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9KG fully loaded for alpine trekking/camping


brown dog

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Been traveling on motorbikes for years with very little kit. Basher instead of tent, matches instead of cooker etc. It can be very satisfying living on very little for a month, on the road, but also nice to come back to a bed, bath etc. it really does depend on weather though. I've lived in the Sahara for three weeks with very little but in the Atlas Mountains in snow needed loads.

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Sort of do the lightweight thing on some of my expeds.

The OMM packs I've found to be the best combination for weight and strength.

Had both exped and golite lightweight packs fail on me and wouldn't buy them again due to the comfort factor (though exped make some other excellent kit I swear buy). Osprey make decent lightweight packs but I've not tested one personally but other have had them on trips I've ran had they have held up.

 

Getting you basic kit down is a lot easier than finding a good lightweight pack and keeping nutrition light is the biggest factor.

A good quality dehydrator and water purifier are a must if your going to experience yourself.

I like a balance now between longevity and weight, but there is no way you'd get me to ditch the sil nylon tarp, rab doss bag and down mat.

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Jungle - which one were you at the shoot? (Trying to visualise who I'm talking to!).

 

I'm of a mind to cut down to a 1 season bag. I find snugpak/softie jacket and trousers fill the gap and do double duty (as a coat!).

 

Nutrition for the alps - I'll just buy dehydrated mountain meals. Water - got a katadyn.

 

Some neat tents about that weigh 1.65kg and use trekking poles as tent poles.

 

Clothing - think I'll embrace softshell with a pocket size wetproof outer for if it monsoons.

 

Not sure on stoves etc - fuel is the forgotten adder of weight,

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The offshore guy shooting a sporting tikka. We were speaking with Terry about Chinese copy software and products.

 

A good down jacket and bag will knock at least a 1kg off the softie combo. My rab minimum -20 bag weights just under 900g and the summer bag (happy to use in pants ans vest in sub 0) weighs less than 350g. I wouldn't bother with warm trousers so much if you have a set of salopetts or good windproof kegs with merino long Johns have seen me though sub -20 in Alberta, Norway and Sweden. Have a shop around as you can find ultralight weight tents at just over the 1kg mark, this isn't my area as I tend to use a combination of tarp, hammock or shelter depending on the environment.

 

Next rifle shoot I can make I'll bring along some gear or your welcome to have a look through in the kit room as I'm not too far from you.

IMG_0394.jpg

-5 in Finland

 

2c5fb8a941a3f06b81aaf493e2383f37.jpg

Super shelters not one for a hasty camp but dam good in the Alberta deep winter

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Ah OK. :) Spotted the kifaru necklace :)

 

Down - I'm not a fan. I've spent too much time pee wet through. Sweat a lot too. Primaloft or similar will always be my preference. (With that, synthetic brynje has been my greatest base layer find - wish it'd been around when back when I would have needed it at work!)

 

Softie trousers - they're like a wearable lower half sleeping bag. For camp/sleep only, not movement.

 

I think, for mountains, I'm nailed on to 'tent' rather than tarp,. Got to have the ability to shelter from wind if caught out somewhere exposed.

 

I'll have a look at the OMM rucksacks - thanks

 

- would love to have a look at some of your kit before I start spending.

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All day long, easy when you buy the right kit from the start, as always based on past experience, plus as a, now, professional mountaineer its my work kit.. Can bivi/snow hole for a week easy in winter, full cook kit sleep mat, winter bag, food etc and pack weighs in at 12.5kg ish, sub 8kg summer is a piece of cake.

 

winter bag used worldwide Rab Ladakh with a Rab survival zone bivi. Used from Scotland to Norway, Alps, Scandinavia, oh yea and when working at up to 6000m in Nepali Himal.

 

Summer bag is Rab , cant remember the name , its a 1 season down bag with pertex shell, stuffs down to the size of a grapefruit and weighs less than 300gms, couple that with the survival zone bivi and im laughing.

 

Only got 3 tents these days- Mountain hardwear tango 3 man high mountain tent, A cheap gelert tent for car camping and my favourite for the last 5 years a Mountain Equipment Dragonfly 2 man tent, very light all mountain tent that has stood up to the worst UK mountain weather and kept me dry and warm. Oh and it packs well for rucksack and canoe trips.

