gbal Posted November 7, 2013 Report Share Posted November 7, 2013 ok its just was told that flat base bullets stablise quicker and so are better for under 300 yards, after that thats where the boatatil comes into its own, true or not i dont know True...most Bench Rest (1/2/300y) bullets are flat base,most accuracy oriented bullets for longer distance are boat tail of some sort. Not to say that for many of us,a boat tail won't be very accurate too at short distances. Gbal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gbal Posted November 7, 2013 Report Share Posted November 7, 2013 Tony H and 6.5, You are ,of course both right-happy days! The 17 and 20 are great almost zero recoil-esp 17- sub 300y cartridges.Both have more than enough energy transfer for vermin.-more in 20 of course,but the 17 is hardly deficient.I never had any problem with 17 components,or alleged cleaning etc issues. But most of this is also true of the 223,and certainly more choice of component-though this may/not be such a good thing,if you forever fiddle (=load develop?).The fast twist option takes it into a mid range rifle(5/600 y) and maybe more,that the 17/20 cannot hope for.But if you don't shoot at those distances...? All three are very good 250 fox cartridges.Whatever extras they each may/not offer is really down to individual needs/interests/options-and rifle availability. Gbal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony.H Posted November 7, 2013 Author Report Share Posted November 7, 2013 Dont count a fast twist 223 a disadvantage. My 1-8 shoots vmax bullets into sub .25 moa and 75 amax / hpbt about .3. So the 223 is a better allround cart imo with no lack of reloading goodies unlike the 20's. i was not saying that its a disadvantage, i said if i wanted to shoot further than 300yards id of kept my .223 1:8 twist..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony.H Posted November 7, 2013 Author Report Share Posted November 7, 2013 Dont count a fast twist 223 a disadvantage. My 1-8 shoots vmax bullets into sub .25 moa and 75 amax / hpbt about .3. So the 223 is a better allround cart imo with no lack of reloading goodies unlike the 20's. i was not saying that its a disadvantage, i said if i wanted to shoot further than 300yards id of kept my .223 1:8 twist..... Tony H and 6.5, You are ,of course both right-happy days! The 17 and 20 are great almost zero recoil-esp 17- sub 300y cartridges.Both have more than enough energy transfer for vermin.-more in 20 of course,but the 17 is hardly deficient.I never had any problem with 17 components,or alleged cleaning etc issues. But most of this is also true of the 223,and certainly more choice of component-though this may/not be such a good thing,if you forever fiddle (=load develop?).The fast twist option takes it into a mid range rifle(5/600 y) and maybe more,that the 17/20 cannot hope for.But if you don't shoot at those distances...? All three are very good 250 fox cartridges.Whatever extras they each may/not offer is really down to individual needs/interests/options-and rifle availability. Gbal totally agree and i do like to load develop, the .223 with its fast twist quiet easy to get shooting spot on and there is a lot different loads out there for it. but i just fancied something else, i did not need to sell my .223 it was doing everything it was asked of and it really did clout them foxes and i could also take munties if one ever popped out, so a very good cal, i just felt like i wanted some thing between the 17hmr and .223, as ive sold all my rifles so its was either the 17 rem or 20 cal, so thats why i posted this thread.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gaz6br Posted November 7, 2013 Report Share Posted November 7, 2013 What barrel you got on br and what ammo mate? its a cooper arms own barrel 1in 8 and I will be using 105 a max and vit 140 I use vit 135 for 87gr vmax and varget for the 105gr amax Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jordang Posted November 7, 2013 Report Share Posted November 7, 2013 I had beautiful custom 20 tac and now have an original barreled sako a1 in 17 REM. The 17 is staying until I pop my clogs. It's just plain fun and very effective. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
soother223 Posted November 8, 2013 Report Share Posted November 8, 2013 http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=jeHw36T_Ipc whenever someone says 17 rem it makes me think of this guy.... i hope the link works as its my first attempt. most likley you've seen it before but maybe you haven't... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
17Rem/6BR Posted November 9, 2013 Report Share Posted November 9, 2013 I have 17Rem and have used it with 20 grain Vmax handloads and 30 grain Bergers. I use the 20 grainers for75-200 yardish foxes on limited acreages with housing on the perimeter. Very fast and accurate (-.250 @ 100 yards) and no exit wounds. The 30 grainers I use in rougher weather and for longer shots. I have had the rifle fo about 12 years I suppose and never regretted it. I must confess that were I starting out in subcalibres I think I might torn between 17Rem & 20. A good friend of mine uses 204r and regularly take foxes that I would leave but then on some of my fox jobs the 17Rem is the perfect tool. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony.H Posted November 10, 2013 Author Report Share Posted November 10, 2013 I have 17Rem and have used it with 20 grain Vmax handloads and 30 grain Bergers. I use the 20 grainers for75-200 yardish foxes on limited acreages with housing on the perimeter. Very fast and accurate (-.250 @ 100 yards) and no exit wounds. The 30 grainers I use in rougher weather and for longer shots. I have had the rifle fo about 12 years I suppose and never regretted it. I must confess that were I starting out in subcalibres I think I might torn between 17Rem & 20. A good friend of mine uses 204r and regularly take foxes that I would leave but then on some of my fox jobs the 17Rem is the perfect tool. can i ask why you have not gone for middle ground and just shoot the 25 vamx, thus save messing with two loads? tony Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garyw Posted November 10, 2013 Report Share Posted November 10, 2013 can i ask why you have not gone for middle ground and just shoot the 25 vamx, thus save messing with two loads? tony i will bet its for the same reason as me the 25 vmaxs[present lots in this country] are crap cant get them to shoot in the .17 rem or .17fb.25 bergers are a differant matter they shoot really good in both -22gn mefs are the most accurate in my .17fb but they are discontinued by berger i have a few left and dont want to use them. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony.H Posted November 10, 2013 Author Report Share Posted November 10, 2013 i will bet its for the same reason as me the 25 vmaxs[present lots in this country] are crap cant get them to shoot in the .17 rem or .17fb.25 bergers are a differant matter they shoot really good in both -22gn mefs are the most accurate in my .17fb but they are discontinued by berger i have a few left and dont want to use them. is there a reason you can not get them to shoot, ie twist rate or is this a common thing with the .17rem, as i was told the 25 vmax are the ones to shoot and to get a 1:9 twist too shoot them in... tony Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gbal Posted November 10, 2013 Report Share Posted November 10, 2013 is there a reason you can not get them to shoot, ie twist rate or is this a common thing with the .17rem, as i was told the 25 vmax are the ones to shoot and to get a 1:9 twist too shoot them in... tony Tony,twist rate is usually generic, about bullet weight,rather than small differences in profile etc.The 17 poses no particular problems-if anything,it's a blessing bullet choice isn't in the dozens.I suspect many shooters find the 25 vmax fine,but some rifles won't like them-or there can be poor batches,maybe.There is not much wrong usually with any of the Bergers,moly included,other than the early 18s tendency to disintegrate,when loaded too fast.Standard Remington twist was fine too.Ditto Hornady 25HP,and the rare Rem 25 match HP. I had one batch of very dodgy factory ammo,30 years ago. Gbal Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
22/250 foxer Posted November 11, 2013 Report Share Posted November 11, 2013 The 25 vmax is fairly long bullet maybe thats why it wont shoot to well in a 10 twist not spinning them up enough ? All people I know with 9 twist pacnor barrels have said there rifle shoot them superbly. Slots alot who gets about on the forums not long back had dasherman rebarrel one for him. His shoots superb. As yours will be same barrel same reamer im betting yours would shoot them well. I would still go 20 cal if your worried about that. I did find the 20 vmax bullets when I used them in rem and fireball Where all different lengths ! Not very consistent at all ? The berger bullets where. But didnt get splat factor from them. Slots himself told me he tried the 30 grain berger bullets in his 9 twist. And where dead accurate. But on a couple of bunnys wasnt getting any expansion. At least with 20 tac you can have the fast last light 32's or 39 blizkings. Or even 40 grain vmax. Me and my friend dave has been shooting the 32 blizkings in his 204. They have been great on winged vermin on the deck. Shot some foxes with them to. But 39's and 40's are better suited for foxing we found Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony.H Posted November 11, 2013 Author Report Share Posted November 11, 2013 The 25 vmax is fairly long bullet maybe thats why it wont shoot to well in a 10 twist not spinning them up enough ? All people I know with 9 twist pacnor barrels have said there rifle shoot them superbly. Slots alot who gets about on the forums not long back had dasherman rebarrel one for him. His shoots superb. As yours will be same barrel same reamer im betting yours would shoot them well. I would still go 20 cal if your worried about that. I did find the 20 vmax bullets when I used them in rem and fireball Where all different lengths ! Not very consistent at all ? The berger bullets where. But didnt get splat factor from them. Slots himself told me he tried the 30 grain berger bullets in his 9 twist. And where dead accurate. But on a couple of bunnys wasnt getting any expansion. At least with 20 tac you can have the fast last light 32's or 39 blizkings. Or even 40 grain vmax. Me and my friend dave has been shooting the 32 blizkings in his 204. They have been great on winged vermin on the deck. Shot some foxes with them to. But 39's and 40's are better suited for foxing we found thanks to everyone who has replyed and answered pm's and emails, ive decided to go for the .20tac atvb tony Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6.5shooter Posted November 11, 2013 Report Share Posted November 11, 2013 thanks to everyone who has replyed and answered pm's and emails, ive decided to go for the .20tac atvb tony Did u not hav a 20 tac bfore ur 223 tony? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony.H Posted November 11, 2013 Author Report Share Posted November 11, 2013 Did u not hav a 20 tac bfore ur 223 tony? no i had a .204 howa which, turned out to be a bad gun so i got rid. tony Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
6.5shooter Posted November 11, 2013 Report Share Posted November 11, 2013 no i had a .204 howa which, turned out to be a bad gun so i got rid. tony Ah, wasnt sure knew u had a 20 of somesort. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
niceone5 Posted November 11, 2013 Report Share Posted November 11, 2013 i stole a 20 tac off garry w its my favorite rifle over 80 foxes with it and its only problem is its stock is to nice .but i will say i fancy a 17 gary will give good advise as he dont b s and hes had loads ................................... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
garyw Posted November 12, 2013 Report Share Posted November 12, 2013 i stole a 20 tac off garry w its my favorite rifle over 80 foxes with it and its only problem is its stock is to nice .but i will say i fancy a 17 gary will give good advise as he dont b s and hes had loads ................................... yes you did steal it!but i hope your still enjoying it.i dont mind passing on any thing that is still good as long as it goes to a good home. hows the job going Mark?hope your busy. atb gary Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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