Guest stalkerstwo Posted March 12, 2008 Report Share Posted March 12, 2008 Hi all I'm sorry to start my first post on such a sour note but its something that gets all our backs up and thats finding someone one our patch. I've got some stalking at a place called horrington just outside wells and three weeks ago i found two lads shooting it, they were as supprised as me as they had written permission from a bristol stalker who I've never heard of, whats more annoying is that a few weeks previous thse lads had found two welsh guys on the same land who had permission from the same stalker. I am now at a loss as to what to do I don't know how many people are on the land and in my opinion stalking the area has now become dangerous any of you guys stalking this area please pm me, Kindest Regards Paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wsm Posted March 12, 2008 Report Share Posted March 12, 2008 Stalkerstwo Welcome to the site first off I spend quite a bit of time in your part of Somerset and I`m always amazed at the cut throat tactics that I hear happening all the time Unfortunately this seems to be more and more common especially in good Roe Buck country The only thing you can do is to live on the place and find out this guys contact details from anyone else you might bump into Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenbear Posted March 12, 2008 Report Share Posted March 12, 2008 Hi Stalkerstwo, welcome!! You may like to look at another thread currently running that has mentioned a certain Bristol stalker! Kind regards GB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mack Posted March 12, 2008 Report Share Posted March 12, 2008 Who has the Shooting rights to the land? I assume that you obtained permission from this person? They will ultimately be able to tell you who is allowed to shoot there. If someone else has recently purchased the shooting rights you will have to check your own lawful right to be there. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tikka3006 Posted March 12, 2008 Report Share Posted March 12, 2008 Hi mate small world in shooting I think I'm the guy you met, it appears that Andy Payne sold me the shooting rights in the full knowledge that there were other people shooting there also he double sold the rights to another two lads from llanbradach shooting club, even before we met they had suspicions as he would come up with excuses as to why they could'nt shoot on certain days, some of the days tied up with mine others did not tie up with our shooting dates so we too have our suspicions. Pm me and I'll tell you everything I know Good Hunting Rgds Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orka Akinse Posted March 12, 2008 Report Share Posted March 12, 2008 S2 This happens; however all is not lost. Firstly speak to the landowner to confirm if he has indeed sold the rights to others or indeed check your paperwork to see if you have the shooting rights, there is a world of difference between permission to shoot and shooting rights. The landowner may not hold the shooting rights, it is not necessisarilly the case that the landowner also has the shooting rights. If you have the shooting rights then anyone else is in breach of the law and must leave or face prosecution for armed trespass. If you have paid for whatever you have and your still not happy then insist on a refund, if you just have permission with no payment and you feel it is unsafe then pack up and move on and leave them to it and chalk it up to experience. The same advice goes to Tikka3006. Avoids arguements and favouritism on the forum. You might also want to confirm from those that have, or say they own, not have, (there is a legal difference) the shooting rights that they do ineed have them and the rights conferred in the wording allows them to sub-contract or sub-let those rights to a third party. Sadly the term shooting rights is often misconstrued in a lot of cases. The term "Shooting rights" confers legal privilege and not just permission as is often the case. Happy to discuss further if you wish. Good luck to you all. OA Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charly hunter Posted March 13, 2008 Report Share Posted March 13, 2008 If I were in your possision I'd start by checking with the land owner if he has the shooting rights, if he has them then ask if he has given permission to this person who is giving others the green light to go on that land, if he has not then I would go about the place a put up some notices (simple A4 paper laminated) Stating that this person has no authority to give permission to anyone to shoot on the land and that those caught may well be prosicuted. You would only have to put up a few just out of reach so that they can not be pulled down, and in the areas where they park up. And the threat of being done for armed trespass should be enough for most folks wishing to keep the FAC's to go home. (don't put these up though if he has sold the rights) Failing that if the land owner has sold this person the rights, then as Orka Akinse said cut your loses and move on. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stag1933 Posted March 13, 2008 Report Share Posted March 13, 2008 Law was generally based on common-sense, a word which has been partially banned today as so few people seem to apply it. You may have shooting rights but so may others on the same area. The important word hitherto unmentioned is SOLE shooting rights. HWH. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest wireviz Posted March 13, 2008 Report Share Posted March 13, 2008 [There is no law against putting any number of people on the ground, Andy Payne is a comercial stalking agent and there fore tries to get maximum return on his ground .If he has said there are others on then whats the problem .If it were me i would have had it sorted before i took on the shooting . Get your self out as offten as you can and make sure you get value for money . Hope you get it sorted .PS Andy has done stuff like this before and sorted it out when he was caught ps nice to be back after my exile and my duffel coats off and i am ready to go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Orka Akinse Posted March 13, 2008 Report Share Posted March 13, 2008 [There is no law against putting any number of people on the ground There is if he hasn't got the legal right to do so and that is what is being advised to sort out. Andy has done stuff like this before and sorted it out when he was caught Sounds like a true gent Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
tikka3006 Posted March 13, 2008 Report Share Posted March 13, 2008 [There is no law against putting any number of people on the ground There is if he hasn't got the legal right to do so and that is what is being advised to sort out. Andyhas done stuff like this before and sorted it out when he was caught Sounds like a true gent Actually he's done this to me and my mate before and we had to take him to court to recover the money, this patch of ground was to be insted of payement, he assured me he had the stalking rights on the land, we walked the boundery and he signed the agreement, I cannot say too much about it at the moment as there may be legal implications, but it appears the man has sold sole stalking rights to a piece of land to at least 4 people. I've emailed stalkers two and given him the details of the two guys I found on the land and I'm very grateful for all the advice you guys have given me I don't want to hijack this thread but I have had experience of this before so if any of you guys have had any dealings with Mr Payne or have paid for stalking rights on horrington hill pm stalker two and carry on as now with a clean informative thread Rgds Ian Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest wireviz Posted March 14, 2008 Report Share Posted March 14, 2008 Has anyone been and seen the actual land owner , If he has given the shooting rights toAndy Payne then i am sure he would be interested to know how many times this ground has been past on and how much money has change hands .Looks like you got your shooting for free at some one elses expence .Always a trade off and never a looser. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenbear Posted March 15, 2008 Report Share Posted March 15, 2008 Has anyone been and seen the actual land owner , If he has given the shooting rights to Mr Payne then i am sure he would be interested to know how many times this ground has been past on and how much money has change hands .Looks like you got your shooting for free at some one elses expence .Always a trade off and never a looser. wirviz it looks like your batting in Mr Paynes corner!!!! I have been conned by Mr Payne twice, the second time he did whilst attemting to repay his CCJ, Mr Payne would not know the truth if it jumped up and bit him on the hand, he is a deceitful arrogant bully who feels he can imtimidate people out of their cash - If you are intent on defending Mr Payne make sure you have all the facts to hand, I have had nothing for nothing, the last straw was 5 rifles on 180 acres of land all shooting at the same time. Now before anyone feels I am being unfair, I can 100% explain and prove Mr Payne deceipt, I have taken him to court once and won and am now contemplating doing it again, he is a real danger to the public and stalkers, he has no morals to guide him and will think nothing of taking your money whilst putting your and your firearms licence in danger. This thread should be pinned as a public service message - be very aware. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest wireviz Posted March 15, 2008 Report Share Posted March 15, 2008 Green bear i don't bat for no one and certainly not for some one who rips people off .But it dose seem strange that some on here can comment on peoples bad activities .While other meaning me mention it and get there posts pulled. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest stalkerstwo Posted March 15, 2008 Report Share Posted March 15, 2008 Thanks to all concerened for their advice, I am quite aware of the legalities of this issue and these are being delt with, what I was hoping is that a forum may be the place to find anyone who are now or who have been in the past shooting over horrington hill. this is not a witch hunt and all info will be treated in confidence, I am aware of what has happened to green bear and tikka3006 and the info you sent me and your cooperation is much appreciated and yes the bristol stalker I mentioned at the start of the thread is Andy Payne wireviz I have no Idea why your post was pulled but anyone who highlights bad or dangerous practices should be commended. Please dont drag this into a slanging match but all truthfull information will be welcome kindest Regards Paul Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenbear Posted March 16, 2008 Report Share Posted March 16, 2008 Green bear i don't bat for no one and certainly not for some one who rips people off .But it dose seem strange that some on here can comment on peoples bad activities .While other meaning me mention it and get there posts pulled. Sorry mate, I mean nothing personally, I am just so fed up with this man and others like him getting away with activities that could ruin our sport. I apologise if I jumped the gun no pun intended. GB Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alycidon Posted March 16, 2008 Report Share Posted March 16, 2008 I have always got on with him OK but only bought by the day, he treated me fairly. A Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenbear Posted March 16, 2008 Report Share Posted March 16, 2008 Kip I honestly can't understand why you felt the need to delete his name, you are taking the right of open and honest speach from this forum - I have every scrap of evidence to prove my statements court documents as well so it was not a malicious lie. This is a stalking forum and the man preys of new and inexperienced stalkers you have now opened this man back up to these people by deleteing his name. I understand Alicydon that he put you on your first buck, he may have treated you correctly - just one question are you 100% positive that the land you shot over was his to shoot? I have had many discussion with you on this and another forum and respect your opinion and bear you no ill feeling or disrespect so please do not take that statement for anything other than what it is. Kip - This man continues to do what he does because everybody turns a blind eye, the it's nothing to do with me syndrome or the agh well he caught me this time I won't go there again. These forums have a responsibility (to themselves) as well as to the people they represent and I feel you have taken the very easy option as I now of at least three people connected to this site that have been hard done by the man - think about; that such a small proportion of the stalking community and he has wronged three that I am aware of. I will not coninue to harrangue you over this but please feel free to pm if you will over your decision. cheers Gb Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest wireviz Posted March 16, 2008 Report Share Posted March 16, 2008 Kip i did not want peoples posts pulled i wanted mine left on .But if Andy PAYNE Has ripped people off then we should all know about it.Geoff has had a good time with Andy and was able to put that up on all the sites so if some one has been wrong that should also go up .That should keep anyone that deals with the shooting public on there toes so to speak Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kip270 Posted March 17, 2008 Report Share Posted March 17, 2008 All posts have been edited to there original version. If people have had first hand experience then fine, but what we do not want is anyone saying a friend of a friend who knows someone has had the same thing etc. Thankyou for your understanding in this matter. The Moderating Team Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest vim Posted March 17, 2008 Report Share Posted March 17, 2008 It looks like a personal attack on Mr Payne to me and if it were anyone else it would`nt be tolerated. Im suprised at the Moderator`s for allowing it Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wsm Posted March 17, 2008 Report Share Posted March 17, 2008 As Kip says we`re quite happy for this thread to continue but please remember only post what you could substantiate in a court of law if the need arose Thanks Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
col48 Posted March 17, 2008 Report Share Posted March 17, 2008 It looks like a personal attack on Mr Payne to me and if it were anyone else it would`nt be tolerated. Im suprised at the Moderator`s for allowing it hi vim we are under new management now, so its up to them what can and can not be said. ATB Colin Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Greenbear Posted March 17, 2008 Report Share Posted March 17, 2008 Gents - Please, lets not turn this thread into a political row with the moderating team. I have said my piece, the trouble is it now looks as if people want to turn it into p*****g contest, I would rather have it pulled than spoiled. Its an important issue, so please pm the moderating team if you would like it pulled Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest stalkerstwo Posted March 22, 2008 Report Share Posted March 22, 2008 I only started this thread as I thought a forum would be the place where many stalkers congrigated and I would be able to get the info I needed, I am grateful for the advice many of you have given me but I fear that the thread has taken a different course to the one intended. I am new here and would not want you to get the wrong idea of my intentions, I therefore respectfully ask the mods to either pull or lock this thread Regards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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