 

Cook kit - MSR all day long, been using the MSR whisperlight for about 10 years, plus an MSR alpine cook set for pans,( can fit the stove and bits and bobs in one of the mess pans) this has been proved in all weathers and down to silly temps in winter - great bit of kit and have modded it for hanging stove in snow holes.

Thermarest exped shorty, used summer and winter.

Paramo smock - will never go back to membrane systems for the top half - buffalo good but to heavy as is all the snugpack kit, its only issue kit cos its better than the crap before.

 

Those exped sacks are that which promotes growth and vigour when it comes to hard work, they wont last, plus they are uncomfortable when loaded - they should stick to making their very good roll top waterproof sacks.

 

As someone else has said, its not about the weight of the pack, its the stuff you choose to carry in it.

 

BD if your up my way just call me, happy to show you a load of kit that works.

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Mark, thanks for all that.

 

I'm visualising something like the Tour de Mont Blanc in summer conditions. Did it back in 94 (honeymoon!) fancy doing it or similar again.

 

What do you recommend as a light pack? -or what's a realistic minimum weight? (not sure on litre-age either - my brainwashed mind thinks '60 litre' but I suspect 50 or 45 may be enough for light backpacking.)

 

[i'm still in wonder that such light packs exist! Used to 'green' packs, but also years ago bought a Lowe pack for a himalyan exped - hated it, not a lot lighter, and had a tear drop shape to the main compartment that meant getting anything in and out of it was like the thing was trying to give birth]

 

Paramo - I'm also a believer. Got a pajaro and an alta 2 (for skiing). Not light though?

 

Wondering what to get for legs. Montane terra seems to be the vogue for shorts and trousers (I guess a pair of each is the full requirement for a trip); but instinct (based on little!) makes me think a more technical fabric for the trousers may take away the need for overtrousers..something with the schoeller nanoskin -any thoughts ideas?

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That's the one, the kif kit can be good( though much is style other substance 'tacicool' that has a far higher rep than it deserves) but is very item specific and most is uber heavy.

 

The OMM one I have is 45 ltrs and I used it for an unsupported no re supply 7 day trek in Finland a few years ago. This was completely in technical though so my equipment needs would have been somewhat different to yours but weight wise the things that would swap out would be about equal. The go lite tents have a good rep and they are just over a 1kg but not sure I'd want to use one on an alpine route, was planning to use one for the GR20 but going with just a moded bivi.

 

I'm around till Thursday then away for 10 days, drop me a pm and I'll send you address

A few of the pack from an archive pic:

IMG_0016-3.jpg

IMG_0019-2.jpg

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And if your a synthetic man (sorry I'm a convert completely to down now) your cant do much better than wiggys all the Canuck guys swear by them. http://wiggys.com/lamilite.cfm

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And if your a synthetic man (sorry I'm a convert completely to down now) your cant do much better than wiggys all the Canuck guys swear by them. http://wiggys.com/lamilite.cfm

 

Have you seen the weights?!

 

I've got my desert sleeping bag from work. Forgot to give it back :o - it might do; certainly 1 season, I've never thought to weigh it. Looks a bit like the basic rectangular wiggy. Probably is one. http://wiggys.com/moreinfo.cfm?Product_ID=250

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I have been through a few packs in the last few years, Berghaus Extreme Guide (not made anymore?) fantastic pack, light enough and good for exped use, last used it working Atlas mountains in winter this year, still got it and its my overseas pack. Tried an MRT issued Pod Black ice, had it for 2 years before giving it a try, used it for a day ski tour in Wales and sold it on fleabay the next day-too heavy.

Always keep coming back to one sack- Black Diamond Jackal- light, very comfy and only has the features you really need, had this for 4 years now and when this is at its end I may try a Deuter guide or guide lite - my GF has a guide lite- very nice pack indeed.

 

Im off to the Haute Route in the next few weeks. This is my kit:

Jackal pack 45lt

2 pairs bridgedale expedition socks - 1 to wear, 1 for huts/sleep/spare- these socks 'smell free' on my stinky feet for about 10 days continuous wear.

1 long sleeved synthetic berghaus base layer

1 long sleeved paramo base layer

3 pairs pants- 2 paramo 1 merino

1 beany hat

paramo aspira smock - love it, have 2 of them and wouldnt buy anything else now.

water proof trousers - well the expensive arcteryx kit only lasted 3 months before leaking (thanks to it no longer being made in Canada) so going to have a look at some Keela Munro sallopettes, failing that a pair of cheap berghaus storm pants to tied me over till I switch my work clothing for the autumn and winter season.

