Jump to content

Utterly Disgusted - Journalistic Cowards


brown dog

Recommended Posts

  • Replies 96
  • Created
  • Last Reply

Our forefathers would indeed weep, reflecting on that statement for a moment answers the question of what we should do as a civilised nation to protect our people from this and other brands of terror.

Now back to accurate rifles............

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I would love to know just wtf is so special about mohammed that we don't show his image over here.

 

We seem to cope quite well with programmes about Jesus, Buddha, Moses etc etc, so why are we so crap scared about anything to do with Islam? :blink:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

http://www.yorkshirepost.co.uk/news/debate/columnists/bill-carmichael-time-to-face-up-to-truth-over-atrocities-1-7041312

 

No doubt this chap will be painted as a racist islamophobe:

 

By Bill Carmichael, Yorkshire Post columnist
Published on the
09 January
2015
06:00

JUST how long are we going to continue kidding ourselves?

 

After each Islamist atrocity – and let’s face it they are happening on virtually a daily basis now – we get the same soothing lies from the political establishment even before the corpses are cold.

 

These massacres are nothing to do with any particular religion or political ideology, they say.

These terrorist acts are carried out by deranged individuals who don’t represent anyone.

 

Forget the cries of “Allahu Akbar” as the innocents are slaughtered in Paris or Pakistan – that simply means “Move along, nothing to see here”.

 

So, there is nothing to worry about – just go back to sleep like good, obedient children.

 

Oh and before you drop off, can we just have one last chorus of that great multi-cultural orthodoxy? All together now: “Islam is the religion of peace!”

 

And all is well for a few hours until the next bunch of jihadis decide to spill more innocent blood, and the whole cycle repeats itself indefinitely.

If you still believe this stuff, you are simply not paying sufficient attention.

 

Let’s absolutely clear here; the West is under sustained and vicious attack from a group of bloodthirsty, racist, misogynist bigots who are determined to destroy our hard-won liberties and kill as many civilians as possible.

 

Theirs is a deeply imperialistic cult. They are not interested in peaceful coexistence or tolerance of other views and beliefs. They see any hint of concession from the civilised West not as a symbol of friendship, but as a sign of weakness.

 

For them Islam doesn’t mean “peace” but “surrender”. Their aim is to conquer and subjugate all non-Muslims and destroy our democratic freedoms, and they won’t stop until we are all slaves under the black flag of Islam.

 

And rather than mount any resistance to this naked aggression, our political leaders are bending over backwards to make it easy for them.

After each terrorist outrage you can guarantee that Barack Obama and David Cameron will pop up to repeat like a stuck record: “This isn’t the ‘real’ Islam.” How they hell do they know?

 

They also pretend that the extremists are in a tiny fringe element of Islam. Well the jihadists may be in the minority, but they certainly enjoy substantial support amongst Muslims. For evidence look no further than the thousands of European Muslims who have rushed to join the head-hackers of Syria and Iraq.

 

We in the West didn’t ask for this conflict, but we are in an existential battle for survival, whether we like it or not.

 

And the sad thing is that if you were placing a bet on the winner you would have to put your money firmly on the Islamists. They are more motivated, more determined to destroy liberty than we are to defend it.

 

The demographics are in their favour too. Europe will become increasing Islamic over the coming decades. What chance a magazine like Charlie Hebdo existing in 50 years time? None whatsoever.

 

Already we are accommodating ourselves to our new masters. Yesterday the BBC was falling over itself to describe Charlie Hebdo as “provocative”, as though this justified the murder of journalists and police officers.

 

And reporters and commentators paid as much attention to the entirely imaginary “Islamophobic backlash” as to the reality of people killed in cold blood.

A columnist in the once respected Financial Times shamefully went even further, effectively blaming the victims for their own murder and calling them “stupid” for daring to upset Muslims with satirical cartoons.

Utterly pathetic indeed, but expect such cringing cowardice to become the norm as individuals and institutions capitulate in the face of growing Islamist threats.

 

To paraphrase Sir Edward Grey, the lamps of liberty are going out all over Europe. The great Age of Enlightenment, which began almost 400 years ago and saw a great flowering of civilisation is rapidly coming to an end.

 

Forget the great strides made 
over recent centuries in the fields of science, music, philosophy and the arts. Europe is about to enter a new Dark Age, and a once-great civilisation will be wiped out and replaced by brutal despotism, pitiless cruelty and unfathomable ignorance.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So, what's the answer then? Pogrom all Muslims? Bomb to extinction all Muslim countries? Close the border to all non-Christian and deport all Muslims? The rhetoric and posturing is great, finding an implementable solution not so...the truth of the matter is that all European countries are breeding themselves to extinction (high mean population ages, low childbirth) whilst Muslim populations do the opposite.

