To Muzzle Brake or not to Muzzle Brake....

[SMLE]

Hi All,

After an educated opinion. My shooting interest is mainly old milsurps (you’d never guess from my username would you), but I do also shoot at 600 yards about once a month and a couple of times a year out to 900 and beyond with my semi custom Howa. I’m on a budget here, so please bear that in mind, I don’t want to spend a bomb on a new gucci rifle..... just yet!

However, a couple of folks I shoot with have suggested my Howa might benefit from a muzzle brake in the meantime, so should I?

If the answer is yes, I guess that’s because I’m likely to experience an improvement in muzzle behaviour and general recoil management but I’d like to understand that a bit more.

So, a couple of further questions:

1. Will it make much difference to my accuracy? I consider myself a proficient amateur, recoil is not particularly an issue for me, but I can understand that reducing felt recoil can have potential benefit.

2. Are the non gunsmith brakes worth the money? I’m tempted by Dolphin’s new stainless ones.

3. What does timing mean in relation to brakes? Am I being thick by asking that?

4. Are cheaper alternatives worth considering? I note Gunbloke from Australia on eBay appears to offer similar stuff to Dolphin for half price..... did I mention I’m tight!

I’ve been bitten a little by this longer range bug and suspect I’ll be upgrading my kit in the next couple of years and really want to get my head around this longer range stuff with my trusty Howa before forking out again, so any advice before then is gratefully received.

[Brillo]

A brake will help reduce recoil at the expense of annoying those around you. The blast from a muzzle brake isn’t noticeable to the shooter but it’s very unpleasant for those either side of you.

Most MoD owned ranges do not permit their use, e.g. Bisley and Kingsbury.

They neither improve or reduce accuracy, only the point of impact.

Timing means the alignment of the ports when fully tightened.

Regarding cheaper alternatives, quite a few gunsmiths make them at a reasonable price. The ones made by Dolphin are excellent quality at a sensible price. Buy cheaper from eBay if you want but caveat emptor.

I have two rifles threaded for brakes but the brakes have never been fitted. I used to shoot a Sako TRG and found little benefit from using the break other than the pleasure of annoying the hell out of my mates.

[No i deer]

I like muzzle brakes but some find the blast annoying.you can use them at bisley as I shoot in  club at bisley that most shooters use them as shooting fast details the brake controls the muzzle flip and recoil so your instantly ready to take your next shot.i have the new dolphin self timing brake and it's as good as brakes get.i paid double that for a TE Terminator brake and it's right up with that on my 7mms.

[No i deer]

Go on YouTube and find the muzzle brakes comparison done be terminator products.the roedale brake is very good too but the terminator brakes are about the most efficient brake made today.i had 2 roedale brakes.one in black and the other in beat blasted or water vapour finish.the new dolphin self timing brake is very similar as the

Fat B a s t a r d and the little

b a s t a r d

.if you want the most efficient brakes then the ports need to be angled back.there even more shooter unfriendly.ive shot inbetween two brake users 100s of times.it doesn't bother me.in the slightest.if the blast is too much get another hobby.

[Chanonry]

They REALLY annoy the guy next to you.  

"The blast from a muzzle brake isn’t noticeable to the shooter" - not so sure about that one, maybe it depends on the brake ?

How about using a can? No annoyance and some recoil reduction. Not as effective as a brake granted, but still good IMO.

[No i deer]

Why go to a range where you have no noise limits and use silencer ??.if you want to test some ammo fair enough but any other reason I can't see the point of.i have both and use horses for coarses.i wish I could use a brake for f class open.my 7mm saum would be nearly recoiless but your not allowed too so ive got too get my fillings fixed firmly in place.

[Brillo]

Neil, check the rules for muzzle brakes at Bisley. You’ll find they are prohibited unless the RCO condones there use. If ant one person complains, no matter how far away, the brake MUST be removed.

They are categorically banned in F Class comps, so there’s no point in practicing with one.

[Roy W]

No, you just have to let the range office know you will be using one. We use them all the time at Bisley. They do state that they may add a surcharge for a lane between you and everyone else, if necessary, but to my knowledge it's never been charged.

