EDP Posted April 4, 2020 Report Share Posted April 4, 2020 I thoroughly enjoy the Target Shotgun Slug events I've been able to join in with - after reading a bit and then watching some slug tests on pootube I'm interested to know if we're allowed rifled barrels on section 1 "firearm" shotguns? I'll give my FEO a shout, not sure if those chaps and ladies in my police firearms team are currently furloughed though, so thought I'd see if anyone on here knows for certain, one way or the other? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
srvet Posted April 4, 2020 Report Share Posted April 4, 2020 Can’t see why not, it’s just like a big rifle after all Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baldie Posted April 5, 2020 Report Share Posted April 5, 2020 They would make the gun illegal, as in section 5. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Shendy Posted April 5, 2020 Report Share Posted April 5, 2020 I looked in to this rifled chokes make the rifle a section 5. I believe a single and possibly a double barrelled rifled shotgun can be held on a fac. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EDP Posted April 5, 2020 Author Report Share Posted April 5, 2020 Thank you folks - I have a club buddy uses an Adler lever-action shotgun, and I love lever-action rifles, so that immediately appeals to me but I can't see how they aren't regarded in the same way as pumps when it comes to section 1? So a rifled barrel on one of those would fall foul of the regs in the same way? There are some comps for "classic" shotguns - O/U, S/S, single barrel - I should look into this more, extra shooting fun! When we're allowed out to play again! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
srvet Posted April 5, 2020 Report Share Posted April 5, 2020 17 hours ago, saddler said: After you with that 5-gallon tin of glue 😁 OK - if you fit a rifled barrel to either a Pump Action or Self Loading shotgun = it then legally becomes a RIFLE What's the legal status in the UK for Pump Action rifles or Semi Auto rifles (other than .22-rimfire?) = SECTION 5 = banned for mere mortals and not allowed for TSG/PSG type events The consensus around even rifled choke tubes is that they better be avoided for the same reason - namely they might make the gun Section 5; this may not be set in stone yet, but anyone want to be the guinea pig in a legal test case to establish legal precedent?? Single or double barrel shotguns - or maybe even one of the lever actions? Don't see any issue with them having a rifled barrel - and these barrels also can be sub-24" length as they'd no longer be on SGC - which means the min. 40" length for all semi/pump shotgun rules similarly don't apply Just not sure how competitive some of the latter may be. Don't think many of the lever action models are around as yet. Ahhh yes I forgot about that !! 😕 so a bolt action rifled shotgun would therefore be legal? At least you would get free accommodation for a while !! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scrumbag Posted April 6, 2020 Report Share Posted April 6, 2020 it's a shame as shooting sabot slugs looks an interesting idea (Some areas which troublesome backstops for example) but rifled barrels on your pump or semi aren't legit, sadly Interestingly, for the "shotgun" / "slug zones" in the USA Browning and Savage make bolt action shotguns with a rifled barrel for shooting sabot slugs that seem to hold accuracy well at a couple of hundred yards Scrummy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popsbengo Posted April 6, 2020 Report Share Posted April 6, 2020 Never really understood the benefit of rifled 12g slug beyond a 'nice to have' as there's nothing you can't do better with an alternative. A full power 45/70 405gn is around the same mass and same muzzle energy as a 12g slug but considerably more accurate especially at greater distance. It's also much easier to justify a rifle over a slug gun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Scrumbag Posted April 6, 2020 Report Share Posted April 6, 2020 Think you're definitely right Pops, slugs are "useful" because they add flexibility to your shotgun but with the deer acts we have not a lot of use here. Still fun slinging them at turning targets though ;) Scrummy Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gazzarM1 Posted April 6, 2020 Report Share Posted April 6, 2020 Can’t use a 45-70 in shotgun comps ... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gazzarM1 Posted April 6, 2020 Report Share Posted April 6, 2020 Target shotgun and Practical shotgun are legitimate shooting disciplines ...both utilise slug. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EDP Posted April 6, 2020 Author Report Share Posted April 6, 2020 Many thanks Saddler, and you other guys - yeah, I love my 45-70 but have found surprisingly few sociable fun comps for it. But lots of fun with shotguns. And loads of folk to have a fun day out with. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moorlander Posted October 26, 2020 Report Share Posted October 26, 2020 On 4/4/2020 at 10:55 PM, EDP said: I thoroughly enjoy the Target Shotgun Slug events I've been able to join in with - after reading a bit and then watching some slug tests on pootube I'm interested to know if we're allowed rifled barrels on section 1 "firearm" shotguns? I'll give my FEO a shout, not sure if those chaps and ladies in my police firearms team are currently furloughed though, so thought I'd see if anyone on here knows for certain, one way or the other? Only if they are a single shot / single barrel or a lever action , s/autos or pumps are a no go. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
