Re loading the 17 fireball

[247sniper]

Hi guys,

 

Looking at getting a 17remington fireball and was wondering if there are any reloaders out there that reload this calibar?

 

looking to see what powder avalibility is like on the isle of man, so if you could shed your thoughts and opinions as to which powders you use and which seem to suit this cal and primers etc,

 

Cheers guys

 

Steve

[MachIV]

Hi Steve

 

I have used Benchmark and H322 in my 17 Mach IV which is a Fireball in all but name. Vit N133 is another good powder.

Maybe just me but I found the Benchmark a bit grubby and it took 2 or 3 passes to clean.

 

I use 17gn of H322 which gives me around 3,650fps with a 25 Vmax and is safely under max for my gun (max is about 18gn).

 

Below is a pic of some ladder testing I did with H322 and 20gn Vmax's to give you an idea. I did it to find the top end loads. I shot 1-4 then checked the target and shot 5-8 starting with the lightest load. The pressures rise very quickly with these little fellas so it pays to go steadily. I was getting early pressure signs at the top load and will probably go for a working load of 18gn.

 

 

 

Hope that gives you an idea.

 

Mike

[varminter.223]

Hi,

 

I started with H4198 in my Mach IV (same as Mikes) which is the same as a 17 Furball in all but name. This produces a very healthy 3,700 + fps in a 24" barrel.

 

Vit 133 produces a similar velocity but you need to feed it about a grain more to do this. Both powders burnt cleanly and accuracy was excellent.

 

I have just started experimenting with Vectan 2000. It has similar/identical charecteristics to H4198.

 

Primers you will need to use ones with thick primer cups to cope with the pressure. Stay clear of ones with thin primer cups as these will probably perforate.

 

Good ones to use are Remy 71/2's, CCI BR4's, CCI 400's.

 

This is lifted from saubier.com

 

Knock yourself out!

 

Start low and work up.

 

17MachIV Load Data

Cooper M21 - s/n MTV433 Neck Diameter: 0.199" 25 gr. Berger square lande mark = 2.606 Comp OAL

Trim Length: 1.430" Neck Wall thickness: 0.0135" 25 gr. Berger MEF square lande mark = 2.597 Comp OAL

FL Size Headspace: 1.089" 22 gr. Berger MEF square lande mark = 2.601 Comp OAL

20 gr. Berger MEF square lande mark = 2.610 Comp OAL

20 gr. Hornady V-max square lande mark = x.xxx Comp OAL

H4227 POWDER CHARGE BULLET WEIGHT BULLET PRIMER BRASS VELOCITY COMMENTS

REM 14.9 20 V-max BR4 .221 4,000

Stevespages.com 12.4 20 V-max Rem 7.5 .221

Stevespages.com 13.4 20 V-max Rem 7.5 .221

 

Stevespages.com 11.8 25 Berger Rem 7.5 .221

Stevespages.com 14.6 25 Berger Rem 7.5 .221

Benchrest.com/sst/mach 15.6 25 Berger Rem 7.5 .221 3,700

 

 

H4198 POWDER CHARGE BULLET WEIGHT BULLET PRIMER BRASS VELOCITY COMMENTS

Stevespages.com 14.3 20 V-max Rem 7.5 .221

REM 16.0 20 V-max Rem 7.5 .221

Reloadersnest.com - T. Steger 16.0 20 V-max BR4 .221 Load ID 8851

Stevespages.com 16.7 20 V-max Rem 7.5 .221

 

Todd Kindler 15.5 25 Berger CCI 400 .221 3,633

Todd Kindler 16.1 25 Berger CCI 400 .221 3,735 Accurate

Stevespages.com 13.6 25 Berger Rem 7.5 .221

Stevespages.com 16.0 25 Berger Rem 7.5 .221

Todd Kindler 16.4 25 Berger CCI 400 .221 3,819 Very accurate - approach carefully

Todd Kindler 16.7 25 Berger CCI 400 .221 3,855 Very accurate - approach carefully

