6.5 bullet for target and long range vermin.

[David will]

I am awaiting delivery of a 6.5 creedmoor and hope to stock up on reloading components at the British shooting show in a few weeks time.

Can anyone recommend a 6.5 target bullet in the 120 140ih range that fragments for use on fox rabbit etc, I would have normmaly gone for Amax but I believe that they may be hard to find in the near future.

[VarmLR]

130gr Sierra TMK would be a great choice David, and Hornady 140gr SST also worth consideration.  I use this one in mine and have been using TMKs to great effect in my .223 for vermin control and target.  The SST is considerably cheaper than its target sibling, the ELD.  Lighter and zippier choice would be the 129gr SST.

[David will]

Thanks for that Varm. I have not used theTMK before so I will give them a try, the SSTs I have used in 6mm and 7mm, the 6mm were acurate and not a bad bullet for Roe but found that pass through with little expansion was the norm on foxes,they did the job but you had longer expiry  times. As far as I can remember I have only shot one fox with the 7mm while out stalking and it was instant lights out, mustard on deer and keyholed most shots at 100yrds from my little Heym.

[VarmLR]

TMKs would be a better foxing bullet I think as you'll not get any pass through using those.  They've dropped everything I've ever shot with them but do make a bit of a mess thanks to the large ballistic tip column (larger diameter than the SST or V-Max) which tends to fragment the round very effectively.  Your other option is of course the 95gr V-max.  They have a lower ballistic coefficient but to 400 yards target would be fine.

[Big Al]

If you can get 130TMKs to shoot well/consistently please let me know, I dont know anyone who has so far and a few good shooters/load developers that I know have tried without success. 

[VarmLR]

Interesting !l.  I've only tried them in .223 aand in .308 and they shoot well in both those calibres producing very tight groups, but admit that I haven't tried them in 6.5mm.  As a varminting bullet the Vmax would seem to be the sensible choice in that cal.  Nosler Accubonds might be worth a should too as they're said to reliably expand across a wide range of velocities.

[stephentri]

Anyone know if the Eld-m  expand as well as the A max on vermin

[Chanonry]

works on roe apparently...

[David will]

Hi chaps. Thanks for taking the time to reply to my querie. The reason I ask is the range rule is no expanding bullets so I would like to use one target classed bullet for range work that also fragments so suitable for use  on vermin as some bullets do ie Amax. Vmax as we know is classed as expanding for humain use on live targets so not allowed, why I really don't know. It is so much more simple to work only one drop,wind chart and hence the plea for help. 

[rhhudson]

From what I hear the eld-m are just as explosive as the amax were. 

I feel your pain hence I stocked up on 123g amax before they stopped doing them.

 

[VarmLR]

1 hour ago, David will said:

Hi chaps. Thanks for taking the time to reply to my querie. The reason I ask is the range rule is no expanding bullets so I would like to use one target classed bullet for range work that also fragments so suitable for use  on vermin as some bullets do ie Amax. Vmax as we know is classed as expanding for humain use on live targets so not allowed, why I really don't know. It is so much more simple to work only one drop,wind chart and hence the plea for help. 

It can be a harder task though with some cals than you might think, as you've discovered due to availability etc.  Have you considered investing in  a good ballistic app like Strelock Pro and biting the bullet so to speak (sorry, couldn't resist) by shooting dedicated bullets for each task and simply calibrating Strelock with your load dev outputs?  Either way you end up having to compensate for elevation and wind drift and carrying the app or a couple of range cards is no great shakes.  I have about 4 or 5 range cards laminated for different bullets as a back up in case or problems with my phone/app.

[swatty]

1 hour ago, rhhudson said:

From what I hear the eld-m are just as explosive as the amax were. 

I feel your pain hence I stocked up on 123g amax before they stopped doing them.

 

As did I but if you ever change your mind and decide to swap bullets let me know I’ll buy all your amax

[David will]

That may be an option but I would prefer one good Un for both. I see where you are coming from but I am from Aberdeenshire and we have a reputation of being shall we say a little reluctant to part with the green stuff to uphold and as load development can run off with excessive funds ! On a more serious note with a box of bullets in the £45 - £60 mark putting as few as posable down range to crono, develop a load, and verify your balistic ap. And then you are left with half used boxes of bullets that collect dust or I certainly do. 

