HORNET OR K HORNET ?

[devon flighter]

HI

Just joined the site and first post ! i am about to buy an anshutz hornet and have been reading about the k hornet and its really got me thinking about getting it k'd ,i know its not a GREAT increase in velocity but i like the idea of extended case life "and if im honest i like something slightly different as well !",what are the other benefits if any ?and does anyone have any idea about costs to get the conversion done ? or the possibility of getting a reamer and doing the work myself including any likely problems i am likely to encounter ,i have read that its fairly straight forward to do with a bit of care! has anyone gone down this root of doing the work themselves or is it best left to a smith? are there any other suppliers of reamers other than midway in the uk ?

I shot a standard hornet 15 years back with factory fodder which was ok "just !" but now with hand loading i am hopping for better results accuracy wise

THANKS IN ADVANCE FOR THE REPLY'S

 

ALL THE BEST

D F

[Alycidon]

Hi and welcome to the site;

 

I dont think making it into a K hornet will improve accuracy, Anshultz make a nice rifle, just use it as it is and play about with the loads.

 

If you do go down the K route you will need a 1 for 1 variation as this is considered a caliber change by most forces, at least one RFD of my acquaintance has been in deep water for Ackley ising a Hornet. It would also have to go for reproof.

 

A

[devon flighter]

Hi and welcome to the site;

 

I dont think making it into a K hornet will improve accuracy, Anshultz make a nice rifle, just use it as it is and play about with the loads.

 

If you do go down the K route you will need a 1 for 1 variation as this is considered a caliber change by most forces, at least one RFD of my acquaintance has been in deep water for Ackley ising a Hornet. It would also have to go for reproof.

 

A

 

CHEERS A im in devon and speaking to d&c they are ok "AS IS" as its the same calibre and can still fire factory ammunition ! im aware of the reproof but i have heard of some people saying its ok as its such a small amount removed from the chamber and only reproof to sell/transfer .Was the mentioned rfd in it for not re proofing or doing the work and reproofing ? not expecting any better accuracy over the standard hornet just a bit more velocity and better case life as i understand the cases stretch quite a bit with the standard hornet .

 

ATB DF

[devon flighter]

Hi and welcome to the site;

 

I dont think making it into a K hornet will improve accuracy, Anshultz make a nice rifle, just use it as it is and play about with the loads.

 

If you do go down the K route you will need a 1 for 1 variation as this is considered a caliber change by most forces, at least one RFD of my acquaintance has been in deep water for Ackley ising a Hornet. It would also have to go for reproof.

 

A

 

CHEERS A im in devon and speaking to d&c they are ok "AS IS" as its the same calibre and can still fire factory ammunition ! im aware of the reproof but i have heard of some people saying its ok as its such a small amount removed from the chamber and only reproof to sell/transfer .Was the mentioned rfd in it for not re proofing or doing the work and reproofing ?

ATB DF

[Andrew]

CHEERS A im in devon and speaking to d&c they are ok "AS IS" as its the same calibre and can still fire factory ammunition ! im aware of the reproof but i have heard of some people saying its ok as its such a small amount removed from the chamber and only reproof to sell/transfer .Was the mentioned rfd in it for not re proofing or doing the work and reproofing ?

ATB DF

I was not pleased with my Anschutz. The chamber dimensions seemed generous, to say the least. I would certainly not "K" that particular rifle. Every CZ I have shot out grouped my Anschutz and I now own a CZ 527 American.

 

K it if you wish, but load a Hornet intelligently and you will have a fine rifle as it is. My son and I regularly kill prairiedogs at 200+ yards with ours.~Andrew

[devon flighter]

I was not pleased with my Anschutz. The chamber dimensions seemed generous, to say the least. I would certainly not "K" that particular rifle. Every CZ I have shot out grouped my Anschutz and I now own a CZ 527 American.

 

K it if you wish, but load a Hornet intelligently and you will have a fine rifle as it is. My son and I regularly kill prairiedogs at 200+ yards with ours.~Andrew

 

hi andrew

thanks for the info ,what started all this off was i gave up shooting 14 years ago when we moved to devon from scotland, and about a couple of years ago the bug came back with a vengence to say the least !

