Jump to content
UKV - The Place for Precision Rifle Enthusiasts

Reload Swiss lot-lot consistency


Recommended Posts

I'd like to know too.  I have a first batch of RS62 coming to an end, hope to report back.

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, CameronWilson said:

Hi Guys, how are you finding RS powders in terms of lot-to-lot consistency? In particular RS62?

The RS Website states ±12m/s between lots = ±39.6fps (or potentially a 79.2fps ES).

 

I dont think you can very expect very good consistency between different lots of any powder, its mass produced to a tolerance.

Ive seen way too many examples of differences big enough to change a load or even become dangerous to ever expect anything better between different lots of the same powder. I tend to buy powder in the same batch numbers and even then I mix it before starting the load development to ensure consistency.

Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Big Al said:

I dont think you can very expect very good consistency between different lots of any powder, its mass produced to a tolerance.

Ive seen way too many examples of differences big enough to change a load or even become dangerous to ever expect anything better between different lots of the same powder. I tend to buy powder in the same batch numbers and even then I mix it before starting the load development to ensure consistency.

Good shout!

Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Big Al said:

I dont think you can very expect very good consistency between different lots of any powder, its mass produced to a tolerance.

Ive seen way too many examples of differences big enough to change a load or even become dangerous to ever expect anything better between different lots of the same powder. I tend to buy powder in the same batch numbers and even then I mix it before starting the load development to ensure consistency.

I do the same , normally order 3-4 KG same batch and mix 👍 

the biggest problem with RS 62 is trying to keep consistent MVs in Warm / cold days can be as much as 50/60 FPS .

the best temp tolerant is RS60 but to much of a trade off for me . 

Link to post
Share on other sites
37 minutes ago, One on top of two said:

I do the same , normally order 3-4 KG same batch and mix 👍 

the biggest problem with RS 62 is trying to keep consistent MVs in Warm / cold days can be as much as 50/60 FPS .

the best temp tolerant is RS60 but to much of a trade off for me . 

Do you have a feel for the powder temperature rate of change for RS62 ?

Link to post
Share on other sites

We've converted almost wholly to RS powders and rather like them. The ones we use most are 50, 52 , 62 and 76, and we can't say that we have noticed a difference between batches though we tend not to be running any of our loads at the upper limits of the recipe books where such things might matter more...

Link to post
Share on other sites
28 minutes ago, One on top of two said:

??

I found it in the depths of RS website:  0.9m/s per degC

Slightly off-topic:

I've done a chart based on my data for RS62 under 144Berger Hybrid 6.5CM using "Shooter" to calculate.

Hopefully it's self explanatory one chart shows actual settings, the other the ± moa from my nominal zero

 

Temp Change RS62.pdf

Link to post
Share on other sites
1 hour ago, meles meles said:

We've converted almost wholly to RS powders and rather like them. The ones we use most are 50, 52 , 62 and 76, and we can't say that we have noticed a difference between batches though we tend not to be running any of our loads at the upper limits of the recipe books where such things might matter more...

I hear lots of people say this, my question is always the same, how closely do you look?

I speak to shooters most days and its a common theme for the to talk about highly accurate loads that have gone off. When I talk to them about powder inconsistency and also a powders intolerance to temperature changes you can often see their eyes start to glaze over.

Link to post
Share on other sites
Just now, One on top of two said:

7211FD2F-52EF-4C0C-BF74-2CD4338947E9.png

exactly!

Link to post
Share on other sites

I recently asked Reload Swiss for loads based on RS52 and RS 60 for 69g Sierra TMK bullets in a 1 in 9 twist 22-250

In each case they stated that the burning rate could vary by as much as +/- 10% between different powder lots

Reload Swiss use Quickload for their recommendations

I have a 1kg of RS60 so loaded up some cartridges and fired them over the magnetospeed and then adjusted the burning rate in Quickload so that the QL MV prediction matched the measured MV.

The difference in the nominal burning rate and the adjusted burning rate was only 2.3%

Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Big Al said:

I hear lots of people say this, my question is always the same, how closely do you look?

I speak to shooters most days and its a common theme for the to talk about highly accurate loads that have gone off. When I talk to them about powder inconsistency and also a powders intolerance to temperature changes you can often see their eyes start to glaze over.

 

We don't look too closely: we're satisfied that our loads do go off, reliably, and that they are repeatable. We're the link in this percussive train, not our components nor guns...

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

What Badger just said...........and it's far more likely me to "go off song" than a batch of powder I happen to be using.

I use RS exclusively now, 50, 52, and 62, and I can't fault them, plus they're available at Bisley, which is where I shoot.

Pete

Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, meles meles said:

 

We don't look too closely: we're satisfied that our loads do go off, reliably, and that they are repeatable. We're the link in this percussive train, not our components nor guns...

