Jump to content

Bullets for deer


Bambi-basher

Recommended Posts

Well, unless someone is taken to court over it (crown court at that) there is no legal precedent. Therefore it remains a grey area. Even if the stipulation is 'designed to expand in a predictable manner'.

 

Can you imagine a scenario where the police would wish to prosecute? The only one I can think of is the case of poached deer where the police (if they act) will go after the firearm rather than the ammo (even if they knew the difference between the bullets which is very unlikely).

 

So here we all are arguing over something that is likely never to come to court and we're doing this on an open forum. This may well bring to the attention of the authorities a loophole which allows something 'naughty' in their eyes to happen i.e. expanding ammo bought over the counter or mail ordered. Do we really want any more restrictions?

 

Funny that the same people that piss and bitch about using smks etc on Deer happily use the same bullets on foxes etc. Of course when it comes to deer these same bullets magically don't expand!

 

Get off your high horses and go and shoot something or shag the wife (or boyfriend ;) ) if you have to. Then come back and post when your endorphin levels are nice and high and you're far nicer people.

 

There are more important issues than this for sure!

 

Z

Link to comment
Share on other sites

  • Replies 61
  • Created
  • Last Reply

I thought me and Redfox were having a sensible and reasonable debate, without getting personal. :wacko:

 

My point is, it is not a grey area. The law is quite clear you have to use a soft point or hollow point bullet for deer, but there is not mention of it needing to be section 5.

 

If you have concerns about me airing these views then PM me, politely, without spitting the dummy out. :blink:

 

Best rgds

 

B-b

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I thought me and Redfox were having a sensible and reasonable debate, without getting personal. :wacko:

 

My point is, it is not a grey area. The law is quite clear you have to use a soft point or hollow point bullet for deer, but there is not mention of it needing to be section 5.

 

If you have concerns about me airing these views then PM me, politely, without spitting the dummy out. :blink:

 

Best rgds

 

B-b

 

Hi B-b,

 

I have to agree with you, if people are not interested in this debate, then dont read it and dont join in, as you say the law is clear on this, unfortunatley not clear enough for some!!!

 

ATB

 

Nick.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Guest northernchris

Nick it totally agree with you and Bambi

 

Why was the post mentioning the 123gr Scenars pulled on the 6.5 thread then? Did someone have a wee paddy?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Right, further apologies for an ill written and bad tempered post. BTW to the guys who have responded none of the ill tempered remarks were directed at you, it was posts earlier in the thread that raised my ire (that incidentally were contrary to the majority view)

 

However there were serious points within it.

 

I agree with the points raised about the law stating the type of ammo to be used (hollow point etc) but not stating that it has to be section 5.

 

There is no legal precedent as yet and god forbid there should ever be one.

 

Hopefully the status quo will remain to allow us to purchase smks, a max etc without the faff of section 5 restrictions.

 

NorthernChris, no fella the pulling of that other thread had nothing to do with me.

 

To re-cap: I have no issue with the use of 'match' hollow points on thin skinned game.

 

Thanks all

 

Gareth

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Right, further apologies for an ill written and bad tempered post. BTW to the guys who have responded none of the ill tempered remarks were directed at you, it was posts earlier in the thread that raised my ire (that incidentally were contrary to the majority view)

 

However there were serious points within it.

 

I agree with the points raised about the law stating the type of ammo to be used (hollow point etc) but not stating that it has to be section 5.

 

There is no legal precedent as yet and god forbid there should ever be one.

 

Hopefully the status quo will remain to allow us to purchase smks, a max etc without the faff of section 5 restrictions.

 

NorthernChris, no fella the pulling of that other thread had nothing to do with me.

 

To re-cap: I have no issue with the use of 'match' hollow points on thin skinned game.

 

Thanks all

 

Gareth

 

No prob's mate :rolleyes:

 

Best rgds

 

B-b

Link to comment
Share on other sites

As a recreational stalker who shoots the occasional deer when i get the chance or an invite i really dont see why all the fuss is bein made about bullet selection! All you fellas who are arguin between yourselves about bullet selection, when i probably speak for alot of guys on here would find ourselves privaledged to find ourselves in a situation where we have the time and the ground and the quantity of deer to shoot, i use "match" bullets and i also use "hunting" bullets, both have killed foxes and deer. I know they work 99% of the time, however i have had hunting bullets fail to expand.

