Pup just won't sleep in her crate at night????

[chaz]

So we've had our Bedlington Whippet for 8 nights now. Shes as you would expect any pup to be in the day. Lots of racing round, with just as many sleeps in between. We've bought a plastic moulded bed and lined it with fleece bedding and plenty of toys to chew. She's happy to sleep in it during the day outside her large sleeping crate, but will not sleep in it during the day if it's in the crate. Secondly, 8 nights in a row shes been in her bed in the crate. And every night she has yelped and cried almost all night! She only stops for half hour here and there. I presume as shes shattered and has a nap. I thought she would be over it now, but shes been consistently bad through-out. We put a heavy crock bowl in there with a little water for the night, and have tried leaving the toys in and taking them out. All have made no difference. The only thing we do now is take her out once in the middle of the night for a wee and poo. This was due to her stepping in it and covering everything in crap! And to be fair, when let out at night, she'll wee and poo almost on command! She comes out fine in the night, and does a wee and poo, and is happy to go back in. But hates being locked in. The last thing I've tried is having a small radio on throughout the night. Which has made very little difference. I'm running out of ideas! The wife and i are shattered! So any constructive advice would be much appreciated.

Cheers

Chaz.

[Big Al]

Lock the dog in the crate with no water overnight and place the crate out of earshot, if you can't do that get some ear plugs.

Puppies can usually go all night without needing to pee or poo if you get the last feed right and control the water during the last few hours before bedtime, she will get used to things fairly quickly, Ive never had a pup that didn't. Im a huge dog lover, love my own dogs and new pups dearly but if you start pandering to the pup you will make a rod for your back.

Pups even at 8 weeks old are clever enough to train you as quickly as you are trying to train them.

[Delwint]

Exactly what big Al said, don’t go down. It will soon get the message and quieten down. If you continue you’ll make a rod for your own back ??

[Roy W]

We had a similar issue with a Lab Cross. We listened to all the expert advice, endured it for weeks, still no respite or sleep. Took the pup into our room (against every piece of advice from experts, or online/books/wives tales) , straight away the pup slept right through the night, no issues, within a week she was downstairs, alone, sleeping through. She was scared, in a new place, frightened.

Despite all the warnings about making a rod etc, and I am not saying they are wrong, because all dogs are different, it worked for us, gave us sleep, and settled the pup in much quicker than trying the 'traditional' route.

Your pup, your call.

 

 

[bri2506]

Sounds strange but heard that putting a clock that ticks on the cage works. I know it's worked for a friend. Like an old alarm clock 

[Bigkev1]

Old clock worked for me but had a blanket with mothers scent wrapped around it 

[chaz]

Mm. Mixed opinions. Granted, my dog my call. It bothers the wife more than me. I just use my spare shooting ear plugs. Although i spoke to a puppy trainer today, who agreed with you Roy W, almost to the letter! I've also been told about the ticking clock. I think i'll keep on as i am for maybe around another 5 days or so, and see how she gets on. I pee'd off with myself for forgetting a bit of bedding with the mothers scent on....

Just read your post BigKev1, I think the mothers scent would have worked well.

At least my current dog gets on well with the pup now. It's like having 2 pups sometimes now. Both screaming round the place chasing each other!

EDIT - Infact, at the moment my Mrs has our Spaniel X sleep upstairs as she was worried the pup was stressing her out with all the yelping. I wonder if moving the Spaniel X back down stares may calm the pup down a bit? Any thoughts on that folks??

[baldie]

I think you've answered your own question.

I would say the pup firstly missed her litter, as they all do.

Now she has a new pal, who mysteriously disappears when its bedtime.

Put the spaniel in with her.

[grougar]

As above, ive always put new pups in with older dog or dogs, but in a crate to begin with so she doesnt annoy the older dogs, never had a peep out of them and they soon dont need the crate.

[chaz]

Just sorted it with the Mrs, so they'll be in the same room tonight. Prob make no difference, but as she likes to sleep on me in the day during naps, i'll put my T-shirt in her crate to.

I'll see what tonight brings...

Cheers folks! 

Chaz.

[oak tree]

Clocks and hot water bottles work(not rubber ones in case the chew them).  After a few nights they will get used to the new surroundings and routine.  I think people have to be careful that the dog doesnt train them.  For example if the dog makes a noise to get out and get attention and you do what it wants then in a short space of time its trained you!

[Furyan]

I  normally put a radio on low playing what ever music or someone talking broccoli that has worked for me , I know George Newcombe used to hang sprout stalks up for them to be occupied , never tried it myself the radio seamed to work for me.

sleep tight 

[Roy W]

What Baldie Dave said, stick her in with the Spaniel, they'll be cuddled up asleep before you know it!