NOW HERES THE RUB !!!! i have started stalking again and the last time i was up scotland staying with a dealer friend "HE HAD MY OLD HORNET SITTING ON HIS SHELF ,a bruno" along with an anshutz, now the old bruno served me well to say the least ! and initial reaction was to get " my old buddy back and re live some of the old times again !!!" ,but the anshutz was like new and really drew me to it ( i must say my bruno had a pretty hard life, mostly down to me ! and shall we say is in need of a bit of tlc lol) so given the reputation that anshutz have generally ( i have an annie rimfire and very pleased) i seriously considered that as an option ,given what you have said though its making it hard not to bring my "OLD BUDDY back home " which i must add has no issues with accuracy with factory fodder and was my initial reaction !

there will be no need to convince me of the merrits of a hornet i am already a convert and for what i want it for this time around it is ideal ! but it would be good on a personal note to be able to better the accuracy with factory rounds that i used to achieve ! i shoot a 25-06 for the long range stuff and have worked up a couple of decent loads for that so eventually hope to do the same for the hornet "WHICH EVER ONE I END UP WITH !!though deep down i have a suspicious feeling where this will end up now "

[Andrew]

hi andrew

thanks for the info ,what started all this off was i gave up shooting 14 years ago when we moved to devon from scotland, and about a couple of years ago the bug came back with a vengence to say the least !

NOW HERES THE RUB !!!! i have started stalking again and the last time i was up scotland staying with a dealer friend "HE HAD MY OLD HORNET SITTING ON HIS SHELF ,a bruno" along with an anshutz, now the old bruno served me well to say the least ! and initial reaction was to get " my old buddy back and re live some of the old times again !!!" ,but the anshutz was like new and really drew me to it ( i must say my bruno had a pretty hard life, mostly down to me ! and shall we say is in need of a bit of tlc lol) so given the reputation that anshutz have generally ( i have an annie rimfire and very pleased) i seriously considered that as an option ,given what you have said though its making it hard not to bring my "OLD BUDDY back home " which i must add has no issues with accuracy with factory fodder and was my initial reaction !

there will be no need to convince me of the merrits of a hornet i am already a convert and for what i want it for this time around it is ideal ! but it would be good on a personal note to be able to better the accuracy with factory rounds that i used to achieve ! i shoot a 25-06 for the long range stuff and have worked up a couple of decent loads for that so eventually hope to do the same for the hornet "WHICH EVER ONE I END UP WITH !!though deep down i have a suspicious feeling where this will end up now "

 

A good friend of mine in Scotland has a Brno Hornet dated 1949 that is one shooting SOB. I have often said that when he dies I will steal his wife and his Brno but not necessarily in that order!

 

As I said, the Anny I had shot OK but nothing like the CZ, and nothing like my buddy's '49 Brno. The rear locking lugs I didn't appreciate, and the generous chamber made reloading a chore. By comparison, the CZ spits out brass looking relatively unfired. I love loading the Hornet and shoot 1000 rounds a year or so. Marine PMI (of this site) and I have worked up a dandy loading technique that you can find outlined here with a search. If you can't find it, PM me and I'll pass it on if you wish it.I wish I could insert a video of my son taking a prairiedog in the head at 150 yards, leaning against a fence post, in a cross wind. Makes you appreciate what a good Hornet can do in the hands of someone who has learned their load and gun. ~Andrew

[devon flighter]

A good friend of mine in Scotland has a Brno Hornet dated 1949 that is one shooting SOB. I have often said that when he dies I will steal his wife and his Brno but not necessarily in that order!

 

As I said, the Anny I had shot OK but nothing like the CZ, and nothing like my buddy's '49 Brno. The rear locking lugs I didn't appreciate, and the generous chamber made reloading a chore. By comparison, the CZ spits out brass looking relatively unfired. I love loading the Hornet and shoot 1000 rounds a year or so. Marine PMI (of this site) and I have worked up a dandy loading technique that you can find outlined here with a search. If you can't find it, PM me and I'll pass it on if you wish it.I wish I could insert a video of my son taking a prairiedog in the head at 150 yards, leaning against a fence post, in a cross wind. Makes you appreciate what a good Hornet can do in the hands of someone who has learned their load and gun. ~Andrew

 

ANDREW I have just got off the phone to my friend in scotland 9-30pm "AND I HOLD YOU FULLY REPONSIBLE :D !!!!" i have just aggreed to take my baby back , i now own AGAIN my old brno hornet rough as a badgers and built like a brick out house ,it will need a stock refinish and a good tidy up all over ,i will take a few pics when i pick it up mid feb of before and after ,i recon i will leave the chamber AS IS !! for the time being and see how i get on .i will search for your loading technique andrew !

[Andrew]

ANDREW I have just got off the phone to my friend in scotland 9-30pm "AND I HOLD YOU FULLY REPONSIBLE :D !!!!" i have just aggreed to take my baby back , i now own AGAIN my old brno hornet rough as a badgers and built like a brick out house ,it will need a stock refinish and a good tidy up all over ,i will take a few pics when i pick it up mid feb of before and after ,i recon i will leave the chamber AS IS !! for the time being and see how i get on .i will search for your loading technique andrew !