Todd Kindler 17.0 25 Berger CCI 400 .221 3,923 Very Accurate - MAXIMUM

 

Accuratereloading.com 13.0 30 Berger WSR .221 2,894 Fire Forming Load

Accuratereloading.com 13.5 30 Berger WSR .221 2,968

Accuratereloading.com 13.8 30 Berger WSR .221 3,001

Accuratereloading.com 14.1 30 Berger WSR .221 3,053

Accuratereloading.com 14.4 30 Berger WSR .221 3,178

Accuratereloading.com 14.7 30 Berger WSR .221 3,227

Accuratereloading.com 15.0 30 Berger WSR .221 3,293

Accuratereloading.com 15.0 30 Berger WSR .221 3,322

Accuratereloading.com 3.0 30 Berger WSR .221 3,387

Accuratereloading.com 15.6 30 Berger WSR .221 3,453 Accurate

Accuratereloading.com 15.9 30 Berger WSR .221 3,546

 

 

Reloader 7 POWDER CHARGE BULLET WEIGHT BULLET PRIMER BRASS VELOCITY COMMENTS

Stevespages.com 14.2 20 V-max Rem 7.5 .221

Stevespages.com 16.3 20 V-max Rem 7.5 .221

 

Stevespages.com 12.8 25 Berger Rem 7.5 .221

Stevespages.com 15.7 25 Berger Rem 7.5 .221

 

 

Reloader 10X POWDER CHARGE BULLET WEIGHT BULLET PRIMER BRASS VELOCITY COMMENTS

Dan C 17.4 20 V-max Rem 7.5 .223 3,945

Dan C 18.3 20 V-max Rem 7.5 .223 4,140

 

 

 

 

 

Ramshot X-Term POWDER CHARGE BULLET WEIGHT BULLET PRIMER BRASS VELOCITY COMMENTS

Dan C 19.6 20 V-max Rem 7.5 .223 4,080

Dan C 19.8 20 V-max Rem 7.5 .223 4,110

 

 

 

 

 

H322 POWDER CHARGE BULLET WEIGHT BULLET PRIMER BRASS VELOCITY COMMENTS

??? 17.5 20 V-max Fed 205M .221

Chucker 19.5 20 V-max Rem 7.5 .221 4,350 MAX LOAD

 

Todd Kindler 17.5 25 Berger Rem 7.5 .221 3,667

Todd Kindler 17.8 25 Berger Rem 7.5 .221 3,726

Todd Kindler 18.0 25 Berger Rem 7.5 .221 3,776

Todd Kindler 18.3 25 Berger Rem 7.5 .221 3,825 Very accurate

Todd Kindler 18.6 25 Berger Rem 7.5 .221 3,870 Very accurate

 

 

N130 POWDER CHARGE BULLET WEIGHT BULLET PRIMER BRASS VELOCITY COMMENTS

Stevespages.com 14.8 20 V-max Rem 7.5 .221

Stevespages.com 16.9 20 V-max Rem 7.5 .221

 

Stevespages.com 13.6 25 Berger Rem 7.5 .221

Stevespages.com 16.4 25 Berger Rem 7.5 .221

 

Accuratereloading.com 14.0 30 Berger WSR .221 2,953

Accuratereloading.com 14.3 30 Berger WSR .221 3,008

Accuratereloading.com 14.6 30 Berger WSR .221 3,083

Accuratereloading.com 14.9 30 Berger WSR .221 3,179

Accuratereloading.com 15.2 30 Berger WSR .221 3,225

Accuratereloading.com 15.5 30 Berger WSR .221 3,266

Accuratereloading.com 15.8 30 Berger WSR .221 3,295

Accuratereloading.com 16.1 30 Berger WSR .221 3,388

Accuratereloading.com 16.4 30 Berger WSR .221 3,468

Accuratereloading.com 16.7 30 Berger WSR .221 3,529

Accuratereloading.com 17.0 30 Berger WSR .221 3,592

Accuratereloading.com 17.3 30 Berger WSR .221 3,655 Accurate

Accuratereloading.com 17.6 30 Berger WSR .221 3,710

Accuratereloading.com 17.9 30 Berger WSR .221 3,778

 