I hope that the UKvar zero shoot doesnt come down to this kind of level of playground bitching between each other, i enjoy this site to learn things, ask questions and hear other people's experiences of the sport they enjoy the most. I dont log on to see this sort of carry on.

I agree with Zaitsev's first post and know for a fact that the authorities are looking over us, we go pointing out their downfalls or loopholes and all we are doing is kicking ourselves in the arse.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Right first off.

there are many many bullets designed for culling beasts humanely. you have a duty to make sure you cull all your beasts and foxes as humanly as possible. this in my books means using a bullet that was designed for the job. there is no reason to use a match bullet.

it really is that simple.

 

 

[/color]

 

This is from http://police.homeoffice.gov.uk/news...df?view=Binary

 

Definition

4.2 Section 9 of the 1997 Act extended the

Prohibition on expanding ammunition from

Pistol ammunition only to cover all types

Of expanding ammunition. Thus section

5(1A)(f) of the 1968 Act now prohibits any

Ammunition which incorporates a missile

Designed or adapted to expand on impact and

Section 5(1A)(g) prohibits the bullets for such

Ammunition (expanding missiles, in the words

Of the Act).

4.3 The words designed or adapted are the

Important ones here. Any bullet will deform

On impact with a sufficiently hard surface,

But only bullets, and ammunition containing

Bullets, which were designed or have been

Adapted to do so in a controlled manner are

Actually affected by the legislation.Exemptions

4.4 Section 10 of the 1997 Act amended

Section 5A(4) of the 1968 Act to exempt

From the general prohibition on expanding

Ammunition people who use it for specific

Purposes. The exemptions cover those people

Who use expanding ammunition for the:

1. Lawful shooting of deer;

2. Shooting of vermin or, in the course

Of estate management, other wildlife;

3. Humane killing of animals; and

4. Shooting animals for the protection

Of other animals or humans.

4.5 Persons who wish to acquire expanding

Ammunition for any of these purposes must

First satisfy the chief officer of police that

They have a "good reason" to possess a

Firearm for any of the above. Once this

"good reason" requirement has been satisfied,

The shooter's firearm certificate or visitor's

Permit must be conditioned to include

Expanding ammunition and, for home

Loaders, the bullets for such ammunition.

The condition should restrict the use of the

Bullets or ammunition to the precise purpose

For which it is intended (see paragraphs 3.31

And 4.7). These exemptions apply only to use

In Great Britain, not overseas.

4.6 Section 10(3) of the 1997 Act amended

Section 5A(7) of the 1968 Act to exempt

Dealers and their servants from the need for

The authority of the Secretary of State or

Scottish Ministers to possess, purchase,

Acquire, sell or transfer any expanding

Ammunition in the ordinary course of the

Business. Dealers may not possess any

Expanding ammunition for their private

Use unless they have a suitably-conditioned

Firearm certificate.

Other uses

4.7 Section 10(2)(:lol: of the 1997 Act amends

Section 5A(4)(:o of the 1968 Act so that

The use of expanding ammunition is in

Connection with the various exempted

Purposes. This allows, for example, a deer

Stalker or vermin shooter to zero with their

Rifle on a range or other suitable land and to

Do sufficient training and testing with the

Expanding ammunition. It does not allow

Them to take part in target shooting or any

Competitions, such as running deer using

Expanding ammunition. For this reason, the

Quantity of expanding ammunition or bullets

For such ammunition which any shooter is

Allowed to possess at any one time should

Be carefully controlled by the certificate

 

NOW PLEASE READ THIS CAREFULLY

 

14.8 Under section 21 of the Deer (Scotland)

Act 1996, the Secretary of State for Scotland

May make an order regarding the classes of

Firearms, ammunition, sights and other

Equipment that may lawfully be used to

Kill or take deer. The current order on this

Point is the earlier Deer (Firearms etc)

(Scotland) Order 1985 and the main

Provisions are as follows:

A) For the shooting of deer of any species, a

Bullet of an expanding type designed to

Deform in a predictable manner of not less

Than 100 grains (6.48 grams) with a muzzle

Velocity of not less than 2,450 feet per

Second (746.76 metres per second) and a

Muzzle energy of not less than 1,750 foot

Pounds (2,373 joules) must be used.