 

Uh-oh... Well,The only interesting rifle is an accurate (and well used, if I might add)rifle. Glad you are happy. There is nothing like getting an old friend back into the fold. Send me photos. I like nicked and scratched rifles. Every bump and gouge is a story of a hunt: Badges of Honor if you ask me. I have no use for gun safe princesses!

 

Unlike my beloved CZ, you will be able to load 40 grain V-Max, my buddy's favorite Hornet fodder.

 

If the search proves too tiring, drop me a PM and I'll be glad to detail it afresh. There was a lengthy discussion on this last spring, IIRC.~Andrew

[baldie]

CHEERS A im in devon and speaking to d&c they are ok "AS IS" as its the same calibre and can still fire factory ammunition ! im aware of the reproof but i have heard of some people saying its ok as its such a small amount removed from the chamber and only reproof to sell/transfer .Was the mentioned rfd in it for not re proofing or doing the work and reproofing ?

ATB DF

 

If you alter the chamber of ANY rifle or shotgun, IT MUST BE REPROOFED BY LAW. Ignore any idiot who tells you otherwise.

 

I know it goes on, and woe betide anyone who gets caught, because they have committed a string of offences. We are not talking about screwcutting a barrel here. You have materially altered the part of a gun that is subject to the highest pressure.

 

1. Altered the chamber without reproofing, will not be stamped as the new cartridge, thus leaving any potential new owner not knowing what they have.

2.Any rfd letting you take such a gun away has committed the offence of passing a gun on which is out of proof.

 

These offences are absolute, and carry minimum, mandatory penalties.

 

Most forces issue a ticket with the calibre on it, say .22 - 250. You can buy a 22-250 Ackley improved legally. The ticket states the calibre legally, not the cartridge. This is why you can push your force to issue a ticket for a 6mm. I did, and bought a .243, but i could just as easily have bought a 6br. They dont like doing it, but its the law.

[Guest tisme]

Gald you've got the CZ back. I have one and love it. I load with 35gr v max and 13grs of li'l gun. Shoots sweet as.

I would love to know what others are loading with.

 

Pete

[Andrew]

Lets try this. This is a head shot on a prairiedog in a gusty cross wind using a CZ Hornet and a 35 grain V Max over 13.5 of Lil Gun. The only rest was leaning against the fence post. If you use the Hornet quite a bit, you find the trajectory pretty predictable.~Andrew

 

Ah heck. That didn't work. I'll keep trying......

[devon flighter]

Uh-oh... Well,The only interesting rifle is an accurate (and well used, if I might add)rifle. Glad you are happy. There is nothing like getting an old friend back into the fold. Send me photos. I like nicked and scratched rifles. Every bump and gouge is a story of a hunt: Badges of Honor if you ask me. I have no use for gun safe princesses!

 

Unlike my beloved CZ, you will be able to load 40 grain V-Max, my buddy's favorite Hornet fodder.

 

If the search proves too tiring, drop me a PM and I'll be glad to detail it afresh. There was a lengthy discussion on this last spring, IIRC.~Andrew

 

your right about every bump and gouge though they do tell a story ,it used to be a work tool !!( it still has the hole i drilled through the forend to mount the lamp on ) but feel if "no WHEN she come home" she deserves a better retirement!

 

hopefully i will be using lill gun as it seems to be the "GO TO POWDER" for the hornet ,thats if i can get my hands on any down in the south west, it seems to be a bit scarce on the ground at the moment ! it would be good it it did work ok with the 40g v max especially if its as good in the hornet as other calibers,i use the 75g vmax in the .25-06 and its devastating on charlie way out !ANDREW what dies do you use ?i picked up you crimp, and case trim for EVERY reload ! do you get many loads from each case? what,s your recommended brand of primers with lill gun ? if you could post or pm the link it would be good ive found some of your posts but just to be sure ive not missed any THANKS FOR THE ENCOURAGEMENT .

[Andrew]

your right about every bump and gouge though they do tell a story ,it used to be a work tool !!( it still has the hole i drilled through the forend to mount the lamp on ) but feel if "no WHEN she come home" she deserves a better retirement!

 

hopefully i will be using lill gun as it seems to be the "GO TO POWDER" for the hornet ,thats if i can get my hands on any down in the south west, it seems to be a bit scarce on the ground at the moment ! it would be good it it did work ok with the 40g v max especially if its as good in the hornet as other calibers,i use the 75g vmax in the .25-06 and its devastating on charlie way out !ANDREW what dies do you use ?i picked up you crimp, and case trim for EVERY reload ! do you get many loads from each case? what,s your recommended brand of primers with lill gun ? if you could post or pm the link it would be good ive found some of your posts but just to be sure ive not missed any THANKS FOR THE ENCOURAGEMENT .