 

Indeed, it may be even in our lifetimes that we will see the majority of earth's population being Muslim...our only hope is the depletion of oil reserves which will remove the financial domination enjoyed by countries such as S.Arabia and its friends who foster and finance these movements.

 

Up until then, I don't see any way out...can you?

 

Finman

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I would love to know just wtf is so special about mohammed that we don't show his image over here.

 

We seem to cope quite well with programmes about Jesus, Buddha, Moses etc etc, so why are we so crap scared about anything to do with Islam? :blink:

It's called 'aniconism'. There isn't really an equivalent in Judao-Christian religions. Life of Brian etc doesn't really cut it in terms of the offence given. Freedom of speech is supposed to be a fundamental western democratic value. But then so is tolerance and mutual respect for others.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

A shift in policy perhaps?

http://www.huf

fingtonpost.co.uk/2015/01/09/bbc-muhummad-charlie-hebdo-question-time_n_6444182.html?utm_hp_ref=uk

Probably-critics of the 'media' would do well to read this-BBC did show the cover of CH magazine in the Thrs pm news,and is reviewing it's 'outdated policy' on controversial cartoons.

 

More importantly,the Independent,Guardian ,Telegraph and Times printed satirical cartoons,and they are in the Huffington Post article. I don't see any such from other sections of the UK newspapers,at least yet,but the allegations made by some cannot be sustained wrt the above newspapers.The London based Middle East Monitor also published similar cartoons.

So,some of the British press have ,as yet,been slow to respond,but not all-you can come to your own opinions about the clear divide between the two press sections.

 

"As yet" may be important-as I suggested in an earlier post,maybe some temporary restraint in verbal/cartoon retaliation was motivated by concerns of escalating the loss of innocent life,especially with the perpetrators still on the loose (very likely a fairly temporary state,given the efficiency of French authorities,and as it so transpired.)"Knee jerk" is probably not the best strategy.

 

There is nothing special about any one religious faith in all this,as the decent and balanced responses of a wide range of faith -and secular-leaders indicate.What there is ,is a manifest threat/accomplishment of violent actions by extremists-a clear and present danger-if very difficult ,currently,to predict in preventable detail,short term.It has happened before within living memory,and in Europe.

 

The shooting community in UK should know as well as any group in society,that outrages are perpetrated by very non-representative 'extremists',with nothing in common with the vast majority of the decent and law abiding.

 

Solutions-even minimising the probabilities-need careful thought,which is unlikely to be fully operational within a couple of days.

Fair commentary on those who are responding well might be something we can all do,meanwhile,mon braves.French Police,Public and Media;some UK newspapers;even Auntie BBC....and individual Tweeters etc... even in the public domain,much is positive.

 

gbal

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I would offer tolerance an mutual respect to any one who offers the same to me . But a belief that says you are either with us or need to be removed doesn't seem to be either to me . Maybe that's a bit blunt but seems to be the radical rather than the ethical view is dominant at the moment .

 

cant find the link at the moment but I remember a video about the tide of Islamic conflicts since before the crusades showing an ever moving tide towards the west m, seems now this has changed to economic as well on the way. See if I can find the link . Thought bit us biased it does show an underlying tone

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I would offer tolerance an mutual respect to any one who offers the same to me .

Nail on the head. After all these attacks we always see a load of anti-Islamic rhetoric, for example the National Front MP calling for the 'de-Islamification' of Paris. We also saw loads of prejudice against Irish-Catholics at the height of the troubles. President Hollande had it right when he said that unity is our best weapon against the terrorists.

 

Don't get me wrong. The Islamic community needs to do a lot of soul-searching about how these young men come to be radicalised in the first place. I very much dislike the idea of communities that turn inwards on themselves, not exposing their young people to Western democratic values. The Sikh community is a good example of one which has integrated itself into British society, quietly and without fuss.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Nail on the head. After all these attacks we always see a load of anti-Islamic rhetoric, for example the National Front MP calling for the 'de-Islamification' of Paris. We also saw loads of prejudice against Irish-Catholics at the height of the troubles. President Hollande had it right when he said that unity is our best weapon against the terrorists.

Don't get me wrong. The Islamic community needs to do a lot of soul-searching about how these young men come to be radicalised in the first place. I very much dislike the idea of communities that turn inwards on themselves, not exposing their young people to Western democratic values. The Sikh community is a good example of one which has integrated itself into British society, quietly and without fuss.