 

 

 

Now this is from the home office and is law. I think this will put an end to this

ATB

Colin :o

3.16 Category (xiv) refers to ammunition

Incorporating a projectile that is designed or

Adapted to expand in a controlled manner.

It is the kind of ammunition used in

Deerstalking and vermin control because it is

More likely than non-expanding ammunition

To ensure a quick, clean kill. Semi-jacketed

Soft point and hollow point are typical forms

Of expanding ammunition, but care must be

Taken to distinguish between match target

Hollow point ammunition, which has a tiny

Hole at the front for manufacturing purposes,

And true hollow point. Match hollow point

Rounds, such as the Sierra Match King, are

Not prohibited, neither are flat-nosed bullets

Designed to be used in tubular magazines.

This is to prevent magazine explosions

Caused by a pointed bullet resting on the

Primer of the cartridge ahead of it. All bullets

Will distort on impact, but only those which

Were designed or adapted to do so in a

Predictable manner fit this category.

 

 

 

 

 

4.1 This Chapter sets out the definition of

Expanding ammunition and lists the various

Exemptions from the prohibition on its

Possession.

Definition

4.2 Section 9 of the 1997 Act extended the

Prohibition on expanding ammunition from

Pistol ammunition only to cover all types

Of expanding ammunition. Thus section

5(1A)(f) of the 1968 Act now prohibits any

Ammunition which incorporates a missile

Designed or adapted to expand on impact and

Section 5(1A)(g) prohibits the bullets for such

Ammunition (expanding missiles, in the words

Of the Act).

4.3 The words designed or adapted are the

Important ones here. Any bullet will deform

On impact with a sufficiently hard surface,

But only bullets, and ammunition containing

Bullets, which were designed or have been

Adapted to do so in a controlled manner are

Actually affected by the legislation.

Exemptions

4.4 Section 10 of the 1997 Act amended

Section 5A(4) of the 1968 Act to exempt

From the general prohibition on expanding

Ammunition people who use it for specific

Purposes. The exemptions cover those people

Who use expanding ammunition for the:

1. Lawful shooting of deer;

2. Shooting of vermin or, in the course

Of estate management, other wildlife;

3. Humane killing of animals; and

4. Shooting animals for the protection

Of other animals or humans.

4.5 Persons who wish to acquire expanding

Ammunition for any of these purposes must

 

First satisfy the chief officer of police that

They have a "good reason" to possess a

Firearm for any of the above. Once this

"good reason" requirement has been satisfied,

The shooter's firearm certificate or visitor's

Permit must be conditioned to include

Expanding ammunition and, for home

Loaders, the bullets for such ammunition.

The condition should restrict the use of the

Bullets or ammunition to the precise purpose

For which it is intended (see paragraphs 3.31

And 4.7). These exemptions apply only to use

In Great Britain, not overseas.

4.6 Section 10(3) of the 1997 Act amended

Section 5A(7) of the 1968 Act to exempt

Dealers and their servants from the need for

The authority of the Secretary of State or

Scottish Ministers to possess, purchase,

Acquire, sell or transfer any expanding

Ammunition in the ordinary course of the

Business. Dealers may not possess any

Expanding ammunition for their private

Use unless they have a suitably-conditioned

Firearm certificate.

Other uses

4.7 Section 10(2)(

B) of the 1997 Act amends

Section 5A(4)(

B) of the 1968 Act so that

The use of expanding ammunition is in

Connection with the various exempted

Purposes. This allows, for example, a deer

Stalker or vermin shooter to zero with their

Rifle on a range or other suitable land and to

Do sufficient training and testing with the

Expanding ammunition. It does not allow

Them to take part in target shooting or any

Competitions, such as running deer using

Expanding ammunition. For this reason, the

Quantity of expanding ammunition or bullets

For such ammunition which any shooter is

Allowed to possess at any one time should

Be carefully controlled by the certificate

Chapter 4

EXPANDING AMMUNITION

15

 

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Right first off.

there are many many bullets designed for culling beasts humanely. you have a duty to make sure you cull all your beasts and foxes as humanly as possible. this in my books means using a bullet that was designed for the job. there is no reason to use a match bullet.

it really is that simple.

 

 

I am only referring to BERGER bullets in all of this thread........Their previous MATCH bullets with a THIN jacket are now being sold as GAME HUNTING bullets. They now have three lines VARMINT, TARGET (thick jacket) and GAME HUNTING (previously match thin jacket). So the thin jacket bullets are no longer match bullets and can be used (in my view) legally.

