you're looking for good ballistic info on Scanars you can downloed for free radar derived perfomance from the Lapua site here: http://www.lapua.com/en/customer-center/lapua-ballistics/download-lapua-edition.html along with a program to use it. hope this helps? T Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pgs Posted May 6, 2011 Report Share Posted May 6, 2011 Hi guys I have worked up a good load in my 6.5x47 with 140vld hunting & RL17 I use cci 450 primers 40grians RL17 in a Krieger 30in barrel gets me 2800fps. This load shoots well at 1000yrds Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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