 

I use Lee Collet Dies for the most part. I like them: no lube, no fuss. I use the Lee cutter/trimmer set up to insure that the length is always the same. I trim at every loading with the Lee unit because it's fast. A quick twist and it either cuts or not depending on the length. The idea is consistency with good Hornet loads and if you crimp, you need consistent lengths.

 

I use a very accurate Belding and Mull powder measure to meter the powder and use a Lee Factory Crimp Die to put a light crimp on the case mouth. The crimp is one of the best accuracy aids I have found with the Hornet.

 

For primers I use Federal or CCI Small Pistol Primers. Another group shrinker.

 

Now, when it comes to powder metering and Lil Gun. I use a very accurate measure, as I have stated, but I have a rancher friend who loads 400 rounds of Hornet for his pretty wife every month, along with the extensive reloading he does for himself. To cut time, he simply scoops the primed case full of Lil Gun, taps it hard on the counter to settle the powder, and seats the bullet. His wife probably kills as many prairiedogs as I do and she demands accurate loads. I'm not saying I would do it, but the technique works, evidently. This anecdote is offered up to dissuade you from weighing each charge with Lil Gun. A powder measure will be close enough.

 

I get about 10 reloads using Lil Gun. The pressures are so low that the brass work hardens before it wears out. This is in my CZ which has a superb chamber. ~Andrew

[devon flighter]

I use Lee Collet Dies for the most part. I like them: no lube, no fuss. I use the Lee cutter/trimmer set up to insure that the length is always the same. I trim at every loading with the Lee unit because it's fast. A quick twist and it either cuts or not depending on the length. The idea is consistency with good Hornet loads and if you crimp, you need consistent lengths.

 

I use a very accurate Belding and Mull powder measure to meter the powder and use a Lee Factory Crimp Die to put a light crimp on the case mouth. The crimp is one of the best accuracy aids I have found with the Hornet.

 

For primers I use Federal or CCI Small Pistol Primers. Another group shrinker.

 

Now, when it comes to powder metering and Lil Gun. I use a very accurate measure, as I have stated, but I have a rancher friend who loads 400 rounds of Hornet for his pretty wife every month, along with the extensive reloading he does for himself. To cut time, he simply scoops the primed case full of Lil Gun, taps it hard on the counter to settle the powder, and seats the bullet. His wife probably kills as many prairiedogs as I do and she demands accurate loads. I'm not saying I would do it, but the technique works, evidently. This anecdote is offered up to dissuade you from weighing each charge with Lil Gun. A powder measure will be close enough.

 

I get about 10 reloads using Lil Gun. The pressures are so low that the brass work hardens before it wears out. This is in my CZ which has a superb chamber. ~Andrew

 

THANKS FOR THAT ANDREW ,that's the information i came across with the search so good to know i haven't missed anything ! i weigh ALL powder for the other loads that i put together so i will do the same for the hornet to start with ,as i have usually enough time between outings to load whats required but i will certainly experiment later on with a powder measure , i use lee dies for the others so i will start the same with the hornet.10 loads will do me if i can achieve that ! do you ever anneal the brass when it hardens ? i know its cheap enough but just a thought !( talk about tight ! i spent MANY VERY HAPPY living years in scotland and dearly want to return ! trust me they are AMATURES ON TIGHTNESS compared to me :lol: )

[Andrew]

No. I don't anneal. I think that by the time it gets to the stage where the necks are work hardening from a collet die, the brass has done enough work and gets dumped. I cycle my brass about once every 10 months.

 

You are welcome to weigh each charge of Lil Gun (How did I know?! You UK guys have a passion for weighing powder) but you would do well to fashion a scoop from an old cartridge case and simply scoop the powder from a dish, scrape it level with a card edge, and pour. It is simply a monumental waste of time to weigh charges of Lil Gun. If you want to ride the ragged edge of MAX with H-110 (or Winchester 296, identical powder)sure, weigh, but Lil Gun spares this you for other more worthwhile activities.~Andrew

[Guest tisme]

Loaded a few this morning and with 13.5 grs, they are very full cases.I can see why some just scope the case full.

Some of the bullets would not quite seat at 1.775" because they were so full.

 

Pete

[devon flighter]

andrew pete and others does it make much difference how far off the lands with lill gun or do you just load to std ?

[Andrew]

andrew pete and others does it make much difference how far off the lands with lill gun or do you just load to std ?

 

My CZ has a generous throat when compared to the available OAL the magazine allows for. it still shoots tiny groups using the method outlined.~Andrew