craigyboy Posted July 5, 2007 Report Share Posted July 5, 2007 I had planned to go out lamping with a good friend last night as I had been on this ground with the air rifle 2 weeks previous and seen a few foxes around. It rained off and on all day at work so wasnt sure if we would get out, but I checked the metcheck and it said no rain in my area the rest of the night so I took the chance and packed up my gear and headed out. We put the torch on the first field before we even got out of the farm yard and got a pair of eyes straight away, settled in and took the shot at about 120 yards. It was a young vixen, hit her right centre of the lower neck, we scanned the rest of the fields from where we sat and there was another 2 foxes the furthest away was about 240 yards and this was a fox that has been giving us the slip for ages (years), the closer one was about 160 yards but looking out from a bit of a bramble pile, I could clearly confirm it was a fox but against my better judgment I took the shot even though his body was very well covered and missed the bugger, like the rest of us I hate missing, ill probably not forget that one for a few months. I shot this vixen using 39g blitzings, I was surprised to find an exit wound, though only slight, it was quite alot of tissue for a ballistic tip to penetrate. This next one we spotted in a recently cut silage field, he was about 200 yards away but the shot wasnt all that safe so we tried to call him in to a better position but he ended up going the opposite direction we wanted and sat looking at us on top of a little rock so we had to take the chance and try and change position to get a good safe shot, we managed to move into about 150 yards and everything was right he stood up broadside, I thought just before I pulled the trigger that he looked big, on closer inspection after the shot he was a big dog fox maybe 5 years old, his teeth were very worn and he was a bit of a monster probably the bigest I have ever shot, happy with this boy as I would say he was the one hammering the farmers bantam collection over the years. This one was also shot with 39g blitzking and agin showed an exit hole, I havent experienced this with the 32g v-max on foxes it usually penetrates and does all the damge inside and doesnt exit and to be honest even though I dont take a shot until I am sure its perfect safe I like to know the bullets dont travel any further than the what i hit, I may have to go back to 32g vmaxes there just as accurate as the 39g but I thought the heavier bullet was better for foxing but now I aint so sure as they both still kill equally well, the 32g just doesnt exit but also seems to do alot more damage on the inside, when you lift a fox after its hit with a 32g v-max it just sounds like its full of water. The 39g blitzking does do this abit but nowhere near to the extent of the 32g vmax. Also saw these two lads on the way down. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest 308Panther Posted July 6, 2007 Report Share Posted July 6, 2007 Not a bad nights work at all... See yours are in velvet as well as ours... Dad got a pic of one that looks like it is gonna be an awesome trophy.... and hopefully I get a shot at it this fall....but velvet always makes the whitetail look so much bigger....so its gonna be a wait and see. Only 54 more days till the very first of our huntin season opens up.... And that would actually be 2 seasons openin on Sept 1st... Dove and the Early Canadian Goose seasons. Yes,its gotten to the point I am actually counting the days... I will be soooo happy to pull a trigger rather than to toss flies or lures... 308Panther Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cooperman223 Posted July 6, 2007 Report Share Posted July 6, 2007 Well done craig, good shooting and nice photos, glad someone can get out, we have had so much rain here im starting to get webbed feet Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
foxshot Posted July 6, 2007 Report Share Posted July 6, 2007 Know how you feel cooperman weather is crap,nice shooting craigyboy the missed shots are soon forgoten especialy if you pull of a good shot Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
varminter Posted July 6, 2007 Report Share Posted July 6, 2007 Good hunting there craigyboy ;) All the best............ RAY................... ;) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charly hunter Posted July 6, 2007 Report Share Posted July 6, 2007 Nice going pard, got out myself last night and managed this cub but I did see another one that I could have shot but I decided not to have ago as there were a few brambles in front of it, so I left it hoping it would come out of the woods but instead it went on through them I was supprised that these guys are out on there own as they are not so big. Out today with my mate Doug and we both had our personal bests, Doug's 283yds and mine was 210yds, I know it's not as far as you guys do shoot but that is a long way for me and with Doug's rifle also Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dogfox Posted July 6, 2007 Report Share Posted July 6, 2007 Well done and a very good night lamping. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