 

N133 POWDER CHARGE BULLET WEIGHT BULLET PRIMER BRASS VELOCITY COMMENTS

Montdoug 18.2 20 Berger Rem 7.5 .221 4,080

Phil Maxwell 18.2 20 V-max Fed 205M .223 Warm

Dan C 18.5 20 V-max Rem 7.5 .223 4,040

Dan C 19.0 20 V-max Rem 7.5 .223 4,200

 

Todd Kindler 15.5 25 Berger CCI 400 .221 3,251

Todd Kindler 16.0 25 Berger CCI 400 .221 3,399

Todd Kindler 16.5 25 Berger CCI 400 .221 3,501

Todd Kindler 17.3 25 Berger CCI 400 .221 3,567

Alex 17.5 25 Berger Fed 205M .221 Fireforming load

Alex 17.7 25 Berger Fed 205M .221

Todd Kindler 17.8 25 Berger CCI 400 .221 3,641 Accurate

Alex 17.9 25 Berger Fed 205M .221

Todd Kindler 18.1 25 Berger CCI 400 .221 3,753 Approach carefully - accurate

Todd Kindler 18.3 25 Berger CCI 400 .221 3,842 Approach carefully - accurate

Todd Kindler 18.5 25 Berger CCI 400 .221 3,909 Approach carefully - accurate

17VLD 19.0 25 Starke Fed 205M ? Hot

 

Accuratereloading.com 15.0 30 Berger WSR .221 2,960 Claims 133 is too slow for Mach IV

Accuratereloading.com 15.5 30 Berger WSR .221 3,059

Accuratereloading.com 16.0 30 Berger WSR .221 3,166

Accuratereloading.com 16.5 30 Berger WSR .221 3,304

Accuratereloading.com 17.0 30 Berger WSR .221 3,336 Accurate

Accuratereloading.com 17.5 30 Berger WSR .221 3,433

 

 

BENCHMARK POWDER CHARGE BULLET WEIGHT BULLET PRIMER BRASS VELOCITY COMMENTS

Phil Maxwell 19.3 20 V-max Fed 205M .223 Seat .015 into lands - turn necks to .0135

Dan C 19.2 20 V-max Rem 7.5 .223 4,030 Seat .015 into lands - turn necks to .0135

Dan C 19.5 20 V-max Rem 7.5 .223 4,100 Seat .015 into lands - turn necks to .0135

 

Lee in OH 16.8 25 Starke CCI 400 .221 3,352 22" TC barrel

Lee in OH 17.1 25 Starke CCI 400 .221 3,413 22" TC barrel

Lee in OH 17.4 25 Starke CCI 400 .221 3,486 22" TC barrel

Lee in OH 17.7 25 Starke CCI 400 .221 3,564 22" TC barrel

Lee in OH 18.0 25 Starke CCI 400 .221 3,539 22" TC barrel

Lee in OH 18.3 25 Starke CCI 400 .221 3,649 22" TC barrel

Dan C / Tom Moore 18.4 25 Berger Rem 7.5 .223 3,760 Turn necks to .0135 - cases hold .3 to .4 less than .221 - seat square into lands

Lee in OH 18.6 25 Starke CCI 400 .221 3,693 22" TC barrel

Lee in OH 18.9 25 Starke CCI 400 .221 3,776 22" TC barrel

Dan C 19.0 25 Berger Rem 7.5 .223 3,750 Turn necks to .0135 - cases hold .3 to .4 less than .221 - seat square into lands

Lee in OH 19.2 25 Starke CCI 400 .221 3,786 22" TC barrel

Dan C 19.2 25 Berger Rem 7.5 .223 3,800 Turn necks to .0135 - cases hold .3 to .4 less than .221 - seat square into lands

Lee in OH 19.5© 25 Starke CCI 400 .221 3,874 22" TC barrel - compressed load

 

BJS - Bryce 18.8 25 Berger CCI BR4 0.221 3,850 Mollied bullet. Hot Load. Start at 18.4 & work your way up to 18.8.