dodgyrog Posted October 26, 2020 Report Share Posted October 26, 2020 S1 I believe. Good luck getting a variation! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roy W Posted October 26, 2020 Report Share Posted October 26, 2020 Surely if it has a rifled barrel it ceases to be a shotgun Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gazzarM1 Posted October 26, 2020 Report Share Posted October 26, 2020 If by it’s addition to anything other than a single shot it makes it into section5. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EDP Posted November 5, 2020 Author Report Share Posted November 5, 2020 I rather like the idea of a lever action shotgun with a rifled barrel, if I'm understanding what Moorlander's saying? That would be great fun for Manual Division Target Shotgun Comps!! Is that right Moorlander, it'll remain S1 provided it's a lever action with a rifled barrel? Thanks again folks, good to keep learning about all this. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popsbengo Posted November 5, 2020 Report Share Posted November 5, 2020 42 minutes ago, EDP said: I rather like the idea of a lever action shotgun with a rifled barrel, if I'm understanding what Moorlander's saying? That would be great fun for Manual Division Target Shotgun Comps!! Is that right Moorlander, it'll remain S1 provided it's a lever action with a rifled barrel? Thanks again folks, good to keep learning about all this. If it's rifled it's not a shotgun. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Posted November 26, 2020 Report Share Posted November 26, 2020 PopsB: Technically speaking, you're correct! I grew up shooting slugs in my bird guns for deer and hated them. In my teens I bought a shotgun with rifle sights and sprung for Brenneke slugs. Accuracy was quite good and I killed deer with it. Fast forward 40 years and I am again shooting slugs but in my Benelli Nova Tactical shotgun. I am amazed at the performance of modern 'rifled' slugs. Off hand at 20 yards I can punch Fiocchi slugs into a ragged hole. 100 yard groups seem to be as good as I can hold with open sights. I had thought of getting an after market rifled barrel for this gun but with this kind of smooth bore performance I decided not to bother. I guess what I'm getting at is to say that slug ammo has come a long way in 40 years...~Andrew Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popsbengo Posted November 26, 2020 Report Share Posted November 26, 2020 40 minutes ago, Andrew said: PopsB: Technically speaking, you're correct! I grew up shooting slugs in my bird guns for deer and hated them. In my teens I bought a shotgun with rifle sights and sprung for Brenneke slugs. Accuracy was quite good and I killed deer with it. Fast forward 40 years and I am again shooting slugs but in my Benelli Nova Tactical shotgun. I am amazed at the performance of modern 'rifled' slugs. Off hand at 20 yards I can punch Fiocchi slugs into a ragged hole. 100 yard groups seem to be as good as I can hold with open sights. I had thought of getting an after market rifled barrel for this gun but with this kind of smooth bore performance I decided not to bother. I guess what I'm getting at is to say that slug ammo has come a long way in 40 years...~Andrew In the UK we have some particular rules around shotguns and ammunition for them. A shotgun is "Section 2" and can be held on a Shotgun Certificate, which is relatively easy to get. A shotgun is defined in UK law as a barrel over 24", smooth bore and a magazine capacity of two maximum plus one up the pipe. Shorter barrels, larger capacity magazines however are "Section 1", and slugs are S1 whether or not shot from a S2 gun. S1 requires a Firearms Certificate which is relatively difficult to obtain in general and our Police seem to hate S1 shotguns and slugs in particular. My way of looking at it is if I'm going for a large lump of lead then a 405gr 45/70 seems a far more practical solution. Another peculiarity is a S1 shotgun cannot be loaned to or even handled by anyone other than the particular FAC holder. Confused? Join the club 😂 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Posted November 30, 2020 Report Share Posted November 30, 2020 On 11/26/2020 at 7:45 AM, Popsbengo said: In the UK we have some particular rules around shotguns and ammunition for them. A shotgun is "Section 2" and can be held on a Shotgun Certificate, which is relatively easy to get. A shotgun is defined in UK law as a barrel over 24", smooth bore and a magazine capacity of two maximum plus one up the pipe. Shorter barrels, larger capacity magazines however are "Section 1", and slugs are S1 whether or not shot from a S2 gun. S1 requires a Firearms Certificate which is relatively difficult to obtain in general and our Police seem to hate S1 shotguns and slugs in particular. My way of looking at it is if I'm going for a large lump of lead then a 405gr 45/70 seems a far more practical solution. Another peculiarity is a S1 shotgun cannot be loaned to or even handled by anyone other than the particular FAC holder. Confused? Join the club 😂 Yup. When do I get the Tee Shirt?~Andrew Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Popsbengo Posted November 30, 2020 Report Share Posted November 30, 2020 6 hours ago, Andrew said: Yup. When do I get the Tee Shirt?~Andrew 😂 more complicated than the rules of cricket Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andrew Posted November 30, 2020 Report Share Posted November 30, 2020 Like trying to explain ice hockey to some of my friends.~Andrew Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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