riflemanread Posted July 6, 2007 Report Share Posted July 6, 2007 Nice shooting there lads,and a very good photo of the deer craig Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finman Posted July 9, 2007 Report Share Posted July 9, 2007 'boutyou Craigyboy, seeing your experiences with the 39gnBltzkng I thought I'd relay to you my experience with the 32gn VMAX (Factory loaded Hornady) out of a Sako 75 Varmint in .204Ruger. My experience of shooting foxes is limited (only 4 shot to-date, two of these with the.204). A neighbour asked me to help with controlling foxes on her land, where she had seen a mangy old dog fox and a vixen with two cubs. Being a hunt supporter I am not too keen on shooting any fox available, but I told my neighbour that I will shoot the dog fox and one cub if I saw them. Anyway, Saturday just gone, there was no rain and I thought I'd make an outing to see if I can get them. Having shot a couple of rabbits beforehand, I thought I'd bait the foxes. I left the rabbits at a clearing 100yrds away from where I was, by a hedge, and set up behind a rubbish bin. Called using Primos Still Cottontail at various intervals whilst in my 'hide' for almost 2 hours to no avail. As I was about to pack up and go, my eye caught some movement in the scope and I saw a dog fox some 50-60 yds away from me just casually walking in the field. I shot him with a high shoulder shot and he fell where he stood. Picking him up I noticed that there was no exit wound (despite being shot that close) and he felt rather 'loose' when carrying him, indicating that he must have been well mashed by the 32gnVMax. Needless to say that I was most impressed by the efficiency and, most of all, safety of this bullet. My last fox was shot at 192yds, but that was a head shot with 40gn VMax Hornady factory loads, and didn't have much chance to evaluate the performance of the bullet. I have some 39gn Bltzkngs loaded and I hope to get a chance (if the bloody wind and rain stops) to test them in the range. I do hope that I get a chance to evaluate them on rabbits and the like as well. Keep the posts and the pictures coming! Having spend 6 years in NornIron and being married to one of her finest daughters, looking at the wonderful country is always a great thing. best wishes, Finman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rogern Posted July 9, 2007 Report Share Posted July 9, 2007 Hi Charly hunter. Thats a nice looking setup you have. On the cub picture I posted from last night i find that the lamp lights up the reflex (has black neoprene cover) and causes reflection in the scope, do u not get that with your setup? Regards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigyboy Posted July 9, 2007 Author Report Share Posted July 9, 2007 "boutyou" finman, I definately reckon the 32g vmax is about the best bullet in .204 regardless of what your shooting, I have found on rabbits the 39g blitzking just keeps going, I shot one the other week at about 250 yards it was looking head on at me and the blitzking went through the head and out its arse without hardly leaving a mark, I know from shooting rabbits with 32g vmax it usually ends up that one rabbit becomes 2 rabbits. I loaded up some 35g bergers tonite and got a nice 0.45 5 shot group with 25.5g of r10X so I am gong to put this to the test on the cubs in my area as I am off work for two weeks due to the annual celebrations over here which I am sure you know all about. Take it easy. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finman Posted July 10, 2007 Report Share Posted July 10, 2007 Ah, you are 'brushing up' your sash and bowler hat ! (When I was in NI, I lived just behind the Ormeau Bakery, a rather delightful litle enclave of the local folclor! good job I'm a foreigner, or who knows what would have happened to me!) I guess it is not the best time to be hanging around with a gun! I would be very interested to hear more about the 35gn Bergers, as they are the most difficult bullets to find load data for in the web (or to find to buy here in England). Yet, they seem as if they have a great capacity for accuracy. The US literature rants and raves about the MEF bullet and the way it behaves in coyotes and such vermin. By the way, do you reload on factory cases? I have not been able to source any other type of cases (i.e. norma, winchester etc) and would love to hear whether anybody else had any better luck. Finman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rogern Posted July 10, 2007 Report Share Posted July 10, 2007 Hi Finman By the way, do you reload on factory cases? I have not been able to source any other type of cases (i.e. norma, winchester etc) and would love to hear whether anybody else had any better luck. I got a bag of 100 .204 