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It’s not a “downer” and I still can’t see why when anyone questions anything in here, even in jest it is always seen and taken as being negative!

while the group is great, when looking at the other groups they aren’t that spectacular, given the equipment and ability

I mean I see a 1.96, a 3.25, a .282, a 2.18 and a 3.26 but let’s focus on the best one and discard the others for the sake of internet small group bragging, coz that’s what group shooters always do, right?

take the other 4 groups and the average is 2.66, add the wunder group and that comes down to 2.18

if you fire enough shots in your life, at some time or other all the planets will align and even a blind dog will find the ball ?

Do  that 5 times in a row then call it a world record

even in land speed attempts the result is an average of a run each way ?

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22 minutes ago, bradders said:

Even in land speed attempts the result is an average of a run each way ?

Ya, but the same isn't true of a race, or just about any other competitive endeavour: I don't think Bannister ran sub 4 minute on every outing; just the once. And we still talk about it.?

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1 hour ago, bradders said:

It’s not a “downer” and I still can’t see why when anyone questions anything in here, even in jest it is always seen and taken as being negative!

while the group is great, when looking at the other groups they aren’t that spectacular, given the equipment and ability

I mean I see a 1.96, a 3.25, a .282, a 2.18 and a 3.26 but let’s focus on the best one and discard the others for the sake of internet small group bragging, coz that’s what group shooters always do, right?

take the other 4 groups and the average is 2.66, add the wunder group and that comes down to 2.18

if you fire enough shots in your life, at some time or other all the planets will align and even a blind dog will find the ball ?

Do  that 5 times in a row then call it a world record

even in land speed attempts the result is an average of a run each way ?

Ok then Bradders, if its all so "easy, simple, boring etc" then June 17th at Diggle 1000 yard benchrest, why dont you come and show us all how to do it......

I'm sure someone will lend you a gun, rest etc and even load you the ammo if you want.......

I dont criticise other disiplines, especially when I've never even tried them, so here is a chance for you to give it a go.....

Hell, I'll even pay the comp entry fee for you.

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It was a very special group that probaly will never be beaten.from my reading/learning and seeing ukbra results his overall score did average out at scores that are matched by UK shooters.

Darrel Evans had a stunning average recently to break the UK 600yds record. 

His best group was just over 1 inch at 600yds.

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UKBRA will be at the Northern Shooting Show, with some of our kit for anyone that wants to come and have a look at it in the flesh

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Whatever anyones view, its a really superb group.

 

 

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I also think fantastic result. I don't think it is hard to understand that one is shooting a group and not a specific spot on a target. The way to go if one wants to see the potential of a rifle/load/scope/man on that day.

Some on forums want statistic sample sizes so large the barrel is shot out before one has proven accuracy or group size. One has to be realistic.

edi

 

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We are all shooters of many and different disciplines and I have shot F class and benchrest over many years and enjoy them.   Each to their own and it is sometimes fun to have a little poke at disciplines that we do not shoot.   But let's keep it friendly folks and anyone who pokes too hard to try and get another member to bite should be told under no uncertain terms to jam doughnut off and do one (in the best possible taste of course!).    Good shooting to all even if you do shoot CSR/F class/Benchrest/Black Powder/Cowboy stuff.

Cheers,  Les

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I've never shot benchrest and never seen it shot so this may be a stupid question but......

If the gun is strapped to a bench that can't move which is how it looks in pictures then surely tiny groups are inevitable if the wind conditions stay stable for a couple of minutes. Regardless of shooter input.

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The gun isnt "strapped" to the bench, it sits on a rest, but it still recoils, can be nudged etc and be pulled due to poor gun handling.

The shooter has to read the wind and decide when to shoot, how fast etc, so there are a number of factors that make a group good or bad.

It certainly isnt as easy as just bang bang bang, the wind will probably NOT stay constant in terms of direction or speed throughout the string and possibly at longer ranges 600 and 1000 yards, it wont even be constant in terms of direction down the whole distance of the range.

So you have to look at many flags/indicators to make sure you get the true picture and replicate it for the required number of shots/groups.......

Ohh and have a rifle that tracks in the bags and has an appropriate load developed.

Hope this helps

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Mole, hope to make it over to the show this weekend, would like to see the gear.

No such a thing as an easy competition. Can't be easy for everyone.

edi

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18 hours ago, The Gun Pimp said:

 

I think you should come and try our Egg Shoot badger - it's a bit nearer - 500 yds - and show us some real skill.