 

 

[duey]

I would leave the bed in the crate at all times and not just at night 

the pup will soon get used to going there for its daytime naps in its own little sanctuary, then going to bed at night will become less of an issue 

dont use the crate as a place of punishment either 

if the pup doesn't harass the older dog too much then settling them down together will also help 

in the past I have also covered the cage with a blanket to make it cave like and that has worked well 

as others have said perseverance is the key 

[17 Rem]

On 05/02/2018 at 9:24 PM, chaz said:

 as she likes to sleep on me in the day during naps

You are reaping what you’ve sown.

[chaz]

I take on board all you folks are saying, and agree with it. But before i answer specifics, I'd like to get some replies on opinions as to allowing her to move into a dog pen which has a lot more room, (as in 3 times as much, and has no roof, so she has plenty of clear sight out over and through the pen. I'd appreciate some constructive thoughts please. Just to add, she is only tiny and around 5-6 lbs. The crate is 3' long by 2 ' wide, and 2 ' high. Big enough for her basket, water bowl with only half inch in. And has roughly 2'x2' free room outside her basket to move about in the crate. Is the crate big enough?

Thanks folks.

Chaz. 

[Blue Haze]

My now 5 month old pup has a crate (2'x3', like yours) which is inside a 'puppy pen' of 3 ft x 9 ft. 

He has only ever been shut in the crate for 30 mins at a time if we need to contain him - but he is fine if you do. 

It stays in there 100% of the time and he see's it as his space/home. It also allows you to put a puppy pad on the floor at the opposite side of the pen for accidents. Mine was 13-14 weeks before being able to manage the night without a toilet mistake consistently.

Also make sure that even if your pup starts to have a wee inside by mistake, pick him up immediately and put him outside and say 'toilet' or whatever your chosen command is. Also reward heavily any time he goes outside by chance. 

Make sure he does not see the pen as a punishment area. I made an effort to sit in it with him and play with a toy or stroke him regularly. It is used as a 'time out' space if over excited, but we will never shout at him then put him in. It needs to be his 'happy place'.

 

[gunner]

Is the pup cold in the night ? As , most turn heating off at night . But even bigger older dogs i like to be warm enough thru the night . A friend had this and tried s small heater in the utility - it worked . Pup was Happy . No more crying . Come to think of it i see alot of people walking dogs in freezing weather without a winter coat , but the owner has hat and gloves . Really buggs me . Sorry gone off topic - ill get me "coat" 

[chaz]

We're on the 14-15th night with no change yet.  Plenty warm enough with heating on. Plenty to drink.Tried light on low, light off. Radio low, radio off. I think she may be missing her mum and siblings. The wife slept on the sofa with her last night. Never seen such a happy pup in the morning, (Or such a grumpy wife!!). And not a sound out of the pup all night. She held her bladder and bowels until morning. Although rod and back springs to mind....

[Nick 53]

I had to put my coat in the cage, cover the cage with blanket on odd nights he came into our room with cage till he settled. Was not easy 

[Big Al]

10 hours ago, chaz said:

We're on the 14-15th night with no change yet.  Plenty warm enough with heating on. Plenty to drink.Tried light on low, light off. Radio low, radio off. I think she may be missing her mum and siblings. The wife slept on the sofa with her last night. Never seen such a happy pup in the morning, (Or such a grumpy wife!!). And not a sound out of the pup all night. She held her bladder and bowels until morning. Although rod and back springs to mind....

This little pup is making a better job of training you than you are of training her Im afraid, this isn't a good situation for either of you going forward. Remember all dogs are different and some can work out how to train their owners much easier than others, its not a breed thing just an individual dog thing.

You have a simple problem that all of us have with new pups. You are making it complicated by allowing yours or your wife emotions to complicate things. The pup doesn't like sleeping without you guys around, you already gave it a very secure bed to sleep on during the day, the only problem by your own admission was its your lap! I appreciate your humanity and care for the pup, most of us feel that way but its our responsibility to tough it out for the good of everyone in the long run. If you let the pup sleep with the spaniel she will eventually make do with the spaniel as her replacement for you and they will cuddle up together. If the pup continually irritates the spaniel by whining Im sure there will be a canine discussion at some point and providing your spaniel isn't an overly aggressive sort it will just establish the pecking order and the pup will learn some ground rules.

Every pup Ive ever had went through what yours is going through, most stop howling after 2-3 nights, some have gone a week or more but all without exception stop at some point providing you dont pander to them in any way, they come to realise that bedtime is bedtime for everyone and making a noise doesn't change that.

The pup is warm, fed and watered, it wont die while you go to sleep for 8hrs. As I said to you 10 days ago, either put the pup out of earshot or buy yourself some good earplugs then you get to sleep fine and the pup will soon get tired of whining.

Sorry if this sounds hard but your asking for help then ignoring it.

[chaz]

10 hours ago, Big Al said:

This little pup is making a better job of training you than you are of training her Im afraid, this isn't a good situation for either of you going forward. Remember all dogs are different and some can work out how to train their owners much easier than others, its not a breed thing just an individual dog thing.