 

 

[VarmLR]

Load development can often be cheaper than buying various boxes of factory at £25/box only to find they don't get on in your rifle.  My last load dev' used up about 40 bullets loaded at an all in cost of 71p/round = £28.40.  I would say that was cheaper than buying a few different boxes of factory and I'm left with a load that I know will group into sub half inch (repeatable as I usually take my load and then shoot several strings to verify MV/ES and tune accordingly either side of load if needs be).  You need to chrono strings of 10 at least in order to get any meaningful data though, especially wrt ES if you want reliable outputs otherwise it can be misleading and a bit of a waste.  I think that even if you need use 100 bullets up for things like app verification, it's money well spent in the long run especially if long range shooting is the end game.  In fact, I can't see any real shortcut if precision long range shooting is to be a reality.  All imho/IME of course.

[Laurie]

On 2/3/2018 at 6:51 PM, Big Al said:

If you can get 130TMKs to shoot well/consistently please let me know, I dont know anyone who has so far and a few good shooters/load developers that I know have tried without success. 

 

That's interesting Alan. I've found its 7mm big brother (160gn TMK) very easy to tune in a 7mm-08 F-Class rig. Comparing the two, the 130 6.5 seems to be virtually a scaled-down version of the 7mm offering.

I bought a couple of hundred 6.5 130s a while back - but haven't had a 6.5 rifle to use them or anything else in for a year or so - but have a 260 currently being rebarrelled in long-freebore form, so will be able to try them later this year.

There are a number of 'interesting' new 6.5s around. I loaded up a few 130gn Berger AR-Hybrids in 6.5 Creedmoor a while back with some promising initial results, but had to curtail that when Edgar  Brothers asked for its loaner Savage LRP back. This model might be a game-changer for a lot of magazine using 6.5 shooters, but is very expensive, and not much use in the 'varminter' role I imagine. I'll report on that one too.

[Panda]

On 03/02/2018 at 6:51 PM, Big Al said:

If you can get 130TMKs to shoot well/consistently please let me know, I dont know anyone who has so far and a few good shooters/load developers that I know have tried without success. 

Nooo..... didn't want to hear that Alan. My Remy barrel is about shot out and I'm thinking a 6.5 of some sort to replace the .308. I was intending to use a 130gn but as Laurie said, the Berger 130gn AR Hybrids are expensive so the TMKs looked a good option. Guess I'll have to think again.

[raizor]

Not known for a super duper accurate rifle but i have added a picture of load development in my 264 winmag and the 130 TMKs!!!

I am curently settled on a load giving the same great accuracy but running at 3300fps!!

Oh yes they expand quite nicely thankyou!!!

( 5 shot groups )

[Big Al]

On 05/02/2018 at 1:56 PM, Laurie said:

That's interesting Alan. I've found its 7mm big brother (160gn TMK) very easy to tune in a 7mm-08 F-Class rig. Comparing the two, the 130 6.5 seems to be virtually a scaled-down version of the 7mm offering.

The 69gr and 77gr TMKs have proven to be great long range vermin rounds, accurate and very explosive at long range even from a 223 case, Ive also heard from a customer who shot the 175TMK very well from a 308 Krieger barrel I put on his rifle out to 1000yds. 

It seems that they are generally good bullets but the 95gr 6mm and 130gr 6.5mm seem to let the team down, to the extent even an email with Sierra didn't see their bullet tech coming up with any solutions. Ive had feedback from a more than one very competent shooters/reloader that they couldn't get either of the two I mention to shoot repeatably. They would get a good group and then the next ones would not hold together, the pattern of inconsistency was over more than one barrel, load and shooter.

Of course what constitiutes good accuracy and consistency can vary from shooter to shooter, Im sure they are useable at sensible distances but if Im pulling the trigger on small live quarry at over 500yds I want to know where my bullet is going.

[VarmLR]

I've load developed and shot the 69, 77 and 175 TMKs.  All shoot well.  I was a little disappointed with the 69 at 600 yards and the 77 did much better.  Like the V-max, the harder you push them, the better they seem to perform though so a 100fps more from the 69 might have been beneficial.  I did however find load development a right chore with thr 69 and it took a long time and a lot of patience to find a load and seating that it liked.  Unlike the 77 which I found worked well close to the lands, the 69 required a heck of a lot of jump in my rifle, about 120 thou!

I've shot the 175 in .308 at close on 1000 yards and it performed well,  shooting similar groups to the 190 SMKs which I previously shot at longer range.  

The 69 and 77 are indeed very explosive on quarry and no vermin shot takes another step.  In the case of any feathered vermin, they have nothing left with which to take a step.  The only bullet I've used when shooting squirrel where I was left bemused first time using them after hitting one at 70 or 80 yards when I saw no trace of it after taking the shot.  Investigating further, I found little bits of it hanging off a nearby fence and a little red mist on the ground.  They add a whole new meaning to "explosive"!  Not recommended for anything you want to eat.