I think your rules are either old, word of mouth or anecdotal

 

[Roy W]

From the NRA Bible

Appendix 17

Firers who wish to use Black Powder firearms or muzzle brakes, or who wish to shoot from a table or bench must inform the Range Office at the time of booking so that appropriate separation on the firing point is allocated. Any firer who does not give advance notice of such requirement may find that proximity of other firers prevents their desired activity

Nothing about RCO's choice or other people moaning

[bradders]

1 hour ago, Brillo said:

Neil, check the rules for muzzle brakes at Bisley. You’ll find they are prohibited unless the RCO condones there use. If ant one person complains, no matter how far away, the brake MUST be removed.

They are categorically banned in F Class comps, so there’s no point in practicing with one.

This is very wrong, Roy's reply is the correct one

[Rem Imperri]

+1 for Roy and Bradders answers here. 
The range office technically will leave a lane either side and charge a 50% surcharge for the privilege. As far as I'm aware it's often not charged if the range isn't full, but if you're trying to book the last lane at a distance (i.e. they can fit the spacing in) you may not be allowed to book the lane.
I've seen plenty of people on the range that haven't declared their breaks, and therefore are in adjacent lanes to other more sensitive (read:TR) shooters. Usually it's fine, but they could potentially kick up a fuss if they were so inclined. 

[Catch-22]

Brakes permitted at Rogiet Moor & Sennybridge MOD ranges too.

Brakes on big boomers are just fun!

[No i deer]

We in the LPSC try not to pee off the shooters in the next lanes.(muzzle blast whingers).if one of our members isnt using muzzle brake or are using a new mod for a COF are placed in outside lanes/lanes nearest too the next club to avoid any complaints.we try to be accommodating but there will always be a whinger around to spoil the fun.sooner or later they will ruin it for everybody including themselves.muzzle brakes are an excellent invention and really do help your shooting.i can see my bullet holes in the McQueens target after I've fired before the target is taken down from the window if I get my shot off early enough.3 second exposures.its a blast of gases that lasts a millisecond.all the blasts from 2000 shots being fired in our club over the period of the day wouldn't add up to many seconds of blast.

[SMLE]

Apologies for starting a row fellas.....! 

Still a little unsure if I’ve bought into the whole brake business if I’m honest. I think I’ll take a punt, buy one of the Dolphin brakes and see what happens.

Now... does any one know the thread size on a Howa 1500 Varmint barrel? I think it’s 5/8 x 24 unf, but I’m not sure! Oh, indecision!

[Andrew]

I don't know what your Howa is threaded for but I can recommend a brake for target use. I have a suppressor but after one time at our back country range ( 500to 1800 yd) I have reverted to a brake. Yes: It is loud. The pay backs are recoil mitigation, lack of heat mirage generated by even a covered suppressor, and lastly, having the firing line all to ones self! My RPR 308 with match loads will roar like a beast, and the brake will carve furrows into the ground with hot gasses, but it recoils like a .22 and remains brilliantly accurate.

 

I get my brakes from from "Muzzle Brakes and More". A silly name but brilliant brakes. I have a 5-port, self indexing brake coming for my 300 Winchester Magnum. I think it was $113 US.  That will make three of them so far. ~Andrew

[No i deer]

9 hours ago, SMLE said:

Apologies for starting a row fellas.....! 

Still a little unsure if I’ve bought into the whole brake business if I’m honest. I think I’ll take a punt, buy one of the Dolphin brakes and see what happens.

Now... does any one know the thread size on a Howa 1500 Varmint barrel? I think it’s 5/8 x 24 unf, but I’m not sure! Oh, indecision!

No arguements its just a something that's on going there has/is a few Whingers been stirring up trouble over the muzzle brakes at Bisley wanting a noise pollution type test carried out to try and ban muzzle brakes.how health and saftey has gone mad these days could see shooting get banned because it could damage you hearing.as I have all ready said a millisecond of noise per shot doesn't add up to many seconds in a days shooting.Mik will stock most sizes and thread what he hasn't.mine our 18/1m.works like a dream and looks great too.

I currently have 3

TE Terminator 

Roedale

Dolphin

All 18/1m.i can move around to suit my mood.all are muzzle blast unfriendly.

Guaranteed to find a whinger.