Tack driver. This is more like the right nail.Young islamic guys interviewed in Paris admitted they were offended (aniconism helps explain,not condone etc that) BUT they were adamant in insisting that their being offended was not remotely an excuse for radical extremiism,which they roundly rejected.

 

Bill Carmichael might be several things,including defeatist it seems,but also inaccurate.The lights did go on again in Europe,though it was a close run thing.The USA may /not be considered so helpful this time around,at least yet.

Bill is also forgetful that some of the age of enlightened reason ,and science etc came from islamic sources-you don't need to like 'Al-jehebra " to acknowledge it transformed science and maths,to everyone's benefit. Perhaps he is also careless in not mentioning the tens of millions who are not 'flocking to jehadist training.' Those who are,constitute a serious threat,but tend to be young,disillusioned and radicalised (inappropriately),and often jobless. Other cultures have integrated,,with variable but generally less extremes-as in Shuggy's example.

I can see such issues being discussed by Islamic leaders in UK,though the challenge is considerable.Integrated education should help.Tolerance too. It's not so long ago that nonsense predictions were made about London being buried by horse manure,due to the increase in pony cabs. Not bullsh** ,but near enough-as it omitted two vital factors-brush and shove/civic organisation,and the internal combustion engine(and a decent sewer system,as a bonus.)

Bill C and the like seem alarmist without any plan,and let down the traditional Yorkshireman-some balance between the chip on each shoulder.Thankfully others will do more,much more - whether secular or faith based.Inter personal tolerance has only just started to engage this latest threat to universal decency,but it will prevail. God (and others) will insist.

 

gbal

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's called 'aniconism'. There isn't really an equivalent in Judao-Christian religions. Life of Brian etc doesn't really cut it in terms of the offence given. Freedom of speech is supposed to be a fundamental western democratic value. But then so is tolerance and mutual respect for others.

 

Shuggy, your tolerance is a fundamental misunderstanding of the fact that others don't necessarily share or respect your Western value set. The same failure to cognize that the 'tolerance' isn't a 2-way street with other cultures - and is in fact seen as weakness in the culture we're discussing.

 

To test your view of the reality of tolerance versus mine: I'll sponsor you £100 to RBL, or any other charity of your choosing, if you walk around Luton city centre for 4hrs on a Saturday afternoon wearing a t-shirt that clearly states what you do for a living.

 

You on? :)

 

Life of Brian etc doesn't really cut it in terms of the offence given.

 

 

I cannot even verbalise my utter disbelief that you put that forward serious view.

Probably the most Blasphemous film ever made and it caused enormous offence to Christians.

 

Difference is, it still went out, and no one was killed....that, and the fact that you're not terrified by Christians.

In contrast, if they'd made "Life of Brahin", about a young muslim lad called Brahin being mistaken for Mohammed, the Monty Python team would be dead.

 

 

Probably-critics of the 'media' would do well to read this-BBC did show the cover of CH magazine in the Thrs pm news,and is reviewing it's 'outdated policy' on controversial cartoons.

 

More importantly,the Independent,Guardian ,Telegraph and Times printed satirical cartoons,and they are in the Huffington Post article.

 

The papers print satirical cartoons every day of the year.

 

Whilst reporting Hebdo, they didn't print the Hebdo cartoons with images of Mohammed.

That's where they've wimped. That's not about respect or tolerance - that's about fear.

 

I did notice the brief flash of a Hebdo cover on BBC; a small step forward.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'll sponsor you £100 to RBL, or any other charity of your choosing, if you walk around Luton city centre for 4hrs on a Saturday afternoon wearing a t-shirt that clearly states what you do for a living.

 

Ha! That would need to include some medical cover, no?

I live ten miles from Luton, if I need to get to the other side, I drive around it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So, what's the answer then? Pogrom all Muslims? Bomb to extinction all Muslim countries? Close the border to all non-Christian and deport all Muslims? The rhetoric and posturing is great, finding an implementable solution not so...the truth of the matter is that all European countries are breeding themselves to extinction (high mean population ages, low childbirth) whilst Muslim populations do the opposite.

 

 

The nearest I can give is legislated mono-culturalism - that is, come from wherever you want, be whatever colour you may be, but adopt British values.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

There has never been a requirement to have a plan or solution in order to be able to articulate a problem.

But to be accurate about the problem or it's scale,needs more than he provides-a lot more (and note his example is actually wrong-good did prevail in Europe.)

 

I'm sure we all saw again "Zulu" over the holidays- Jack Hawkins' drunken preacher shouting "You're all going to die",seemed on the face of it to have some merit as a prediction,but was incorrect,due in part to the plan set in motion by the Army personnel)and some guts,as was noted by the SM.)

