best reloading tip you've learnt

[bewsh]

Surely unless you are using a less than desirable powder burn rate and/or heavy for calibre bullet you should not be able to double charge a case?

Aside from trying subsonic loads or similar that is.

[MrCetrizine]

You can get a quadruple load of most handgun powders in .38 special if you wanted to.

[gbal]

Hmmmmm....again ! Another wet day,so some more desk work.

I think this 'plateau' idea should be considered-there is probably a limit to velocity increase,as powder is increased.Just where that occurs is probably variable across powders,cartridges and rifles (etc).It will though almost certainly be somewhere above the load that first shows pressure signs (like stiff bolt lift,ejector marks). Is it useful here? Let's see.

 

First some clarification-there is no suggestion that you are planning to be more competitive by reducing the competition :-).

" the data is published to ensure a shooter iis always in a safe zone..." but " there are times when a reloader needs to step outside data tables"....OK,experience/some tables are conservative...

 

"Even Quick load predicts a relative increase (in velocity).In practice it plateaus."-an clear statement of why QL is no more than a good guide ...

 

"The tip is...when you get to the point that MV fails to increase (WITHIN SAFE PRESSURES) stop there"

 

Capitals highlight my difficulty-how do you know,if there is any possibility that the plateau starts above the first pressure signs,which seems at least possible,probably likely?

 

Let's consider an example of tips 1) and 2) in practice.

 

Loading 284 Shehane to be 'competitive'.I increase powder loads and find pressure signs (stiff bolt,ejector marks) at 57.3g ( detail plausible,but just for the example). OK,so

 

Step1) reduce load by .3g ie to 57g (sensible,indeed daft not too-stiff bolt does nothing for shooting,let alone pressure issues)

 

Step 2) "load develop"-which can include seating depth (of course),but clearly implies increasing powder "until MV ceases to increase" ,with chronometer. So that's 57g,57.1g,57.2g and 57.3g which will give stiff bolt again but there is no guarantee or even liklihood of MV plateau-ing in this powder range.Use of the chrono in step 1) might have detected that plateau,of course-and it woud be just before stiff bolt lift-but it seems unlikely that it is there.So the advice is contradictory-unless you ignore 1) when you follow 2)-surely not?

 

Or is there good data on where 'plateau' tends to occur? I think it would have to be below 'stiff bolt' load to be any use here....and that seems not so from reported load testing....or Ql etc....

 

My central point is that step1) is fine-stiff bolt indicates pressure ,so place a limit on powder at that powder weight. I suspect that 'plateau' will not occur at a lesser weight,but if it does,then the maximum weight comes down to that 'plateau' weight,and then 'fine tuning' for seating etc should be done at least .3 below this plateau weight (which should give no plateau,no pressure signs). Chrono is a guide-most are not consistently reliable at this 'close to the edge' point-where in any case,a deviation of +20 fps(say) cannot be excluded.

 

If this is so,then why not keep Step1,then reduce powder as in Step 2,and fine tune seating?

 

AND leave all this 'plateau' concept for another discussion-it's way too iffy to be incorporated as in original Step2),which as it stands allows powder increases beyond the 'stiff bolt lift" set-correctly-by Step1)-unless you add "but below the Step1) weight" which just allows too close an approach to pressure load(and a range of about .2g)

 

SO,IF maximum safe velocity is the goal (it's not neccessarily the best goal-as it ignores precison/accuracy),then

 

Step1) carefully increas powder until pressure signs just start (stiff bolt etc)

Step2) drop back (at least) .3g and fine tune for seating/accuracy groups.

 

Optional: 3) Compete

 

then Contemplate reloading tip par excellence 4)" you can't beat the wind,but can reduce it's effects,safely".

 

Finally,Relax,enjoy,maybe a drink or two-know your plateau!! :-)

 

Good safe and enjoyable shooting to all.

 

gbal

[bewsh]

Hmmmmm....again ! Another wet day,so some more desk work.

I think this 'plateau' idea should be considered-there is probably a limit to velocity increase,as powder is increased.Just where that occurs is probably variable across powders,cartridges and rifles (etc).It will though almost certainly be somewhere above the load that first shows pressure signs (like stiff bolt lift,ejector marks). Is it useful here? Let's see.

First some clarification-there is no suggestion that you are planning to be more competitive by reducing the competition :-).

" the data is published to ensure a shooter iis always in a safe zone..." but " there are times when a reloader needs to step outside data tables"....OK,experience/some tables are conservative...

"Even Quick load predicts a relative increase (in velocity).In practice it plateaus."-an clear statement of why QL is no more than a good guide ...