You have a simple problem that all of us have with new pups. You are making it complicated by allowing yours or your wife emotions to complicate things. The pup doesn't like sleeping without you guys around, you already gave it a very secure bed to sleep on during the day, the only problem by your own admission was its your lap! I appreciate your humanity and care for the pup, most of us feel that way but its our responsibility to tough it out for the good of everyone in the long run. If you let the pup sleep with the spaniel she will eventually make do with the spaniel as her replacement for you and they will cuddle up together. If the pup continually irritates the spaniel by whining Im sure there will be a canine discussion at some point and providing your spaniel isn't an overly aggressive sort it will just establish the pecking order and the pup will learn some ground rules.

Every pup Ive ever had went through what yours is going through, most stop howling after 2-3 nights, some have gone a week or more but all without exception stop at some point providing you dont pander to them in any way, they come to realise that bedtime is bedtime for everyone and making a noise doesn't change that.

The pup is warm, fed and watered, it wont die while you go to sleep for 8hrs. As I said to you 10 days ago, either put the pup out of earshot or buy yourself some good earplugs then you get to sleep fine and the pup will soon get tired of whining.

Sorry if this sounds hard but your asking for help then ignoring it.

I can't argue Al. I wanted to put the pup in the study so i/we couldn't hear it. The wife wouldn't have it. So i told her it's the Study or she sleeps down stairs with the pup. Probably not the right thing to say, but i was pi55ed off after 2 weeks of little sleep. But it kind of backfired, as she refused to agree to put her out of earshot in the study, and she's currently on the sofa with the pup. Who (not to my surprise) now sleeps a straight 8-9 hours without a toilet break!! I'm deflated about the whole thing. I'm disabled to a degree, and look after Poppy (Pup) from 8 am until 8 pm. Which i don't mind. No pup will ever be easy work. But i'm strong willed, even with poppy. Yet the Mrs isn't, which has led to this position.... I'm waiting until the wife has enough, and Poppy goes in the study. A bit of 'watch this space'. But i can't argue with your thoughts, and appreciate your honest, yet respectful and constructive criticism. 

EDIT - Just to add, I have some Howard Leight Ear Plugs, which serve me a treat! I rarely heard anything. It's more not being able to withstand the unrelenting earache from the wife at dinner time.... Which, joke aside, we can all relate to....

One thing i do love is the way both my Spaniel X and Poppy get on now. It's a joy to watch!

Cheers

Chaz

 

[Big Al]

1 hour ago, chaz said:

I can't argue Al. I wanted to put the pup in the study so i/we couldn't hear it. The wife wouldn't have it. So i told her it's the Study or she sleeps down stairs with the pup. Probably not the right thing to say, but i was pi55ed off after 2 weeks of little sleep. But it kind of backfired, as she refused to agree to put her out of earshot in the study, and she's currently on the sofa with the pup. Who (not to my surprise) now sleeps a straight 8-9 hours without a toilet break!! I'm deflated about the whole thing. I'm disabled to a degree, and look after Poppy (Pup) from 8 am until 8 pm. Which i don't mind. No pup will ever be easy work. But i'm strong willed, even with poppy. Yet the Mrs isn't, which has led to this position.... I'm waiting until the wife has enough, and Poppy goes in the study. A bit of 'watch this space'. But i can't argue with your thoughts, and appreciate your honest, yet respectful and constructive criticism. 

EDIT - Just to add, I have some Howard Leight Ear Plugs, which serve me a treat! I rarely heard anything. It's more not being able to withstand the unrelenting earache from the wife at dinner time.... Which, joke aside, we can all relate to....

One thing i do love is the way both my Spaniel X and Poppy get on now. It's a joy to watch!

Cheers

Chaz

 

Put the ear plugs in at dinner time as well as bedtime Chaz and enjoy the rest of the time with the pup. I love new pups in the house, its a great time watching them grow and fit in with the rest of the pack 

[chaz]

28 minutes ago, Big Al said:

Put the ear plugs in at dinner time as well as bedtime Chaz and enjoy the rest of the time with the pup. I love new pups in the house, its a great time watching them grow and fit in with the rest of the pack 

You know, i hadn't thought of that! 

But you're right. The house feels like it's had a burst of life since the new pup arrived. Had her second jab today. Just like the first, never blinked. It makes me laugh when she gets shirty when she wants to play with our 4 year old Spaniel X, when she's lounging on the sofa. The pup can't get on there yet, and it really gets her riled up. She keeps yelping at the X to play, with her feet just touching the edge of the seat of the sofa and her tail spinning like a planes prop!  Eventually our Spaniel X cross gives in, jumps off the sofa and all hell breaks loose! It's an absolute bliss to watch! The X must be five times our Bedy's weight, but the pup just won't give in. You were right about letting them sort out the hiarachy themselves. The atmospheres great between them now. Like sisters. If the pup crosses the line, the X snarls loudly, which causes the pup to go submissive. Before throwing herself on her back exposing her underside and she starts frantically licking licking lips. 10 seconds later it's play as usual. It's a pleasure to watch!

Cheers

Chaz. 

Chaz.