 

All I'm trying to put across, is are you really trying to tell me that bullets with GAME HUNTING written across the front, are not going to be classed as expanding in this country!

 

N.B. It shouldn't affect the target shooters since the same bullets with the thicker jackets are also available.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Tiff you are probably right and some suppliers will then only send them by your local FA dealer adding more cost.

I have had fair success with bergers but the price here is a bit high, probably due in some part to the tripling in price of copper recently.

Thats a hell of a long post Col, will have to sit down with my glasses for that one :o

Fair enough Zaitsev, no offence taken.

Redfox

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I am only referring to BERGER bullets in all of this thread........Their previous MATCH bullets with a THIN jacket are now being sold as GAME HUNTING bullets. They now have three lines VARMINT, TARGET (thick jacket) and GAME HUNTING (previously match thin jacket). So the thin jacket bullets are no longer match bullets and can be used (in my view) legally.

 

All I'm trying to put across, is are you really trying to tell me that bullets with GAME HUNTING written across the front, are not going to be classed as expanding in this country!

 

N.B. It shouldn't affect the target shooters since the same bullets with the thicker jackets are also available.

 

Hi -

The way i see it is if the manufacturer says they are designed to shoot beasts then that is that.if they say they are match then they are just that.the manufacturers can not have it both ways they are ether one or the other.

 

now you boys can use what you like,if you are using match ammo and getting good results then fine.but i don't think you are with in the law.and saying well whats the chances of getting prosecuted for it is not really something i think i should be reading on the net,when anyone can join and read this.

 

now that's all from me on this one,

 

Thanks and ATB

Colin :o

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Morning Col.

 

Thanks for your informative post, however it is quite clear that your understanding of the legal system in this country is not quite as good as you think it is.

 

Firstly, the Home Office do not make the law, neither do the Police, CPS or the firearms licensing authorities, Parliament make the laws either good or bad and I would argue that in the last 10 years they have mostly been bad. Therefore the copy of The Home Office Guidance to the police that you are obviously so pleased with yourself about is only that ie GUIDANCE, not LAW.

 

S5 of the 1968 Firearms act as ammended by the 1997 Act after Dunblane is the LAW in this instance. However it is only the law in respect of expanding ammunition or missiles, it does not appertain to what ammunition must be used on deer, the Law in that regard is covered by the relevant Deer Acts. Shooting vermin, foxes etc is not as far as I am aware covered by any direct legislation but it would be covered by having authority on you FAC to posses s5 expanding ammunition although there is no legal requirement to use S5 ammunition. S5 prohibits ANY missile designed or adapted to expand on impact, a term that is so badly worded that it has very little legal substance. Unfortunatley no act of parliament defines any of these terms, as this legislation was written over 40 years ago and has not infact kept up with advances in ammunition manufacturing. The terms "Match and Hunting" are irrelevant as they are not defined or mentioned in any Act of Parliament.

 

The 1997 Act was as a result of the Governments knee jerk reaction to Dunblane and as a result it is a very poor piece of Legislation, parts of it are a legal nonesense, much in the same way as the Dangerous Dogs act and the recent Hunting Acts

 

The only way this matter will ever be resolved is that Parliament ammend the act to actually make legal sense or the matter is brought before the Courts for a test case. This is not likely to happen for a number of reasons which are the opinion of the CPS and Legal Counsel as well as a number of Firearms licencing Depts.

 

1.The relevant legislation is so open to argument and opinion that CPS would not got to Court as they would have very little prospect of securing a conviction.

 

2. A prosecution would not be in the public iterest.

 

3. CPS will not go to court, if a manufacturer for example Hornady with their A max, are recommending that missile for use on soft skinned game.

 

The bottom line is that you have posted Guidance from the Home Office to the Police in respect of S5, This is not LAW and as already discussed we will have a long wait to see if the Courts ever get the chance to clearly define what bullets can or cannot be used on deer. I will therefore have to ignore Col's learned advice and wealth of legal understanding and put my faith in "my experts" people who actually deal with these matters professionally and on a daily basis.!!!!

 

 

All the best,

 

 

 

Nick

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Morning Col.

 

Thanks for your informative post, however it is quite clear that your understanding of the legal system in this country is not quite as good as you think it is.