We clearly stated that we couldn't do better, and tried to make it clear that we weren't denigrating the shooter. We merely observed that there was still scope to gild that particular lily. 

A problem with t'interweb is that it doesn't convey a wry smile very well, even when we adds of them ikkle emoticon thingies to our post.

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1 hour ago, ejg223 said:

Mole, hope to make it over to the show this weekend, would like to see the gear.

No such a thing as an easy competition. Can't be easy for everyone.

edi

Me 2

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14 hours ago, brown dog said:

If people are seeing an element of luck to Sauter's achievement... well, Sauter seems to have a multi-year track record of being repeatedly lucky, then! :D

That reminds me of the US golfer Jerry Barber, who was once told that he was really lucky. His response: “The harder I practice, the luckier I get.”

 

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9 hours ago, Shuggy said:

That reminds me of the US golfer Jerry Barber, who was once told that he was really lucky. His response: “The harder I practice, the luckier I get.”

 

Yup!  :)

This thread has reminded me of the first book I bought way back to begin to learn about the precision-end of riflery.

Benchrest is at the head of the precision rifle river:

20180509_175806.thumb.jpg.4cb8a4b6ff6da3f4a077d1fe0a643a59.jpg

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Same here Brown Dog.  Still got my copy.   When I first read it over 20 years ago now I  just got hooked in trying all of Glenn's tips and got into benchrest comps at Diggle.  While watching the likes of Vince Bottomley, Willie Dixon and others in the early 1990s I gained further knowledge and realised that up to that point my reloading was in the dark ages.

So I soon realised that benchrest shooters were onto something using equipment and their brass preparation which was not really commonplace at that time, but through time,  books like Glenn's and the internet, it is now.

 

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Just found an old photo of my smallest 5 shot group shot at 1000 yards at Diggle and it's pretty accurate and well centered.  So it goes to show that we benchrest shooters can get precision and accuracy at the same time.  Not always of course being subject to Diggle winds.  

The V bull ring is 5 inches in diameter so I think the group was 3 inches and something! 

I shot it with my new (at the time) Tooley MBR/Kreiger barrel/BAT M action in 6.5 x 55 Ackley Improved using a 139 gr Lapua bullet/Lapua brass neck turned.   To make my day,  the guy who built the rifle for me (Dave Tooley from the USA) was present and also shooting.   So was well pleased with the overall results as I won the competition.     Since then I have gone downhill and have had my moment in the limelight,  now I just shoot for the fun and also a beer and curry weekend.   What's not to like eh?

 

Best group to date at 1000yds.JPG

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16 hours ago, meles meles said:

We clearly stated that we couldn't do better, and tried to make it clear that we weren't denigrating the shooter. We merely observed that there was still scope to gild that particular lily. 

A problem with t'interweb is that it doesn't convey a wry smile very well, even when we adds of them ikkle emoticon thingies to our post.

Badger - I love a good p*ss take - you have to if you shoot at Diggle - it's a way of life!   But, maybe it's a fine line between taking the p*ss and sarcasm. 

To be honest, I don't mind sarcasm but, I hate it when shooters knock other shooters' disciplines.  We do it for fun, it's not life and death.

Unfortunately, there are one or two forum members who contribute little else.

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30 minutes ago, Breacher said:

[Quoted post deleted]

FFS!    Can't we just enjoy our relevant disciplines without making comments as above!   I think this subject should be locked as it is getting childish and it is now sinking to a level that our enemies would love to see -  dissension within our ranks.   If you disagree with me then please keep it to yourselves as I have lost interest.   Good shooting to all disciplines. 

 

PS.   It was Vince Bottomley a benchrest shooter who I first heard utter the comment of  'it blows them in as well as out'

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I am.not surprised you won the comp with a group like that.?

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23 hours ago, mole-e30 said:

The gun isnt "strapped" to the bench, it sits on a rest, but it still recoils, can be nudged etc and be pulled due to poor gun handling.

...

Hope this helps

 

23 hours ago, mole-e30 said:

 

Ah, that where I've misunderstood then. I was assuming benchrest was the same as those rail gun things.

I might give it a go.

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59 minutes ago, meles meles said:

Gun Pimp: we'd love to shoot at Diggle ! It could be bad for your health though: you might die laughing at our groups !

Badger - thank God - I passed a dead badger driving up to the range today - thought it might be you.

Laugh at your groups?  Never - I'm just happy when someone turns up and shoots in a comp.

The egg shoot is just around the corner...........

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