Home Office FOI Request

[Chanonry]

After a bit of being grumpy about a post relating to the FCSA, I made a freedom of information request of the Home Office to get data on firearms offences. I tried to find it online but it was hard to track down. Turns out there is a pile of data available from ONS, I just could not find it.  I got a good response from the Home Office considering I asked for a breakdown of the data by all sorts of things mainly just to make sure I got what they had.

The data relates to England and Wales.

They also provided me with a bunch of historical data. If somebody wants the historical data PM me or look here. Its not 'published' yet, but will make its way there in due course.

However this link takes you to the best data in the form of a downloadable Excel spreadsheet detailing offences involving weapons. Lots of tables, data cut lots of different ways. Hours of endless fun.

A lot of the data supports the views we already have but at least the various organisations could use this to provide some evidence to support our arguments.

A taster:

Rifles

9600 offences involving 'firearms' in '2017'  

of which  61 involved rifles

fired 30 times

10 people injured including 1 fatality

So the only firearms action the govt is planning relates to rifles when there were 2685 handgun and 28 machine gun offences in 2017. Where do they think the terrorist is likely to look for his firepower? FCSA, let me know the answer you get.

Areas of risk:  

1. London   2. West Midlands   3. Northamptonshire (?!)

Age groups of victims:

10-19: 20%   20-29: 30%   30-39:20%

 

[Webby]

Trouble is that I believe a Air rifle is classed as a firearm. So the data is hard to interpret for us as well as them!

 

[Chanonry]

55 minutes ago, Webby said:

Trouble is that I believe a Air rifle is classed as a firearm. So the data is hard to interpret for us as well as them!

 

Nope, try reading the data. Then make statements. That's why I got it, so we can talk less p*sh

There were 1,406 offences with BB/Airgun between April 2016/March 2017, they were fired 85% of the time, used as a blunt instrument 1% of the time and as a thread 15% of the time. I know that is 101%.

[Webby]

OK apologies. Sure I read something a while back that put them together. However yr spreadsheet has way more data.

Having written to my mp the reply that I got back was not very encouraging to say the least.

[Webby]

Having looked through that I am going to be writing again and would suggest that others do as well!

Suggest table 7 as a good place to see how crazy this is!

[brown dog]

Table 7 is a jaw-dropper.  Only 61 rifle offences in a year against 2685 handgun.

A pity it doesn't break out 'legally' vs 'illegally' held.

[1066]

Interesting to see, in Table 2, how few offences by re-activated handguns there are; less than 30 in the last 12 years or so. Also can't find any mention of offences with antique or obsolete calibres.

[VarmLR]

It's the same old.  Stats won't or don't or can't break down illegally held firearms V's legally held firearms in the offences committed category so we have no idea whether legal gun ownership offences total 61 or zero.  My money would be on a small minority of cases.  The only thing we can say for sure is that the government seem hell bent making legal firearm ownership more difficult and prohibitive, yet doing nothing about targeting illegally held firearms including possible channels of acquisition.  This, yet their actions have no effect on the growing gun crime afflicting urban centre gangs, drug dealings and robberies.  The stats will continue to rise unless some more drastic action is taken, and not at the expense of legitimate gun owners.

[les]

I've long held the belief that our obsession with setting sentences of "Up to XYZ years" needs to be addressed. It seems like it's always the lower end of the scale that gets used, regardless of the crime committed. The judicial system is long overdue for a change, methinks.

[CliveWard]

On 6/20/2018 at 11:09 AM, brown dog said:

Table 7 is a jaw-dropper.  Only 61 rifle offences in a year against 2685 handgun.

A pity it doesn't break out 'legally' vs 'illegally' held.

It does highlight the sheer nonsense of the proposed legislation. Based on the statistics and assuming all crime is with legally held rifles, then once drilled down into the narrow type of .50, MARS / Lever Release then the millions chucked down the pan pushing this through will save one life every few thousand years!

If you look back at the statistics, that one single rifle murder was a blip, the baseline is actually zero deaths.

Utter madness, especially when you consider that around 5,000 lives are lost every year due to poor cleaning and hand washing in our hospitals.

 

Cheers

 

 

Clive

[Chanonry]

Yes that was the obvious argument to me.

It's all very well grandstanding by passing laws that deal with theoretical risks, nice politics, but how about doing something to defend the populace by tacking a problem that really exists and has meaningful consequences i.e. the handgun offences. There is already legislation in place that does not seem to be protecting the population so what are they going to do about that rather than attacking law abiding citizens, and if that law does not work (demonstrably) why should they bother with another one that they presumably will not bother to enforce either.

Now the data is out there (it always was just hard to find) why are the FSCA, BASC, NRA etc not upping the ante and attacking the Home Offices performance and strategy? F*cking useless bunch of old bufton tuftons that's why. 

[VarmLR]

Whatever one thinks about our shooting organisations and "what they do to promote our sport"...I think that, objectively speaking, they have proved singularly ineffective in recent years in protecting our interests which is why I relinquished my memberships last year.  I have zero faith in most shooting organisations Chanonry.  Few shooters dare utter criticism though for fear of being accused of unfair or destructive criticism, to BASC in particular.  Well, they've had my money for the past number of years but they won't be receiving a penny now or in the future from me and I feel justified and happy in offering some criticism. The way that they have conducted themselves in recent years show-cases what a closed shop they have become and in a few cases, how shockingly corrupted from within at a high level.  All this whilst doing sweet FA about issues that matter, yet making excuse after excuse about their political engagement processes (which again, have proved wholly ineffective).  'Nuff said.

The hand-gun stats are truly shocking yet prove beyond all reasonable doubt that Government firearms policy changes have failed, yet they continue to tighten the noose around legal firearms ownership.  Many MPs, including my own, seem to take the view that moaning about government policy propositions is somehow politically inexpedient as the ill educated populace view is that firearms ownership is being seen more and more as politically and socially unacceptable.  I try and do my bit when talking to people about the subject to bring them round by offering education when they argue the matter. A friend who several years ago expressed the common attitude (and unfortunately, this is a common attitude) that I had no real "right" to own things that were potentially lethal for the sake of sports.

Well, it may have taken a few years but that person has not just come round, but I have engaged them to the extent that they took up air rifle shooting and archery (they were interested initially in my long-bows from a historical bent and the odd trophy hanging about from my national shooting days...some years back I hasten to add!) and encouraged their kids into it last year.  It's not impossible at all to change public perception, but we have to do our bit too rather than be the closed shop ourselves.