 

Trousers wise not sure yet, I have some Haglofs rugged mountain pants, now they are very good shed water well and dry quickly, but a bit warm unless its below 14C, oh and you would have thought the Scandi's would have made them bigger in the cuff to fit over ski touring boots! they dont and I looked a bit bizare skiing in them with them rolled up to my knees!!

I may just take my Northface paramount peak pants and wear with cheap waterproof trousers.

 

Large pertex towel and minimal wash/shave kit. I always pack sudocrem and talc, as administration in the field should never be forgotten.

2.5Lt source bottle and drink tube- been using these for a couple of years now, they are cleaner than Platypus which can get bacteria build ups in the neck area.

1Lt Nalgene bottle

Thin pair of gloves, I have 2 favourite pairs at the moment: a pair of Marmot XT glove, i have abused this glove all year round, its been in and out of the washing machine and tumble dryer and just keep going, had them 5 years, I just keep stitching them back together. The other pair is a pair of Mountain Hardwear windstoppers with goat skin palm, used and abused and still living the dream 4 years later.

Headtorch- mini energiser, cant be arsed with the bulk and weight of Petzl myo 5.

1st aid kit

maps, gps, plus standard Silva type 4/54 - probably not needed but I like maps :) and being able to safely plan a bail out if needed.

camera

leiki poles

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Agree on a few points of the above,

MSR stoves, been using an XGK for years and ok so it only boils and control is very limited but the comforting roar when a cuppa is vital is nice. Only issue I have had recently was the pump broke on the grey plastic, looked like a contraction or embrittlement cracking. New pump £35 sorted.

Paramo, good but it did let me down on a few days in the snow on the pennine way last winter. Make sure you keep it washed and treated otherwise it is useless but still keeps you warm when soaked.

Small tents, got to say I don't value them! A tarp is far more versatile and cooking etc in the rain is possible. I have a few tents and one is a single skin gortex item. OK for sleeping and that is it. Where do you get undressed before getting into bed when its raining? Once undressed where do you put the clothes for in the morning including boots? Where do you cook? Where do you get dressed? I am small and yet can't get my trousers/socks off easily once inside. But it is small and compact to carry.

Rucksacks. Do you really need 60 litres BD? I have a few and these days a Berghaus munro with the side pockets on if need be is enough. I have an old plce bergan and with pouches just encourages you to take too much.

A slip on pair of somethings i.e. sandals, are nice for in and around camp and airing your feet at the end of the day.

Snugpak pile smock, excellent kit, poor pack size but have used it for a full days mountain biking in the rain and was spot on. Love this piece of kit but it has to be cold enough.

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Where do you get undressed before getting into bed when its raining? Once undressed where do you put the clothes for in the morning including boots? Where do you cook? Where do you get dressed?

 

I'm with you on that: http://www.cotswoldoutdoor.com/robens-x-lite-mercury-72110287?id_colour=98

 

 

Mark,

 

Useful kit list - thanks!

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Trying to make a smock choice myself today. After getting cold and wet in my old Kammo at Diggle yesterday I decided that was the last time. I already have a Paramo coat for walking in, and love it, but fancy a smock for shooting in. Should I go for the Paramo aspire or the Velez. Or after looking at my mate's Buffalo yesterday , one of them ?

 

Thoughts ?

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Trying to make a smock choice myself today. After getting cold and wet in my old Kammo at Diggle yesterday I decided that was the last time. I already have a Paramo coat for walking in, and love it, but fancy a smock for shooting in. Should I go for the Paramo aspire or the Velez. Or after looking at my mate's Buffalo yesterday , one of them ?

 

Thoughts ?

I have Paramo and Buffalo jackets and I'm quite rough with them. The Paramo has gone back to be repaired twice as its not very strong, the Buffalo got caught on barbed wire and they just replaced it FOC even though I told them it was my fault. The Paramo is much warmer and lighter but needs treating to keep water proof. The Buffalo has never been treated and is still 100% waterproof.

 

As for rucksacks I like Osprey mines done four trips inc India and is still like new.