Winchester cases last year from Reloading Solutions Oxford, they seem to be ok other than the primer pockets are real tight when reaming out. I'm with you guys on the 32grn Vmax, no fox has ever run yet & rabbits if not head shot are red mist. Regards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigyboy Posted July 10, 2007 Author Report Share Posted July 10, 2007 finman, berger gives out max laods for the 35g berger very low, probably to cover there own backs, I cant remember there max load but I do know that I am exceeding it with only very slight sign of primer cratering (.204's seem to crater even with factory ammo), I am loading 25.5g of r10x and am getting consistent 1/2 and under groups, This was with basic loads and I plan to experiment with coal etc I recon I could cut this to consistent 3/8 5 shot groups. I havent actually shot any animals with them yet, but hopefully ill get a chance to soon. I have also loaded up some 40g bergers to try out, maybe tommorow night if the weather is right. I definately think 10x is the powder for .204, everything shoots well with it, I am just picking at bullets now on th basis of performance on animals. The guys on .204 ruger forum, really rate the 35g berger for foxes and say it kills them well. I just oredred 400 35g beregers from norman clark's today along with 100 remington brass, currently I am using winchester brass, its ok but has a few loads on it now, I have also got a box of 50 brand new hornady brass, didnt like it much, couldnt get the primer pocket reamer into the pockets and when I did get it in the pockets it didnt even touch them as they were deeper than the reamer and a lot of the flash holes were off centre, it cost me £18 for 50 and the remington cost me £18 for 100, I have been reliably informed that remi brass is better than hornady and winchester, I know midway currently have nosler brass but apparently this comes at a length of 1.828 which is far too short for me, its hard enough to get it close to the lands without having short necks. Win and horandy brass comes at about 1.840, I have some federal brass from factory ammo that is 1.850 but the brass isnt up too much. With win brass trimmed, flash hole deburred, primer pocket reamed and charges hand weighed for 35g bergers I am getting very consistent velocities, extreme spread was 17fps until one round wrecked it all on me and opened it up to 37 fps. If you are looking brass give norman clarkes a ring they a have berger heads and remi brass. Finman how did you manage to get a sako 75 in .204 I couldnt get one anywhere, though I am completley happy with my cooper now just curious. I am a big fan of sako's. PS the only thing ill be polishing is my bore with any luck Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finman Posted July 16, 2007 Report Share Posted July 16, 2007 Hi Craigyboy, thanks for the info on your reloading tactics. I am surprised you can receive these items by post (unless of course you are an RFD?), here it is quite a rigmarole to get anything that your local gunsmith does not stock. I have some 35 MEFs from last year's Midland Game Fair, and it is with them that i have been playing. I have shot the odd rabbit, 100-150 yrds, and it killed it allright, but not with the explosiveness of the VMax. I bought 200 Hornady rounds (loaded) and it is their cases I have been using once I shot the factory stuff. I had to anneal them though, because I started getting split necks. also I have a Chrony Gamma master, that I have still boxed, so I don't know what speeds I am getting from my reloads. With the weather we are having, I don't have much luck with my range days: went on Friday and it was that wet that the boards at the butts were melting, didn't manage to get any meaningful data for any of my reloads... As for my .204Sako story, well how much time do you have??? Through the 204Ruger forum I managed to find out that Sako was producing the Varmint and Laminated Stainless Varmint in .204. So, I asked my gunsmith to enquire whether they would be prepared to bring one in the UK. He phoned GMK (1st June, 2005) and was told that the gun will arrive in August 2005. August came and went and nothing. Another phonecall and the date was pushed back to November 2005... And, you guessed it, November came and went and no rifle... Another phonecall and they said it will definitely be there by the end of December. Anyway, I got the rifle at the end of February 2006. Had I known, I would have bought a shot out 223 Sako and had it custom made... The rifle is the standard blue version with a set trigger and a 6 round magazine, and, apart from being too heavy to carry around for any length of time, is my favourite. I have another 2 Sakos (6.5x55 Hunter LH, Finnfire Varmint) and a Tikka (M590LH, custom made in 6mmBR) and I love them all. If only they did offer more in Left hand configuration (as I am a left hander)... So far as I can gather, this must be the only Sako .204 in the country, haven't