"The tip is...when you get to the point that MV fails to increase (WITHIN SAFE PRESSURES) stop there"

Capitals highlight my difficulty-how do you know,if there is any possibility that the plateau starts above the first pressure signs,which seems at least possible,probably likely?

Let's consider an example of tips 1) and 2) in practice.

Loading 284 Shehane to be 'competitive'.I increase powder loads and find pressure signs (stiff bolt,ejector marks) at 57.3g ( detail plausible,but just for the example). OK,so

Step1) reduce load by .3g ie to 57g (sensible,indeed daft not too-stiff bolt does nothing for shooting,let alone pressure issues)

Step 2) "load develop"-which can include seating depth (of course),but clearly implies increasing powder "until MV ceases to increase" ,with chronometer. So that's 57g,57.1g,57.2g and 57.3g which will give stiff bolt again but there is no guarantee or even liklihood of MV plateau-ing in this powder range.Use of the chrono in step 1) might have detected that plateau,of course-and it woud be just before stiff bolt lift-but it seems unlikely that it is there.So the advice is contradictory-unless you ignore 1) when you follow 2)-surely not?

Or is there good data on where 'plateau' tends to occur? I think it would have to be below 'stiff bolt' load to be any use here....and that seems not so from reported load testing....or Ql etc....

My central point is that step1) is fine-stiff bolt indicates pressure ,so place a limit on powder at that powder weight. I suspect that 'plateau' will not occur at a lesser weight,but if it does,then the maximum weight comes down to that 'plateau' weight,and then 'fine tuning' for seating etc should be done at least .3 below this plateau weight (which should give no plateau,no pressure signs). Chrono is a guide-most are not consistently reliable at this 'close to the edge' point-where in any case,a deviation of +20 fps(say) cannot be excluded.

If this is so,then why not keep Step1,then reduce powder as in Step 2,and fine tune seating?

AND leave all this 'plateau' concept for another discussion-it's way too iffy to be incorporated as in original Step2),which as it stands allows powder increases beyond the 'stiff bolt lift" set-correctly-by Step1)-unless you add "but below the Step1) weight" which just allows too close an approach to pressure load(and a range of about .2g)

SO,IF maximum safe velocity is the goal (it's not neccessarily the best goal-as it ignores precison/accuracy),then

Step1) carefully increas powder until pressure signs just start (stiff bolt etc)

Step2) drop back (at least) .3g and fine tune for seating/accuracy groups.

Optional: 3) Compete

then Contemplate reloading tip par excellence 4)" you can't beat the wind,but can reduce it's effects,safely".

Finally,Relax,enjoy,maybe a drink or two-know your plateau!! :-)

Good safe and enjoyable shooting to all.

gbal

Why 0.3gr?

That much in a .222 case or smaller is a big jump compared to 0.3 in a 300wm case

 

Percentages are easier to manage

Think too many people get hung up on chasing velocity at the expense of case and barrel life and limited ballistic advantages

[gbal]

Bewsh,agreed-it was the original tip,and I'd beeen criutical of the whole idea of plateau working as in the tip (though not the plateau idea per se),that I didn't want to nitpick the detail-and make it even longer,just accept a clear reduction from the 'sfiff bolt loadong". ind you,in a 222,around 22/23 g,10% is over 2grains-too much,and 5% is still over a grain....and risks a miscalculation perhaps....since the jagged and essentially unknowable exactly-edge of safety was so close-and was going to be exceeded.....s keep it simple! It was too in the context of long range-so 222 etc wouldn't be used,so up in the 45-55+ grains zones-you could aggue it either way- I was tempted by .5,but ...as above.

 

Absolutely with you on the 'velocity is vanity,accuracy is sanity'. The gains of 'above max'loading are diminishing (even plateauing?) and usually accuracy etc suffers. It is true that 1000y shooters tend to push for velocity...to keep up with others doing it?- but the best strategy there is go for reduced vertical -the wind will play havoc with your horizontal anyhow until you learn windreading.

 

gbal

[Mattnall]

Best tip I got was "get a Dillon".