 

Can I assume your accuracy requirements are not at the higher end of the spectrum then?

When it comes to the sharp end of accuracy the top shooters and their guns will be way more consistent than their loads are over the typical temperatures they shoot in, thats why they will continually be monitoring their loads accuracy relative to the temp it was developed in and then monitoring how it drifts in either direction and adjusting charge weight for it, thats called temperature mapping.

If I develop a highly accurate/repeatable load at say 12 deg centigrade I know it wont deliver the same performance at +/- 5 degrees either side of this to the same high standard I want. Ive never seen a powder that can consistently do that hence the need for temperature mapping. Its also the same with barrel tuners and even easier to see, after a 5 deg change you need a small tweak on the tuner to compensate and bring it back to optimum.

It all comes down to the level of accuracy that is required but Im certain you cant maintain the same level of accuracy with one powder over the temperature ranges we shoot in the UK. Because many Americans shoot over far wider temperature differences its very common knowledge to them and they often have a morning and an afternoon load where the swing between early morning and mid afternoon could easily be 20 degrees. The top American 100yd PPC shooters will be monitoring temperatures and adjusting their barrel tuners based on their mapping data, all fairly common practice at the top level.

Link to post
Share on other sites

For a hardcase competitive shooter, I get your point, but for us recreational plinky plonkers, the occasional 1 MOA 10 shot group or 1200yd "V" makes it all worth while...........

Pete

 

Link to post
Share on other sites

We accept a whole system accuracy of  0.5 MoA at 600 mards, and 1 MoA at 1,000 yards. At 2,000 + we find hitting the target satisfactory. Our skill at reading wind is far more of a problem than variations due to temperature. For coping with the latter, if it ever becomes a problem, we'll walk shots onto target. We're a recreational shooter, not a one shot / one kill intergalactic range sniper...   :)

Link to post
Share on other sites
3 hours ago, Re-Pete said:

For a hardcase competitive shooter, I get your point, but for us recreational plinky plonkers, the occasional 1 MOA 10 shot group or 1200yd "V" makes it all worth while...........

Pete

 

I think stuff like this matters to some people more than others and again its all relative to accuracy requirements.

If a rifle is for killing stags to say 300yds then any good load that repeats sub 1" will last all year around considering the kill zone is 8" in diameter, same applies to a fox shooter who doesnt go further than 200yds in the dark etc but it isnt just for top level competition shooters.

I build a lot of rifles that people use for long range vermin and the occasional informal target shooting and many have reported better success throughout the season when they take into consideration temperature stability and mapping into the equation. Undoubtedly getting the wind call right and the distance measured correctly are the biggest factors in missing a 500yd crow but there are many guys out there who are serious about this and they can do this stuff with good consistency. After understanding and applying then temperature mapping to their loads they tell me their overall success rate has improved.

Ive seen some absolutely shocking differences in energy from different batches of the same powder to never trust them to be even remotely similar. I remember one friend who was running a load on the hot side with Varget and on changing to a new bottle of a different batch it blew the first primer out really badly, he went home and fired the second over the chrono to see what was happening and he was something like 100fps over. He redeveloped the load to find the accuracy he wanted and the same speeds at something like 1.6gr lower than previously. 

Ive also had a chap recently who was delighted with his rifle, a 6.5x47 and sent me pictures of multiple hits on small gongs at long range as well as lots of little groups at different ranges. He rang me one day in despair as his accuracy had gone to pot. He was talking about bringing the gun over to be bore-scoped as the barrel might be shot out after something like 400 rounds, if not the barrel could it be a carbon ring or a badly coppered barrel? or something else sinister. I asked if he was still using the 1kg tub of Vhit I had sold him when he picked up the gun and he said no, Ive just started using another fresh tub I recently bought.

I swear he didnt believe me when I told him it will be the powder and he should look at doing the load again or at least testing in 0.2gr increments three times each side of his old charge weight. A few days later he range back and said the gun was back to shooting great, the new load was 0.4gr less than his old load as it was now into summer temps and he developed the load on a cool spring day.

Temperature mapping isn't vital for everyone, its all relative to what kind of accuracy and consistency you are looking for but to those who want accuracy all year around it matters and its a vital part of the shooting system.

Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.

Loading...

Lumensmini.png

CALTON MOOR RANGE (2) (200x135).jpg

bradley1 200.jpg

NVstore200.jpg

blackrifle.png

jr_firearms_200.gif

valkyrie 200.jpg

tab 200.jpg

Northallerton NSAC shooting.jpg

RifleMags_200x100.jpg

dolphin button4 (200x100).jpg

CASEPREP_FINAL_YELLOW_hi_res__200_.jpg

rovicom200.jpg



×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use and Privacy Policy