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Baldie, if your the type that 'runs hot' in all but the most sedate physical activity then the velez, otherwise for autumn and spring an Aspira, then when winter comes add a mid weight fleece with it and youll be toasty, also a lot warmer than a buffalo super 6 shirt when static shooting, last November was on the bipod, static, next to me was a bulkier chap in a buffalo top moaning about how biting the wind was and dribling snot from his nose, hahaha, i was toasty, it was about 6c ambient and closer to 1c with chill.

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Trying to make a smock choice myself today. After getting cold and wet in my old Kammo at Diggle yesterday I decided that was the last time. I already have a Paramo coat for walking in, and love it, but fancy a smock for shooting in. Should I go for the Paramo aspire or the Velez. Or after looking at my mate's Buffalo yesterday , one of them ?

 

Thoughts ?

 

Dave, paramo are useless for rifle shooting in rain.

I'm a huge paramo fan (as earlier, I have 2) but....

If you go prone or lean on something, water will come through at every contact point.

Brilliant for anything where you stay vertical - well anything where you don't lie in water puddled on the ground or on your shooting mat; just crap for rifle shooting in the rain.

 

I've also destroyed 2. Both times with climbing ropes. Luckily both were issued to me; but for all their fantastic breathable comfort capabilities, you do trade away some robustness.

[sorry, just noticed you have one too. Go prone in a puddle to see what I mean]

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Can't say I'm a soft shell the ones I've had always ended up being a cover all but do none solution.

I've returned back to the mid/outer layer and a good hard shell in the pack for me this is one area that the weights worh it.

When you really need a good waterproof all the soft shell I've tried have been woefull.

 

Cookers I set on a titanium meths burner. It weighs bugger all and can cope with low temps with good admin and prior thought, used mine in -15. You can pre judge to a reasonable degree how much fuel you need for cooking and brews and mark the bottle so you use just the right amount and only take enough fuel (distress ion for an emergency amount) to last for your trip. Gas cookers may be light but they are turd in the cold the canisters are relatively heavy and bulky so they are a no go for me, I really like peak stove excellent kit but are about as far away from light weight as you can get.

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Paramo is definitely a marmite choice. I detest goretex, it was the greatest confidence trick of the 20th Century. I get as wet from condensation as a would from not wearing it. Horses for courses :)

 

What do you think of the look of this: http://www.cotswoldoutdoor.com/robens-x-lite-mercury-72110287?id_colour=98

 

Reminiscent of the tents I used to use doing arctic stuff. My 'concern' would be the centre pole blowing flat in a hoolie. .....but just over 2KG !

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What do you think of the look of this: http://www.cotswoldoutdoor.com/robens-x-lite-mercury-72110287?id_colour=98

 

Reminiscent of the tents I used to use doing arctic stuff. My 'concern' would be the centre pole blowing flat in a hoolie. .....but just over 2KG !

 

Aaaagh........just had an ND with the 'buy now' finger :unsure: found a place doing them for £220.

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As said Paramo and lying around on the floor is a no no. Was a big fan but the outing as previously said proved the coat useless. Now not sure.

 

Agree with the other comments on gas cookers, convenient yes, good in the cold or when the cylinder is partial pressure, no.

 

BD that tent isn't exactly over spec. on the hydrostatic head is it, especially at that money?

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BD that tent isn't exactly over spec. on the hydrostatic head is it, especially at that money?

 

 

You're right - I'm hoping it'll be 'good enough'. I'm seduced by the space - booting and cooking area - and weight - just over 2kg

 

 

By the by; just weighed my desert sleeping bag; "Warm Weather Sleeping Bag" - 1.06kg

 

And unrolled for the first time the "Mat thermal inflatable sleeping" that's sat in a cupboard since I was given it - seems to be a 3/4 length thermarest think it was 580g (I'll have to re-weigh it when I roll it back up).

 

Think I could be around 3.9kg for tent, sleeping bag and kipmat so far -which doesn't seem too bad (I think?!)

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Not what you are looking for regarding the weight but this is luxury with the space available for rifle cleaning, muddy boots etc. Has a good hydrostatic head and the tension system does really work.

 

https://www.vango.co.uk/trekking/spirit-200+.html

 

Well wrote a load about sleeping bags and somehow the whole thing screwed up with some java script garbage.

 

Old proverb, travel light, cold at night....... seems true to me.

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