Taking a NON FAC holder stalking/shooting?

[Tiff]

I'm sure its been asked before (sorry), but is it legal to take a NON FAC holder stalking and allow them to shoot?

 

I have permission for the land and the farmer is fine (already knows the lad). However can I let him shoot my .308?

 

Also can I allow him to shoot crows/pigeons with the shotgun?

 

Obviously he'd be under my supervision at all times etc etc, just want to know the exact legalities of it considering I don't own the land.

 

Cheers Tiff

[lancslad]

I'm sure its been asked before (sorry), but is it legal to take a NON FAC holder stalking and allow them to shoot?

 

I have permission for the land and the farmer is fine (already knows the lad). However can I let him shoot my .308?

 

Also can I allow him to shoot crows/pigeons with the shotgun?

 

Obviously he'd be under my supervision at all times etc etc, just want to know the exact legalities of it considering I don't own the land.

 

Cheers Tiff

 

I belive the answer is NO for the 308.

 

I beive the answer is yes for the shot gun, if he is within range of you.

[varminter]

log in to home office guidance mate!!

All the best...............

RAY................................

[Tiff]

Also I forgot to add this bit of the somewhat 'grey' estate rifle clause that I'm trying to figure out and how it relates to this situation for the rifle.

 

From The Firearms (Amendment) Act 1988 Section 16

 

 

16.—(1) A person of or over the age of seventeen may, without holding a firearm certificate, borrow a rifle from the occupier of private premises and use it on those premises in the presence either of the occupier or of a servant of the occupier if—

(a) the occupier or servant in whose presence it is used holds a firearm certificate in respect of that rifle; and

(B the borrower’s possession and use of it complies with any conditions as to those matters specified in the certificate.

(2) A person who by virtue of subsection (1) above is entitled without holding a firearm certificate to borrow and use a rifle in another person’s presence may also, without holding such a certificate, purchase or acquire ammunition for use in the rifle and have it in his possession during the period for which the rifle is borrowed if—

(a) the firearm certificate held by that other person authorises the holder to have in his possession at that time ammunition for the rifle of a quantity not less than that purchased or acquired by, and in the possession of, the borrower; and

(B the borrower’s possession and use of the ammunition complies with any conditions as to those matters specified in the certificate.

 

 

So in short does having sporting rights (fully backed by the farmer) make me the occupier for the purpose of this wording?

 

If it does not, then how does the stalking industry work with new clients that don't hold an FAC?

 

Also where do shotguns fit in?

 

Cheers Tiff

[Tiff]

log in to home office guidance mate!!

All the best...............

RAY................................

 

Ray I must be going blind......don't know how I missed this!

 

Shot guns

6.14 Section 11(5) of the 1968 Act allows

an individual, without holding a shot gun

certificate, to borrow a shot gun from the

occupier of private premises and use it on

those premises in the occupier’s presence.

The presence of the occupier is normally

taken to mean within sight and earshot of the

individual borrowing the firearm. The term

“occupier” is not defined in the Firearms

Acts, nor has a Court clarified its meaning.

However, the Firearms Consultative

Committee in their 5th Annual report

recommended that the provisions of section

27 of the Wildlife and Countryside Act 1981

be adopted. This states that ‘“occupier” in

relation to any land, other than the foreshore,

includes any person having any right of

hunting, shooting, fishing or taking game or

fish’. In the absence of any firm definition

for firearms purposes, it is suggested that

each chief officer of police may wish to make

use of this definition. On some occasions

though, where the status of a certificate

holder acting as an occupier is an issue, the

chief officer may need to consider seeking

the advice of counsel. Section 57(4) provides

that “premises” shall include any land.

 

So I'm ok allowing him to shoot the shotgun....I think?

 

However does the same definition of occupier apply to rifles?

[varminter]

Right TRG ,

as for firearms it mentions about " occupier " or " servant "

Now you dont have to be a paid servant to be a servant!!! - what i am trying to say is a servant is someone who works for the farmer!! , if you manage deer or pests you are indeed providing a service which makes you a servant of the occupier!!

See where i am coming from now buddy""

Be interesting how others see it , but its there in black and white!!

All the best..............

RAY.......................

[varminter]

I have highlighted this from part of your copy of the Home Office Guidance....

 

From The Firearms (Amendment) Act 1988 Section 16

 

 

16.—(1) A person of or over the age of seventeen may, without holding a firearm certificate, borrow a rifle from the occupier of private premises and use it on those premises in the presence either of the occupier or of a servant of the occupier if—

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Here you go buddy just done a word search for " servant " with a on line dictionary.......

 

serv⋅ant

  /ˈsɜrvənt/ Show Spelled Pronunciation [sur-vuhnt] Show IPA

–noun

1. a person employed by another, esp. to perform domestic duties.

2. a person in the service of another.

3. a person employed by the government: a public servant.

Use servant in a Sentence

See images of servant

Search servant on the Web

Origin:

 

..............................................................

 

Hopefully that should clear it up for you a bit!!!