 

Accurate diagnosis-and therefore treatment plans for a problem-is better achieved with accurate information (intelligence if you will),not by some vague hand waving, scare mongering. Though I would not want to overplay the analogy,some respect did come into it all too,but not at first.

 

You concede some small progress in the media-no-one is saying it will be done in a day,and local provocation/retaliation in Luton is not really very relevant. We are in for a longer haul.Think 'edumacation',Matt.There have always been malcontents in any society-though sometimes kept silent-but the extremists up the anti a lot.Whether they are feared per se,or we try to minimise their despicable actions meanwhile,while working to defuse them is tactical.I see no reason to be pessimistic about the strategy,which seems to have overwhelming support.Perhaps for a while,we have to stop their bad boys before their bad boys kill our innocent citizens. The pen has an important long term role to play;no-one should be thinking it will transform the radicalised in one issue of a newspaper.

Let's see how the players come on board-or not. All the 'action men' stuff,thankfully not overwhelming,as (in) articulated,is largely non-operationalisable in our society,anyhow. Alhambra Obama and Daze Cameron are in the mix,but are not the mix.Merkel is no soft angel.They may well have contributions they don't make public.

 

The viable alternative is not ochre hued,or soft PC or any such like. Al jebra is hard sums,with correct,defensible answers.

 

Sharpen your pencils,check you have effective erasers.As the French did.

 

g

Link to comment
Share on other sites

The nearest I can give is legislated mono-culturalism - that is, come from wherever you want, be whatever colour you may be, but adopt British values.

 

OK...progress,pity it can't be retrospective.It is about the French-secular-position.(many British values are shared by other cultures.)

 

The breeding myth has been exploded on many issues before-intelligence eg (and widened educational opportunity showed it to be false).

g

Link to comment
Share on other sites

,and local provocation/retaliation in Luton is not really very relevant.

 

In our tolerant society, how can you seriously accept or suggest that wearing a t-shirt - amongst Law-abiding British citizens in an English town - that simply states a legal governmental profession, is provocative?!

 

Acceptance that such a suggestion is even remotely 'reasonable' is a symptom of how badly out of kilter UK has become.

 

OK...progress,

 

George, please don't start condescending to me. This business isn't theory to many of us.

Unlike you, I've met these people on the ground they're from. I've experienced the reality, not just read about it. ;)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

So how to we stop this peaceful tide of religion that's sweeping over us ?

From within. As you cannot destroy an idea you must attack the idea from within the idea itself. Whilst the pacifists bleat about the faith of love and harmony without ever encountering its practitioners who happily want to live in the 8th Century, the most aggressive practitioners believe us to be weak and ineffective and use our freedoms against us. I cannot see the followers of Islam getting their own house in order any time soon, however if we quietly neutralist those who wish to practice jihad whilst they are trying to learn their trade in sandy places, so what. Eventually something is going to run out and if previous anti terror campaigns are anything to go by, it will be volunteers. However, we must also have every imam preaching against jihad, otherwise nothing really changes. All beliefs eventually change, we must assist that change.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Matt-it was not at all meant to be condescending-as I said elsewhere,we may well agree on much.

My point about your suggested points winning t shirt idea is that whatever might happen here and now in Luton is not an accurate snapshot of the future.

I didn't specify what was on the t shirt-deliberately(as I don't know peoples jobs,which might or not be 'provocative') but did say 'provocative'-which is what was relevant in Paris. Would you succeed with the bet if there were only law abiding citizens present-does that not rather beg the question-it's the others -then non law abiding-that are the problem.

But it's not a very good litmus test either way-let's leave it as a rather unrevealing 'gedanken 'experiment,or perhaps that what I said is over interpreted.

 

I am in no doubt whatsoever that there are some very nasty extremists about,who shoot people,as in Charlie Hebdo,and elsewhere.If others have seen this first hand,or worse,how does that experience give their views more weight?Let alone that the views might very well agree?

The nasties are a given,the issue is the strategic-and tactical- response to them.

I don't use words like 'peace' -what do you assume my ROEs for the 'erasers' are likely to be? 'Terminal' is included.

george

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.


Northallerton NSAC shooting.jpg

RifleMags_200x100.jpg

dolphin button4 (200x100).jpg

CASEPREP_FINAL_YELLOW_hi_res__200_.jpg

rovicom200.jpg

IMG-20230320-WA0011.jpg

Lumensmini.png

CALTON MOOR RANGE (2) (200x135).jpg

bradley1 200.jpg

NVstore200.jpg

blackrifle.png

jr_firearms_200.gif

valkyrie 200.jpg

tab 200.jpg



×
×
  • Create New...

Important Information

By using this site, you agree to our Terms of Use and Privacy Policy