A simple option would be to have a sound brake type barrier that  3 feet high 8 feet long with sometime of sound blocking material attached either side or remove the whingers from the range ?

[bradders]

1 hour ago, No i deer said:

No arguements its just a something that's on going there has/is a few Whingers been stirring up trouble over the muzzle brakes at Bisley wanting a noise pollution type test carried out to try and ban muzzle brakes.how health and saftey has gone mad these days could see shooting get banned because it could damage you hearing.as I have all ready said a millisecond of noise per shot doesn't add up to many seconds in a days shooting.Mik will stock most sizes and thread what he hasn't.mine our 18/1m.works like a dream and looks great too.

I currently have 3

TE Terminator 

Roedale

Dolphin

All 18/1m.i can move around to suit my mood.all are muzzle blast unfriendly.

Guaranteed to find a whinger.

A simple option would be to have a sound brake type barrier that  3 feet high 8 feet long with sometime of sound blocking material attached either side or remove the whingers from the range ?

If you don't give a rats ass about your fellow shooters, then perhaps you should go and find somewhere other than Bisley and stop crapping on about whingers

I believe Rogiet Moor is closer to you....go there

[No i deer]

1 minute ago, bradders said:

If you don't give a rats ass about your fellow shooters, then perhaps you should go and find somewhere other than Bisley and stop crapping on about whingers

I believe Rogiet Moor is closer to you....go there

 

I do care Mark that's the thing....!

I would much prefer there wasn't any moaning and trouble making from the use of muzzle brakes.

Alot of the CSR shooters use muzzle brakes so this could affect your enjoyment too.

I certainly don't want or wont bicker with you over it.

Looking forward to next Sunday using my brakes at 600 and 1000yds ??

[bradders]

16 minutes ago, No i deer said:

 

I do care Mark that's the thing....!

I would much prefer there wasn't any moaning and trouble making from the use of muzzle brakes.

Alot of the CSR shooters use muzzle brakes so this could affect your enjoyment too.

I certainly don't want or wont bicker with you over it.

Looking forward to next Sunday using my brakes at 600 and 1000yds ??

We shoot one to a point with the recommended 1.4M separation as outlined in JSP 403. if you all want to bunch up and lane share then that's another thing. 

If I or one of us knows we are affecting others with brakes, we take steps to eliminate it, we don't call then whingers....only non NRA members like yourself are prone to doing that

 

I'm done here, don't reply

[No i deer]

?

No lane Sharing.

[Shuggy]

The health and safety aspect of brakes is worth a bit more discussion. My son is deaf, so I have a pretty good insight just how life-changing hearing loss can be. When he was diagnosed, they checked my hearing too. I was relieved to learn that after years of shooting, but being meticulous about hearing protection, I still had perfect hearing.

Not so long ago, I saw a comprehensive set of professionally done noise measurements for a wide range of firearms. The ‘at ear’ measurements for those with brakes was a bit of an eye opener. Suffice to say that when using a rifle with a brake, I now wear double hearing protection (earplugs plus muffs), or use a moderator instead.

Brakes are useful devices, but it is a good idea to fully protect your hearing. 

 

[No i deer]

Hearing protection is must.if I am.near a 50 cal I use ear plugs and ear defenders. 

A simple barrier with some kind of sound proofing material on both sides placed separating clubs would be easier than causing unnecessary complaints and arguments amongst ourselves ?

[Brillo]

21 hours ago, Roy W said:

No, you just have to let the range office know you will be using one. We use them all the time at Bisley. They do state that they may add a surcharge for a lane between you and everyone else, if necessary, but to my knowledge it's never been charged.

I think your rules are either old, word of mouth or anecdotal

 

It’s in the Bisley Rules 

[Brillo]

21 hours ago, bradders said:

This is very wrong, Roy's reply is the correct one

Doesn’t the last sentence of Appendix 17 convey exactly what I said?

And I’m not wrong about them being banned in F Class.

[Roy W]

Not really, you said :

Most MoD owned ranges do not permit their use, e.g. Bisley and Kingsbury   - which is wrong

You’ll find they are prohibited unless the RCO condones there use - Nothing to do with the RCO - It's whether you book it with the Range Office.

If ant one person complains, no matter how far away, the brake MUST be removed - Where does it say this?