 

Firstly, the Home Office do not make the law, neither do the Police, CPS or the firearms licensing authorities, Parliament make the laws either good or bad and I would argue that in the last 10 years they have mostly been bad. Therefore the copy of The Home Office Guidance to the police that you are obviously so pleased with yourself about is only that ie GUIDANCE, not LAW.

 

S5 of the 1968 Firearms act as ammended by the 1997 Act after Dunblane is the LAW in this instance. However it is only the law in respect of expanding ammunition or missiles, it does not appertain to what ammunition must be used on deer, the Law in that regard is covered by the relevant Deer Acts. Shooting vermin, foxes etc is not as far as I am aware covered by any direct legislation but it would be covered by having authority on you FAC to posses s5 expanding ammunition although there is no legal requirement to use S5 ammunition. S5 prohibits ANY missile designed or adapted to expand on impact, a term that is so badly worded that it has very little legal substance. Unfortunatley no act of parliament defines any of these terms, as this legislation was written over 40 years ago and has not infact kept up with advances in ammunition manufacturing. The terms "Match and Hunting" are irrelevant as they are not defined or mentioned in any Act of Parliament.

 

The 1997 Act was as a result of the Governments knee jerk reaction to Dunblane and as a result it is a very poor piece of Legislation, parts of it are a legal nonesense, much in the same way as the Dangerous Dogs act and the recent Hunting Acts

 

The only way this matter will ever be resolved is that Parliament ammend the act to actually make legal sense or the matter is brought before the Courts for a test case. This is not likely to happen for a number of reasons which are the opinion of the CPS and Legal Counsel as well as a number of Firearms licencing Depts.

 

1.The relevant legislation is so open to argument and opinion that CPS would not got to Court as they would have very little prospect of securing a conviction.

 

2. A prosecution would not be in the public iterest.

 

3. CPS will not go to court, if a manufacturer for example Hornady with their A max, are recommending that missile for use on soft skinned game.

 

The bottom line is that you have posted Guidance from the Home Office to the Police in respect of S5, This is not LAW and as already discussed we will have a long wait to see if the Courts ever get the chance to clearly define what bullets can or cannot be used on deer. I will therefore have to ignore Col's learned advice and wealth of legal understanding and put my faith in "my experts" people who actually deal with these matters professionally and on a daily basis.!!!!

 

 

All the best,

 

 

 

Nick

 

 

Nick

i will take the advise of the people that grant me the license to hold said rifle and ammunition.and all so do what it says i can do on my license.

 

if you have the word of the experts,then lets have it in writing as he said she said will not stand up in court. if you had any idea of the way things work you would not expect us to go with this type of evidence,you might be able to do your job with he said and they said but i work with evidence and statements.

 

 

i think that just about covers it :o

Link to comment
Share on other sites

You obviously believe in what you have been told and read and Nick believes in what he has been told and has read - simple as that.

 

Now PLEASE can we get back to the original topic.

 

 

 

Gary

 

 

 

 

 

i bet you any amount of cash that nick can not get all those experts to put this in writing and put this to bed for once and all.

 

 

lets get it in writing and that will be an end to it.

 

 

ATB

Colin

Link to comment
Share on other sites

14.8 Under section 21 of the Deer (Scotland)

Act 1996, the Secretary of State for Scotland

May make an order regarding the classes of

Firearms, ammunition, sights and other

Equipment that may lawfully be used to

Kill or take deer. The current order on this

Point is the earlier Deer (Firearms etc)

(Scotland) Order 1985 and the main

Provisions are as follows:

A) For the shooting of deer of any species, a

Bullet of an expanding type designed to

Deform in a predictable manner of not less

Than 100 grains (6.48 grams) with a muzzle

Velocity of not less than 2,450 feet per

Second (746.76 metres per second) and a

Muzzle energy of not less than 1,750 foot

Pounds (2,373 joules) must be used.

 

 

Colin I have looked at the deer act for Scotland 1996, in the Firearms Section 21 I am looking at does not mention any of the above, do you have a link to the part of the act you are quoting from?

 

I think it is fair to say nobody is saying we should shoot deer with bullets that do not kill humanely.

 

Best rgds

 

B-b

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Colin I have looked at the deer act for Scotland 1996, in the Firearms Section 21 I am looking at does not mention any of the above, do you have a link to the part of the act you are quoting from?