heard anybody else having one. Makes me wonder. But then again Sako missed the .17HMR phenomenon, so I am not surprised that they do not support the new calibres readily... I should ask you the same about your Cooper!! I have long drooled over these rifles but I was told that they were a special order only item, and probably outside the capacity of my meager earnings, so I did not explore these options. Keep in touch, Finman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigyboy Posted July 16, 2007 Author Report Share Posted July 16, 2007 Love the sako's too fiman, I have a finfire hunter and a finfire range (the range is never used but it looks so nice) I also recently picked up a nice finfire varmint stock which fits the range well so I can switch them out if I prefer. I nearly bought a sako varmint in .222 then I found out I could get a cooper in .204 and the .204 is what I really wanted. So it was cooper for me, nice rifle but the chamber is the worst I have ever seen so sloopy causing me all sorts of problems I have been having to full length re-size just to get the brass into the chamber, I was only neck sizing and closing the bolt was either hard or impossible depending on which was the case was orientated in the chamber, what is happening is that due to how loose the chamber is brand new brass is very undersized in it allowing it too lie at a tilt then once its fired we have an out of round piece of brass that will only chamber when orientated the same way it was fired first time, so I am gonna have a new pac-nor put on Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
charly hunter Posted July 16, 2007 Report Share Posted July 16, 2007 rogern, sorry I have not got back sooner, You are right about the reflection it's a pain in the ass, I get it with or with out the cover but on this paticular evening I fiddled with the lamp and it was fine, have no idea why guess I was just lucky, as the first one that came it was hard to see because of this reason, My wife has just made me a new camo cover and I an hoping to get out and try this one if only we would have a dry night. I like to take the cover off when I get home so there is no sweating under the cover but with the neoprean it is very hard to get of and on or they are so loose that they slide off whilest shooting. But the one that I have now is adjustable easy to get off and on is made from rip stop DPM camo with neoprean inside. I will let you know how it fairs. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rogern Posted July 16, 2007 Report Share Posted July 16, 2007 Look forward to that Charlie Hunter. Regards Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Finman Posted July 16, 2007 Report Share Posted July 16, 2007 Hi Craigyboy, I am gobsmacked to hear that a rifle such as cooper is having such workmanship in the chamber. I read your posting in the .204Ruger forum and was most perplexed. I have yet to have a stiff bolt extraction or any problems with my brass and I full length resize each loading using Hornady dies, using just a bit of lube in the case and the case mouth. Packnors seem to have an excellent reputation, if you can put up with the 12 month (so I'm told) wait for them... If you had the .222Sako Varmint you would be able to put the pacnor to that, although, given the reputation of the .222 I don't think you would want to change that rifle. I had a .222 on ticket before I got the .204, but when I saw what the .204 could do, I changed it for the 6.5x55. A lovely cartridge on a lovely rifle, if only I had the time to find the loads for it... Finman Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rogern Posted July 16, 2007 Report Share Posted July 16, 2007 Craigyboy I had just the same problem with a new Sauer 202 in .308 Brand new in April this year, after every shot (using factory Federals) I could'nt get the bolt back without clouting it!!! They put a new barrel on it and it was cured, turned out the chanber was fractionally 'ovalised' There was no prob with cycling live rounds, the prob was after it had been fired. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigyboy Posted July 16, 2007 Author Report Share Posted July 16, 2007 rogern youre lucky they sorted yours for you, cooper would have rebarreled if I sent it back but its a 6 month wait due to having to export and import it again. Hopefully ill have the new pacnor on in about 3 months, delivery time is 8-10 weeks so its not too bad. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest rogern Posted July 16, 2007 Report Share Posted July 16, 2007 Craigyboy Yea, 6 months is toooooooooooo long to wait for a favourite firestick!! It amazes me how a 'precision' piece of machineing like reaming out a chamber can be off centre on one and not on all of them. Anyway, the Pacnor is a decent bit of kit so you will soon be stretching out to 3/400 yards, poor bunnies! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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