 

H335 POWDER CHARGE BULLET WEIGHT BULLET PRIMER BRASS VELOCITY COMMENTS

Montdoug 19.7 20 V-max Rem 7.5 .221 3,850 26" barrel - temperature sensitive

 

Todd Kindler 19.0 25 Berger Rem 7.5 .221 3,808

Stevespages.com 19.0 25 Berger Rem 7.5 .221

Todd Kindler 19.4 25 Berger Rem 7.5 .221 3,875 very accurate

Todd Kindler 19.8 25 Berger Rem 7.5 .221 3,909 very accurate - approach carefully

Stevespages.com 20.0 25 Berger Rem 7.5 .221

 

 

AA2015 POWDER CHARGE BULLET WEIGHT BULLET PRIMER BRASS VELOCITY COMMENTS

20

 

Accurate Arms 16.7 25 Berger Rem 7.5 .223 3,388 Commercial data for .221 brass - beginning charge

Accurate Arms 18.5 25 Berger Rem 7.5 .223 3,650 Commercial data for .221 brass - max.

Benchrest.com/sst/mach 18.5 25 Berger Rem 7.5 .221 3,850

 

 

 

AA2230 POWDER CHARGE BULLET WEIGHT BULLET PRIMER BRASS VELOCITY COMMENTS

20

 

Accurate Arms 18.3 25 Berger Rem 7.5 .223 3,398 Commercial data for .221 brass - beginning charge

Accurate Arms 20.3 25 Berger Rem 7.5 .223 3,861 Commercial data for .221 brass - max.

Benchrest.com/sst/mach 20.3 25 Berger Rem 7.5 .221 3,850

 

 

 

AA2460 POWDER CHARGE BULLET WEIGHT BULLET PRIMER BRASS VELOCITY COMMENTS

20

 

Accurate Arms 18.5 25 Berger Rem 7.5 .223 3,417 Commercial data for .221 brass - beginning charge

Accurate Arms 20.5 25 Berger Rem 7.5 .223 3,883 Commercial data for .221 brass - max.

 

 

 

 

AA2520 POWDER CHARGE BULLET WEIGHT BULLET PRIMER BRASS VELOCITY COMMENTS

20

 

Accurate Arms 18.5 25 Berger Rem 7.5 .223 3,316 Commercial data for .221 brass - beginning charge

Accurate Arms 20.5 25 Berger Rem 7.5 .223 3,768 Commercial data for .221 brass - max.

[247sniper]

I did it to find the top end loads. I shot 1-4 then checked the target and shot 5-8 starting with the lightest load. The pressures rise very quickly with these little fellas so it pays to go steadily. I was getting early pressure signs at the top load and will probably go for a working load of 18gn.

 

 

excellet thanks for that,

 

So basically then from shots 2 - 8, all loads apear to be consistant and accurate through the different load ranges (no 1 being a bit low), you just worked out max load and then selected a slightly lower working load for safe usage?

 

What would you do next after selecting the 18 gr load as a working load, make a few more rounds up at that powder level , shoot and confirm they are accurate?

 

What would you do next?

 

Thanks for you help guys

 

 

Steve

[MachIV]

Hi Steve

 

The choice of 18gn +/- is pretty arbitrary, mainly because I like to run at the lower end rather than higher end of things.

The rabbits don't seem to know if the Vm was doing 3,800fps or 4,000fps, none have complained so far!

 

The ladder testing would suggest anywhere from 18-18.6 would be good and safe.

The sensible thing to do would be to load some at 18, 18.2 18.4, 18.6 and see how they shoot for accuracy.

 

However the ladder testing also suggests that any of the loads will be minute of bunny at 200yds so in reality I will probably just load some at 18 or 18.2 and just go and shoot furry things.

 

Dropped Charlie the other night. 110yds 25gn HP behind the shoulder - lights out, no twitching, nothing. No exit wound.