 

I think it is fair to say nobody is saying we should shoot deer with bullets that do not kill humanely.

 

Best rgds

 

B-b

 

post 55 bb

 

the link is there with the post.

 

ATB

Colin :lol:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

post 55 bb

 

the link is there with the post.

 

ATB

Colin :lol:

 

 

Surely you know that isn't the law.......Just a summery/interpretation of the acts, making it easier for the standard person to understand. But should certainly not be taken as the complete law!

 

Oh and it's post 54, since 55 is taken by me :lol:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Surely you know that isn't the law.......Just a summery/interpretation of the acts, making it easier for the standard person to understand. But should certainly not be taken as the complete law!

 

Oh and it's post 54, since 55 is taken by me :lol:

 

 

Hi

 

this is sent to the police. i suppose this was written buy the home office and is a complete lie?

it out lines what we should and should not be doing.now if you feel that the homeoffice went to the trouble of getting this written and circulated to all the forces for a joke then there is no way you will ever change your minds.but please pay attention to the highlighted parts,it even explains the difference in match bullets and section 5

 

 

now i will say this if you are happy with what you are doing,and none of the animals suffer well that's fine.

i have not had any deer i could not find in a few steps from where they where shot.

 

ATB

COLIN :lol:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Just one other thing to consider here boys :lol:

 

There will no doubt be FLO`s and regular coppers in the same boat as us and with the differing opinions of whats allowed and what isn`t (or should and shouldn`t).

IF and its a big IF anyone was caught using bullets that the individual FLO (or copper) thought was suspect they would temporarily confiscate your guns.Remember it`d only take one over zealous anti gun individual and they do exist.The system has all the time in the world and by the time they`d passed this between themselves (flo,cps,home office)and got official guidance you would be looking at at least weeks and probably months before your firearms were returned :(

Having seen the states that firearms have been returned in I wouldn`t want to lose mine for 24 hours to be honest :lol:

 

Not worth the risk when theres alternatives that are 100% bang on and theres no question about IN MY OPINION :(

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Col your link is to the home office advice not the actual legislation. The home office advice goes to great length to point out what is section 5 ammo and says that you can have an exception to hold section 5 ammo for shooting deer/vermin but I can find nothing in there that says you have to use section 5 ammo for this.

 

As per your quote of the “Deer act of Scotland 1996 section 21 -14.8” do you have a direct link to your quote?

 

Here is a link to the Deer act of Scotland 1996.

 

http://www.opsi.gov.uk/Acts/acts1996/ukpga_19960058_en_1

 

Here is a link to the Deer act 1991

 

http://www.opsi.gov.uk/Acts/acts1991/ukpga...10054_en_2#sch2

 

I can find nothing in there that mentions anything which you quote.

It clearly says you have to use a “soft point or hollow bullet” no mention of section 5 or expanding ammunition in any way.

 

Do you have another link to any deer act that says the use of section 5 expanding ammo is compulsorily for deer? That I have not been able to find.

 

Best rgds

 

B-b

 

PS WSM/Shootingbags do you want to start a new thread?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Aside from meeting the minimum calibre and muzzle energy requirements for England and Scotland (which is mandatory)

 

 

There are two distinct differences in the wording for the type of projectile that may be used for deer:

 

 

Scotland - soft nosed and designed to expand in a predictable manner.

 

England - soft nosed or hollow point.

 

 

Note, no mention of expansion in the english statute.

 

 

Personaly I use Barnes X or Speer Hot core for my stalking rifles, they work.

 

 

But, as one well known accuracy smith in the US has said, "all animals react badly to bullets"

 

 

I am not advokating the use of match bullets on deer by the way, but find it odd that certain manufacturers have now changed packaging on obviously the same product to say that they are now suitable for deer.....

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.


Northallerton NSAC shooting.jpg

RifleMags_200x100.jpg

dolphin button4 (200x100).jpg

CASEPREP_FINAL_YELLOW_hi_res__200_.jpg

rovicom200.jpg

IMG-20230320-WA0011.jpg

Lumensmini.png

CALTON MOOR RANGE (2) (200x135).jpg

bradley1 200.jpg

NVstore200.jpg

blackrifle.png

jr_firearms_200.gif

valkyrie 200.jpg

tab 200.jpg



×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use and Privacy Policy