[simonl]

Courtesy of Onehole from another post

 

What I tend to do before locking up the die is to leave it in the correct screwed in postion but loose and place a case in the shell holder and gently raise the case to the die whilst jiggling the case around a little whislt it self centres in the die then lightly tighten up the die lock nut.This will ensure that at best you would not have tightened down the die slightly off centre.Presses and dies do have an element of play in them and for good reason that some of this self centering can take place

[onehole]

Not exactly a tip but a warning,,,AVOID having similar calibres in your armoury ,,,we can all make mistakes and in moments of lack of concentration anything can happen,,,,,.222 and .223 !!! I had both ,,,,,in a hurry I grabbed the wrong ammo and unknowingly found 222 fits in a 223 chamber whilst taking a couple of sighting in shots.First shot nothing amiss I actually put the round where I expected it to go but the second shot lots of smoke and lucky to escape without inhury!!!Fireformed case with a very short neck!!!!Only one or two people knew about what I had done now you all do,,,,,take care,,,,,,,,O

[DaveT]

Courtesy of Onehole from another post

 

What I tend to do before locking up the die is to leave it in the correct screwed in postion but loose and place a case in the shell holder and gently raise the case to the die whilst jiggling the case around a little whislt it self centres in the die then lightly tighten up the die lock nut.This will ensure that at best you would not have tightened down the die slightly off centre.Presses and dies do have an element of play in them and for good reason that some of this self centering can take place

Or get a Forster Co-ax and let it free-float.

[onehole]

Or get a Forster Co-ax and let it free-float.

Yep,,,will have a study of the Forster in the flesh when I see one,,,sounds interesting. I have free floated quite a few operations on my current set up but the redding dies are pretty good at keeping things as straight as I can measure.Thanks anyway ,,,,,O

[DaveT]

Lovely press...worth it but a bit pricey!

[Guest Stacka]

Don't force anything. It will end up costing you

[trucraft]

Don't force anything. It will end up costing you

Good lesson in love too.

[Andrew]

Lovely press...worth it but a bit pricey!

I have two of them.

One 30 years old and one 3 years old. Not a bit of difference in quality.

Excellent presses.~Andrew

[gbal]

Since it's getting close to "Rudolph time'' and I'm all in favour of happiness and goodwill-and another Xmas:

 

"Wear eye protection,and be especially careful not to be seduced by the rose tinted ones-QL isn't always right for your rig,chronos can go chronic,and an estimate from an estimate is a worse estimate,in my mate's estimation."

:-)

gbal

[MJR]

see you started early on the sherry Gbal.......

[gbal]

Yep, I did shoot on the military ranges yesterday-so damn cold on the fingers the best confirmation of a shot sent downrange was the bang....

 

So just checking the crusted port for the neighbours is OK..."rose" tinted is a bit misleading,you did well to see through it clearly....

:-)

g

[ghostdog]

Invest in a set of check weights, I've been the digital scale route and prefer beam scales and use the check weights to ensure accurate charge weights.

[Dunc]

Santa brought me a Target Master! Whoopie!!

[chaz]

Absolutely with you on the 'velocity is vanity,accuracy is sanity'. The gains of 'above max'loading are diminishing (even plateauing?) and usually accuracy etc suffers. It is true that 1000y shooters tend to push for velocity...to keep up with others doing it?- but the best strategy there is go for reduced vertical -the wind will play havoc with your horizontal anyhow until you learn windreading.

 

gbal

My most recent best bit of advice is above in blue. Thanks gbal.

[IanF]

Find a small magnet, attach to side of press.

 

Apply a tin of Imperial sizing wax.......... amazingly, it will now stay there, without moving - until you next need your tin of sizing wax.

[Swarovski1]

Anybody got a way of catching all the spet primers, the little plastic thing that clips to my press catches a good few but quite a few miss and the the internals of the primer go everywhere.

[TattooedGun]

Anybody got a way of catching all the spet primers, the little plastic thing that clips to my press catches a good few but quite a few miss and the the internals of the primer go everywhere.

I got one of these for that very reason.

 

http://blog.stegough.com/harvey-deprimer-review-handheld-depriming-tool/

[phaedra1106uk]

Anybody got a way of catching all the spet primers, the little plastic thing that clips to my press catches a good few but quite a few miss and the the internals of the primer go everywhere.

My Lee Breech Lock Classic only misses about 1 in 1000, for the RCBS I got one of these, http://www.ebay.com/itm/321959537021

[gbal]

Anybody got a way of catching all the spet primers, the little plastic thing that clips to my press catches a good few but quite a few miss and the the internals of the primer go everywhere.

Swaro,yes its not 100%,and no doubt different presses (I have 4) differ a bit.

 

Most are captured by the press's plastic catcher-I found a good idea was to see where they were popping out,and tape the catcher in place,and line it with a soft tissue-that stops primers bouncing out...or plan B -locate the primer exit and tape a small plastic sandwich bag innplace to catch them rather than the supplied hard plastic catcher. Last resort is bin under the press.....and a brush-there is always the odd one that comes out squint and bounces ....!! Is there a better mousetrap,though?

gbal